CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[SuperSpaceMan]

Funny how these "professionals" are acting like spoiled children.

There are numerous professional movie stars that act like spoiled children. Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

And, according to their budget report, installing new floors on the soundstage and remodeling the offices too.

So they're using the crowd funding to basically build a studio for use on other projects??

That's an absolute disgrace if true.

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

In their Kickstarter Fundraiser did they use CBS owned IP? So they used CBS IP to promote a fundraiser for a for profit venture... Also, while they did say funds for the Kickstarter were going to be used for a studio, they didn't make mention in thei plans for a for profit business venture (Ares Studio)

 

[JoeRalat]

[/QUOTE]
Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?[/QUOTE]


Well, Again I do not understand the how they spent money. If a warehouse was say.. $5000 a month..You can rent one for 3 years for 180,000

My feeling with all of this...Major money issue is the case of this, something does not seem right with all the money issues. Tony Todd post about 15k seems to point to how the money is being spent.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Funny how these "professionals" are acting like spoiled children.

There are numerous professional movie stars that act like spoiled children. Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

So they're using the crowd funding to basically build a studio for use on other projects??

That's an absolute disgrace if true.

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

In their Kickstarter Fundraiser did they use CBS owned IP? So they used CBS IP to promote a fundraiser for a for profit venture... Also, while they did say funds for the Kickstarter were going to be used for a studio, they didn't make mention in thei plans for a for profit business venture (Ares Studio)

This.

You can dress it up any number of ways, but let's be honest here. The funds they got from crowdfunding would almost certainly not have arrived had this not been a project with the Trek brand name on it. If it were just a kickstarter that said "we want to build a studio for future profit making ventures" would they have gotten $1m worth of money? Not a chance in hell. It seems clear to me now that Peters has used the Star Trek brand as a backdoor through which to pay himself and his friends a salary and build a studio for future money making. To exploit fans, who will likely now never get any value for their money, in this manner is almost fraudulent.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?[/QUOTE]


Well, Again I do not understand the how they spent money. If a warehouse was say.. $5000 a month..You can rent one for 3 years for 180,000

My feeling with all of this...Major money issue is the case of this, something does not seem right with all the money issues. Tony Todd post about 15k seems to point to how the money is being spent.[/QUOTE]

According to a FB conversation I had with Alec some time ago rent on the warehouse was 13k per month...

 

[JoeRalat]

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

Well, Again I do not understand the how they spent money. If a warehouse was say.. $5000 a month..You can rent one for 3 years for 180,000

My feeling with all of this...Major money issue is the case of this, something does not seem right with all the money issues. Tony Todd post about 15k seems to point to how the money is being spent.[/QUOTE]

According to a FB conversation I had with Alec some time ago rent on the warehouse was 13k per month...[/QUOTE]


How long did they have the studio? That $156,000 a year thats crazy. How much is a non major studio " Studio" is to rent

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

Well, Again I do not understand the how they spent money. If a warehouse was say.. $5000 a month..You can rent one for 3 years for 180,000

My feeling with all of this...Major money issue is the case of this, something does not seem right with all the money issues. Tony Todd post about 15k seems to point to how the money is being spent.

According to a FB conversation I had with Alec some time ago rent on the warehouse was 13k per month...[/QUOTE]


How long did they have the studio? That $156,000 a year thats crazy. How much is a non major studio " Studio" is to rent[/QUOTE]

They moved in last January, so 12 months now...

 

[Turbo]

Eh, that rent doesn't seem too ridiculous for a large commercial space in Los Angeles.

 

[Jedman67]

Funny how these "professionals" are acting like spoiled children.

There are numerous professional movie stars that act like spoiled children. Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

So they're using the crowd funding to basically build a studio for use on other projects??

That's an absolute disgrace if true.

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

In their Kickstarter Fundraiser did they use CBS owned IP? So they used CBS IP to promote a fundraiser for a for profit venture... Also, while they did say funds for the Kickstarter were going to be used for a studio, they didn't make mention in thei plans for a for profit business venture (Ares Studio)

There are numerous professional movie stars that act like spoiled children. Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

In their Kickstarter Fundraiser did they use CBS owned IP? So they used CBS IP to promote a fundraiser for a for profit venture... Also, while they did say funds for the Kickstarter were going to be used for a studio, they didn't make mention in thei plans for a for profit business venture (Ares Studio)

This.

