I pose a question for the Original fans

[Gigatron]

So I just joined this Forum, albeit I am a lover of Star Trek just more Next Gen familiar, to pose this question: I was watching a Joe Rogan interview with Neil deGrasse Tyson who says at around 42:35 that the idea of distributed computing like we have now days, that idea had not been thought of by "2001 a Space Odyssey" which came out in 1968. My argument is that I think Star Trek, which came out 2 years before, had thought of it with communicators. My question is do the communicators talk with the ships AI ever? Because the communicators look like little computers to me and would be considered distributed computing.

Here is the footage queued up of the interview which is a great listen:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8smtYxVrno&feature=youtu.be&t=42m35s

 

[Christopher]

No, the communicators were just fancy two-way radios. It was the tricorders that had computers built in ("tricorder" = "trifunction recorder," a combination audiovisual recorder, sensor device, and computer). Spock did mention in "The City on the Edge of Forever" that he could tie a tricorder in to the ship's main computer to boost its power, but I don't think we ever actually saw that done.

In "Miri," they actually had to beam down a tabletop biocomputer unit to run tests, and though they were coordinating with the ship's computer, they were actually shown relaying one computer's results verbally over the communicators so they could be punched into the other computer. Although that was made before "City on the Edge," so the idea of tying computers together remotely must not have occurred to them yet.

 

[Mudd]

They didn't even provide for cameras in the communicators, an odd oversight since the personal transmitters in Forbidden Planet included the feature.

 

[IrishNero]

How can one imagine what has yet been imagined, or what will be invented? After all, an invention by its very nature is an original idea. You couldn't have convinced me of the proliferation of the networks that we have today when I was studying computers in 1985. -And I was studying computers. The idea of digital voice was in its infancy when Trek went on the air, so it was likely unknown to all but a few theoretical computer scientists at the time. It's up to the writers to imagine these things, and sometimes, despite their active imaginations, they cannot even conceive of what technology will do for us in the future.

 

[mos6507]

How often have we ever seen someone "take a photo" in the Star Trek universe? They get on a video chat via the viewscreen, but there's no selfies and snapshotting going on really, and the tricorder is more of a scanner than a camera. Rarely do we see personal photos of any kind. There's the hologram of Tasha that Data has, and the old school photo of David Marcus in Trek VI and most else are official ID photos. There's also no mass market entertainment that I can see, no TV networks or news channels outside of the one scene in Generations where Kirk is interviewed by "the press". The Trek universe just has certain cultural omissions like this.

 

[GNDN18]

They didn't even provide for cameras in the communicators, an odd oversight since the personal transmitters in Forbidden Planet included the feature.

I'm not certain this was an oversight. Isolating the landing party to varying degrees was part of many planet-side episodes. In addition to the increased jeopardy, it allowed for dialogue that would have been redundant with visual communication.

More mundane production cost considerations might have played a part in that decision. Perhaps Harvey might know more.

 

[Shawnster]

Even the ship's computer wasn't networked like we are today. The microtape cards were used to transfer data from one computer station to another in TOS.

 

[Greg Cox]

Let's be honest. A modern-day smartphone is more high-tech than a TOS communicator.

Then again, we don't transporter beams or warp drives yet.

 

[Mudd]

One of the minor challenges in going back and really properly rebooting TOS. The communicator and the tricorder are really one device now, aren't they?

 

[Kor]

Let's be honest. A modern-day smartphone is more high-tech than a TOS communicator.

Then again, we don't transporter beams or warp drives yet.

My Android can't communicate instantaneously with ships up in space.

One of the minor challenges in going back and really properly rebooting TOS. The communicator and the tricorder are really one device now, aren't they?

I dunno... sometimes I would rather have a separate device for all those other functions (ooh a PDA, what a novel idea), and have a phone that is just a phone. My smartphone often gets so bogged down with apps and background processes that it's almost impossible to actually use it as a telephone and make or receive calls!

Though I'm sure military-grade equipment used by the space navy of the future wouldn't have such issues.

Kor

 

[T'Girl]

My question is do the communicators talk with the ships AI ever?

In This Side of Paradise, Kirk said that once the last person left the ship no one would be able to beam back aboard. This suggests that the communicator can't "talk" to the ship's computer (or the computer doesn't have access to the transporter's controls).

Plus, my impression is the TOS Enterprise's computer wasn't a AI.

