I don't find it hard. It's easy for me to tell them they suck at designing these things.
"Choose Your Pain" Klingon ship (Visual spoilers?)
- Thread starter Cranston
- Start date
I was going make a thread about everything I feel about the new Klingon ships, but everyone has already articulated what I would say. It feels a lot like Enterprise and the 'cloaking device' in "Minefield" all over again in terms of how much it has dissatisfied fans. It also wasn't necessary really. Why not call the ship a D8, D6 or something? Designing new Klingon ships isn't a problem in itself, and I am open minded, but it does grate, and I can understand people's misgivings.
TMP update:
2009 update:
Why is the D7 being treated like some lame duck, when it is utterly beautiful and submarine like, especially in it's Motion Picture form? Who fucking knows. I think the ship looks awesome, one of Trek's greatest designs, like the original connie in terms of pedigree.
And yes, LEXX has insectoid designs for it's shuttles and stuff, just like the Klingon ones. Above are a couple of Brunnen G fighters.
This is not necessarily a bad thing. Shuttles are a bit more changeable than starships. Starfleet has more insectoid looking work bees in addition to normal shuttles. The Remans had small shuttles with a canopy. We have previously seen one or two Klingon shuttles before; such as the Toron class shuttle from TNG, and the unused design for a runabout-sized vessel from TNG, which resembled the ship that Klaang crashed on Earth in "ENT: Broken Bow". They do not look anything like this, but it's not too far to think Klingons might have a wide variety of small ship.
Sarcophagus Ship:
Warship from the Battle of the Binary Stars:
Klingon raider:
It's clear that this has been planned for a long time, as seen by that concept art from 2016. The problem is that the concept artist that they brought into the show to do the new Klingon designs does not really seem to want to use any aspects of the existing visual canon for Klingons. The wider problem seems to be that even huge capital ships never seen in any other era are now being sculpted to look almost nothing like other Star Trek ships, never mind Klingon ones, as seen by the initial design of the bird of prey:
This isn't such a problem when yuor franchise is just three seasons long, but we have had all of TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT since TOS ended, and in almost every instance, alien ships look much more industrial, including Klingon ones. Okay, again, this isn't necessarily the law in Star Trek, but its quite the massive visual change to have Klingons make ships almost like artisan sculptures of insects and birds.
TMP update:
2009 update:
Why is the D7 being treated like some lame duck, when it is utterly beautiful and submarine like, especially in it's Motion Picture form? Who fucking knows. I think the ship looks awesome, one of Trek's greatest designs, like the original connie in terms of pedigree.
And yes, LEXX has insectoid designs for it's shuttles and stuff, just like the Klingon ones. Above are a couple of Brunnen G fighters.
This is not necessarily a bad thing. Shuttles are a bit more changeable than starships. Starfleet has more insectoid looking work bees in addition to normal shuttles. The Remans had small shuttles with a canopy. We have previously seen one or two Klingon shuttles before; such as the Toron class shuttle from TNG, and the unused design for a runabout-sized vessel from TNG, which resembled the ship that Klaang crashed on Earth in "ENT: Broken Bow". They do not look anything like this, but it's not too far to think Klingons might have a wide variety of small ship.
Sarcophagus Ship:
Warship from the Battle of the Binary Stars:
Klingon raider:
It's clear that this has been planned for a long time, as seen by that concept art from 2016. The problem is that the concept artist that they brought into the show to do the new Klingon designs does not really seem to want to use any aspects of the existing visual canon for Klingons. The wider problem seems to be that even huge capital ships never seen in any other era are now being sculpted to look almost nothing like other Star Trek ships, never mind Klingon ones, as seen by the initial design of the bird of prey:
This isn't such a problem when yuor franchise is just three seasons long, but we have had all of TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT since TOS ended, and in almost every instance, alien ships look much more industrial, including Klingon ones. Okay, again, this isn't necessarily the law in Star Trek, but its quite the massive visual change to have Klingons make ships almost like artisan sculptures of insects and birds.
No, we know what it does look like.
There are things you can change and things you can't, guess what this falls under?
The Raiders look like turkeys or peacocks. Very birdy.
They also appear smaller than the preliminary art. I wonder if they could be executed in prop form? That is, could the cockpit thing be dropped on location and CGI-boosted to look like a whole craft so that characters could interact around it like they could around the TOS shuttle prop?
This is my favorite DSC spacecraft design after the hero ship...
Timo Saloniemi
This is my favorite DSC spacecraft design after the hero ship...
Timo Saloniemi
G
Gonzo
Guest
I expected to see some different types of Klingon ships as the budget would allow it, I never thought they would mess with the look and feel of the D7 or Bird of Prey though as they are almost as iconic as the Enterprise 1701 is, I don't mind that they made the Sarcophagus ship different as its a one off.
They did such a great job with the Discovery and updating Starfleet ships so why couldn't they have done the same with at least the D7 and Bird of Prey, it makes sense for continuities sake alone.
The only reason I can think of is that it was to do with ownership and they were not able to get permission to use the original design, which to me is impossible as CBS owns it so there should be no problem.
If they are willing to completely change the Bird of Prey and the D7 for no real reason will they do the same to the Constitution class ships if we see one.
Truth be told the new Klingon designs are horrible, it just looks like all the effort went into the Discovery and Starfleet, with the Klingons getting whatever they could throw together with the little time remaining, if the new designs actually looked good and threatening then it would perhaps make it easier for some to swallow.
Instead we have got Peacock ship raiders, Death Gliders instead of Birds of Prey and a D7 that looks suspiciously like a Vor'cha cruiser from the 24th century with the wide rear tapering to a point at the front. Tried to add a picture of a Vor'cha shown from the rear to highlight the similarities but it wont let me.
They did such a great job with the Discovery and updating Starfleet ships so why couldn't they have done the same with at least the D7 and Bird of Prey, it makes sense for continuities sake alone.
The only reason I can think of is that it was to do with ownership and they were not able to get permission to use the original design, which to me is impossible as CBS owns it so there should be no problem.
If they are willing to completely change the Bird of Prey and the D7 for no real reason will they do the same to the Constitution class ships if we see one.
Truth be told the new Klingon designs are horrible, it just looks like all the effort went into the Discovery and Starfleet, with the Klingons getting whatever they could throw together with the little time remaining, if the new designs actually looked good and threatening then it would perhaps make it easier for some to swallow.
Instead we have got Peacock ship raiders, Death Gliders instead of Birds of Prey and a D7 that looks suspiciously like a Vor'cha cruiser from the 24th century with the wide rear tapering to a point at the front. Tried to add a picture of a Vor'cha shown from the rear to highlight the similarities but it wont let me.
I thought the new D7 looked like the Destiny from SGU, with a shorter front.
G
Gonzo
Guest
Yeah the Destiny and the Vor'cha have a similar overall triangular base shape, it could be said that the Destiny is a closer match to the D7 we saw than the Vor'cha as its wings stick out more on either side which breaks the triangle shape, whereas the Destiny is a triangle shaped wedge just like the D7 we saw.
We know what a D-7 looks like that isn't it.
"Islamic"?
I think it's just a reference to the elaborate styling. A way to describe the very Byzantine look.
"Islamic"?
I think somebody meant "arabesque," which is the usual term used in the fields of arts/design for that kind of pattern, but they had a brain hiccup and couldn't think of the right word.
"Islamic"?
Kor
Yes, that's the beacon being guarded by the Torchbearer. The device that looks more like a Romulan piece of technology than Klingon.
Honestly it reminds me of the Sona ship designed to harvest the rings of the planet in the Briar Patch from ST:INS
The metaphasic particle collector? Yeah, I guess it does. A little bit anyways.
Yeah, its the beacon - and yeah, I am frankly not very happy with whats happened.
I've given this show a lot of benefit of the doubt, but really disagree with some of their production choices. Re-imagining a beloved alien race.
It's like making an Imperial Star Destroyer suddenly look like a Warhammer 40,000 Necron ship or something. And while I would like to assume otherwise, it really raises the question of whether the designers know enough about Star Trek's visual design history.
This, for me, is the worst, as it's actually meant to be a normal Klingon warship of the 23rd century, but looks like a generic 'alien ship' from some less famous franchise.
I've given this show a lot of benefit of the doubt, but really disagree with some of their production choices. Re-imagining a beloved alien race.
It's like making an Imperial Star Destroyer suddenly look like a Warhammer 40,000 Necron ship or something. And while I would like to assume otherwise, it really raises the question of whether the designers know enough about Star Trek's visual design history.
This, for me, is the worst, as it's actually meant to be a normal Klingon warship of the 23rd century, but looks like a generic 'alien ship' from some less famous franchise.
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