You can dress it up any number of ways, but let's be honest here. The funds they got from crowdfunding would almost certainly not have arrived had this not been a project with the Trek brand name on it. If it were just a kickstarter that said "we want to build a studio for future profit making ventures" would they have gotten $1m worth of money? Not a chance in hell. It seems clear to me now that Peters has used the Star Trek brand as a backdoor through which to pay himself and his friends a salary and build a studio for future money making. To exploit fans, who will likely now never get any value for their money, in this manner is almost fraudulent.

True, very true that they used CBS IP with the fundraiser. If it's not outright illegal, it's certainly a grey area they should have been more careful with. On the other hand, making the studio doesn't bother me as long as they disclosed it from the beginning. I think they did, SuperSpaceMan believes they pulled a bait and switch (yes, i saw the wayback link ).
But pulling a salary from fan donations; that bothers me too.

 

[Tom]

Remember this article from august...

How $1.1 Million ‘Star Trek’ Fan Movie Has Escaped Studio Shutdown (So Far)


It’s not a traditional fan film, and doesn’t have those limitations with it,” executive producer Alec Peters told TheWrap, justifying “Axanar’s” relatively sizable budget. “Although we fall under the fan movie, we’ve tried to make the product as good as coming out of the studio.”
The official line from CBS and Paramount, which manage the TV and film rights to the ‘Star Trek’ franchise, respectively, is not to endorse such a production.

“CBS has not authorized, sanctioned or licensed this project in any way, and this has been communicated to those involved,” a representative from the network told TheWrap. “We continue to object to professional commercial ventures trading off our property rights and are considering further options to protect these rights.” (Paramount did not return TheWrap’s request for comment.)

Peters said he and his team met with CBS last week but the network didn’t offer any specific guidelines concerning what his crew can and cannot do — the network simply told him that they can’t make money off the project.

Studios have historically been lax toward films made by fans, even benefiting from the added attention they garner for their properties.

CBS and Paramount’s habit of looking the other way on fan films runs counter to the policy pursued by 20th Century Fox just last month when it shut down a project based on the “Alien” franchise. According to Digital Spy, the homegrown production had cast Carrie Henn, who starred in the 1986 film “Aliens.”
One reason why CBS and Paramount aren’t cracking down on “Axanar” may be that that Peters claims to be limiting the use of “Star Trek” logos and likenesses and using only three protected characters, all relatively obscure: Garth of Izar from the original “Star Trek” TV series, the Vulcan from “Star Trek: Enterprise” and General Chang from the film “Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country.”

http://www.thewrap.com/how-1-1-million-star-trek-fan-movie-has-escaped-studio-shutdown-so-far/

 

[JoeRalat]

Eh, that rent doesn't seem too ridiculous for a large commercial space in Los Angeles.

Eh, that rent doesn't seem too ridiculous for a large commercial space in Los Angeles.

Im not say its a bad price for the area, but my question goes to how long did they have the studio. Because why not set the date for all the sets to be built for two months. (Im being nice for that much time) If you are going to spend that money, why not make sure you have everything ready to make sure the cost be wasted for space.

 

[nx1701g]

Remember this article from august...




How $1.1 Million ‘Star Trek’ Fan Movie Has Escaped Studio Shutdown (So Far)


It’s not a traditional fan film, and doesn’t have those limitations with it,” executive producer Alec Peters told TheWrap, justifying “Axanar’s” relatively sizable budget. “Although we fall under the fan movie, we’ve tried to make the product as good as coming out of the studio.”
The official line from CBS and Paramount, which manage the TV and film rights to the ‘Star Trek’ franchise, respectively, is not to endorse such a production.

“CBS has not authorized, sanctioned or licensed this project in any way, and this has been communicated to those involved,” a representative from the network told TheWrap. “We continue to object to professional commercial ventures trading off our property rights and are considering further options to protect these rights.” (Paramount did not return TheWrap’s request for comment.)

Peters said he and his team met with CBS last week but the network didn’t offer any specific guidelines concerning what his crew can and cannot do — the network simply told him that they can’t make money off the project.

Studios have historically been lax toward films made by fans, even benefiting from the added attention they garner for their properties.

CBS and Paramount’s habit of looking the other way on fan films runs counter to the policy pursued by 20th Century Fox just last month when it shut down a project based on the “Alien” franchise. According to Digital Spy, the homegrown production had cast Carrie Henn, who starred in the 1986 film “Aliens.”
One reason why CBS and Paramount aren’t cracking down on “Axanar” may be that that Peters claims to be limiting the use of “Star Trek” logos and likenesses and using only three protected characters, all relatively obscure: Garth of Izar from the original “Star Trek” TV series, the Vulcan from “Star Trek: Enterprise” and General Chang from the film “Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country.”

http://www.thewrap.com/how-1-1-milli...utdown-so-far/

In other words: You are at this point professional project, not a fan project, and you're violating our copyright.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

There are numerous professional movie stars that act like spoiled children. Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

Actually no. It's been on their last kickstarter that they needed funds to rent the warehouse and convert it into the studio which would A) make axanar and B) be available for future projects of the for profit variety that would not require massive fundraising efforts.
Part of that is building the soundstage, whatever that entails, and offices; their desks were out in the lobby of the building, according to their blog.
Anyone who donated without fully reading the kickstarter description (I didn't, FYI) and is shocked at this; well there's nothing new here, folks.
I'm curious to know what people berating Peters for creating his own studio from the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns - when (as far as I'm concerned) the plans for developing the studio were there from the beginning, although the costs have gone up since - would suggest as a reasonable alternative, if you're aiming for a Hollywood quality fanfilm?
Renting a studio may be more cost effective, the claim by Axanar is that in the long run, making your own is cheaper.
You'd probably have to make your own sets; where are you going to store them?

In their Kickstarter Fundraiser did they use CBS owned IP? So they used CBS IP to promote a fundraiser for a for profit venture... Also, while they did say funds for the Kickstarter were going to be used for a studio, they didn't make mention in thei plans for a for profit business venture (Ares Studio)

In their Kickstarter Fundraiser did they use CBS owned IP? So they used CBS IP to promote a fundraiser for a for profit venture... Also, while they did say funds for the Kickstarter were going to be used for a studio, they didn't make mention in thei plans for a for profit business venture (Ares Studio)

This.

You can dress it up any number of ways, but let's be honest here. The funds they got from crowdfunding would almost certainly not have arrived had this not been a project with the Trek brand name on it. If it were just a kickstarter that said "we want to build a studio for future profit making ventures" would they have gotten $1m worth of money? Not a chance in hell. It seems clear to me now that Peters has used the Star Trek brand as a backdoor through which to pay himself and his friends a salary and build a studio for future money making. To exploit fans, who will likely now never get any value for their money, in this manner is almost fraudulent.

True, very true that they used CBS IP with the fundraiser. If it's not outright illegal, it's certainly a grey area they should have been more careful with. On the other hand, making the studio doesn't bother me as long as they disclosed it from the beginning. I think they did, SuperSpaceMan believes they pulled a bait and switch (yes, i saw the wayback link ).
But pulling a salary from fan donations; that bothers me too.

Perhaps not a bait and switch, but I'd say that the motives of Peters clearly goes beyond loving Trek and that this was never just about making something for the fans.

 

[Karzak]

From the comments section of that same article:

So, either Burnett is not as informed as he was led to believe or he's straight up lying about "everyone" being paid for their work.

Likewise, I'm not sure how Burnett can claim there is no copyright infringement there, when they were shipping IDIC patches to donors:

 

[nx1701g]

My thing is, I don't want to be sued myself especially since I was creating art and concepts for FREE for this production. I was helping out for my love of Trek and to get some concept design cred on a production.

You know it's sad but it's quotes like these that really point out how horrible this situation is. Fan film creators (the majority anyway) are fans who just want to express their appreciation for things that they care about. This is about entertainment, this is about fun, and - most importantly - this is about the story.

 

[Joe_Atari]

Per Robert Meyer Burnett's Twitter feed (which has been a laugh riot of insanity today), here's the "official" response to todays news. (Note: the link includes the name "Alex Peters" )

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2015/12/30/alex-peters-statement-on-the-star-trek-axanar-lawsuit/

Peters’ statement in full:

Axanar is a fan film. Fan films – whether related to Star Trek, Star Wars, Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, Power Rangers, Batman or any other franchise – are labors of love that keep fans engaged, entertained, and keep favorite characters alive in the hearts of fans. Like other current fan films, AXANAR entered production based on a very long history and relationship between fandom and studios. We’re not doing anything new here.

Like all fan films, AXANAR is a love letter to a beloved franchise. For nearly 50 years, Star Trek’s devotees have been creating new Star Trek stories to share with fellow fans. That’s all we’re trying to do here.

But the Axanar webpage says, "Axanar is a ground breaking independent film that proves the idea that a studio doesn’t need to spend millions of dollars to produce a feature quality production. Axanar will be the first non-CBS/Paramount produced Star Trek to look and feel like a true Star Trek movie."

It also states, "But making a fan film was not of interest to Alec. A veteran entrepreneur and a 2004 Ernst & Young Entrepreneur of the Year winner, Alec decided that if he was going to make Axanar, it needed to look like a real film."

Peters himself has stated it's not a fan film, "...we originally expected it to be a ‘fan film’ and now I don’t think many people consider it just a fan film. So for the full-length feature we want to make sure we knock it out of the park for the high bar that we have established for independent Star Trek".

Neil

I was thinking the same thing.

In the proceedings to follow Axanar's lucky console (see what I did there?) will make the distinction between "fan film" in the sense of production quality as opposed to "fan film" -- a film made by a fan as a "labor of love" (or "love letter" if you will). In the 2014 interview he must've meant the former while in today's statement he meant the latter. Obviously, right?

Of course Peters has always tried to avoid Axanar's depiction as a fan film, preferring to use the terms "professional" and "independent production". Also on trekmovie.com I seem to remember a minor kerfuffle in a comments section from a poster zealously and confrontationially (overly so for a bystander or casual poster) calling out the webmaster for referring to Axanar as a "fan film". I had assumed the poster was either a surrogate or an alias for Peters, and I cannot find the comments anymore; they may have been deleted long ago.

Even back then commenters (and myself) were incredulous that CBS/Paramount would turn a blind eye (much less sanction) a 7-figure "independent" Trek production. Guess we know now...

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

So now, Axanar hasn't even been cast????

 

[nx1701g]

^ I can't see the image.

The news websites are starting to post Alec's comments. I just saw the article on The Wrap.

 

[dub]

The fact that Burnett worked on some recent official Trek projects makes me think that for CBS to get to the point of legal action, some big stuff must have gone down regarding the Axanar project that maybe we don't know about.

 

[JoeRalat]

This goes back to my point of the ego of a person. When you try to out do other fan films, or not even call your self a fan film, then you are looking to self destruct.

Alec wanted to make a "Fan Film" but not do the think to keep it alive.

Set a budget that is not pass a damn $1,000,000
Find a location that is nice, but not 15k a month.

Make sure you have all the elements to build sets.. in a short time. Hell, a studio has what 2 maybe 3 weeks for sets. (Please correct me)

All the trips to conventions. Hiring of friend and GirlFriend...etc..etc

You are put yourself in a spot for CBS to come after you.

NV started in a Church...over time they find a better location, HELL its only now they are adding new medical sets..after what 10 years....

Sorry I do not feel sorry for Alec, but I do for the people who put in the hours.

Again I hate that Alec and others have brought in NV and other fan films into this. They took years to make sure things are done right. So CBS would not come down on them.

But Alec had to try to show a major studio who is boss, and try to drag down the other FanFilm Productions. Thats is wrong, and I can not understand how people allow that!

 

[nx1701g]

^ Exactly. My fear is for other projects at this point and the 'innocent' people involved in the Axanar fiasco.