 

[ToddPence]

The Enterprise computer was not artificially intelligent. Although it spoke, those were all instances of programmed responses to preset commands, the same as we have in computers today. The uniqueness of Data shows that AI was a technology not yet perfected in Kirk's time.

 

[Kor]

^ I would argue that the androids in "What are Little Girls Made of" and "Requiem for Methuselah" were pretty advanced in that regard.

Kor

 

[Christopher]

^Not only that, but the computers and androids we saw in TOS were mostly rather rigidly mechanical in their thinking (Landru, Mudd's androids), with the exception of those based on human minds (Korby's androids, the M5). Ruk seemed pretty self-aware, but he was still limited by programming. The most intelligent android we met that wasn't a copy of a human's mind was Rayna Kapec, and she proved unviable.

(Edit: Oops, cross-posted with Kor.)

 

[DonIago]

Spoiler: Spoiler re ENT novels

Didn't the Romulan War series somewhat retcon this by explaining that the computers were intentionally isolated to prevent the Romulan telecapture device from being able to seize control of Federation vessels?

 

[Kemaiku]

The TOS era yes, Spock's grandfather being one of the designers I think.

TNG onwards probably not, as all computers now seem intergrated again.

 

[telerites]

I'm sure it has been mentioned before but some of the discussion here on TOS communicators as hand held devices and obviously lapel worn insignia in TNG. The Space Ghost cartoon show which began in 1966 used lapel commiumicators like in TNG. Did TNG take a nod from Space Ghost?

 

[Metryq]

Some of the actions seen in TOS might be retconned as AI in action, or at least voice recognition. For example, in "The Conscience of the King" Kirk contacts the Enterprise and asks Uhura, "Put me through to Captain Jon Daily of the AstraI Queen on orbit station, and put it on scramble."

Scrambling the communication, and Kirk's own words to Daily, "Just keep this between the two of us and accept my thanks" suggests that Uhura did not stay in the loop. So unless Kirk pressed a button on the communicator (an action too slight to see on camera*) just after finishing his discussion with Daily, his next line, "Kirk to Enterprise" suggests voice recognition by the ship's computers. Otherwise, how would Uhura step back into the call?

* Actually, Shatner does make a two-finger grab at one of the tiny knobs, his middle finger tapping the side of the communicator. But to me, that scene always looked like voice recognition in action.

 

[Wingsley]

There were a few issues to consider with communicators from TOS and TNG alike.

TOS: The TOS flip-top communicator was a field-equipment item, made to be easily disassembled, repaired or adapted (used as a customized sonic weapon in "Friday's Child") and reassembled while in the field ("Patterns of Force"). TOS made heavy use of both voice communications and non-voice telemetry ("The Immunity Syndrome") during expeditions. TOS did not mess around with visual communications off-ship very much, unless they were ship-to-ship or ship-to-base.

TNG: re-affirmed that personal walkie-talkie-type communications are most often voice-based, especially ship-to-Away Team. In "Heart of Glory", it was established that visual communications were possible, but usually not relied upon because hostile environments made visual ship-to-Away Team videoconferencing problematic. Given that visual communications tend to require far greater bandwidth than voice alone, this made sense.

Both TOS and TNG: "Mudd's Women" and "Silicon Avatar" made it clear that each era's talkies were actually subspace transmitters with out-of-system capability.

Today's cellular phones, including fancy smartphones, require the presence of functioning cellular towers to connect to the cellular network. The communicators of TOS and TNG were stand-alone in that they did not require a private company's network of cell-towers to connect; there devices were obviously computerized, but could network person-to-ship or person-to-person ("The Doomsday Machine", "That Which Survives", "Arsenal of Freedom"). This alone makes them far more sophisticated than any cellular, HT, or radio/telemetry system in existence today. If any starship named Enterprise were to beam you up, and drop you off on another far-away planet, today's cellphones would be worthless there. No towers.

Has anyone ever listed all the different uses of communicators in the STAR TREK Universe?

 

[Starborn Dragon]

How can one imagine what has yet been imagined, or what will be invented? After all, an invention by its very nature is an original idea. You couldn't have convinced me of the proliferation of the networks that we have today when I was studying computers in 1985. -And I was studying computers. The idea of digital voice was in its infancy when Trek went on the air, so it was likely unknown to all but a few theoretical computer scientists at the time. It's up to the writers to imagine these things, and sometimes, despite their active imaginations, they cannot even conceive of what technology will do for us in the future.

Just one thing: