New To Voyager

[Guy Gardener]

I don't think Stan keeps the rights to all of the creature's he's designed for other peoples movies and sold to those people.

The Norsicans did look a lot like Predator with their masks off, but the hirogoen had the same hunters mentality.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I like Collective.

I do think Fair Haven is a terrible episode. The Irish stereotypes weren't what bothered me so much as the contention that the entire ship would fall so much in love with this small town fantasy that they would put so much desperate effort into never having any downtime.

I can see Paris getting interested because he's established as a nerdy nostalgist. It just doesn't seem the right fantasy for anyone else in the crew. To me it's equally a stretch as thinking that everybody on DS9 would become enamored with a 1940s lounge singer. One of those Okana situations, trying to convince us something stupid is cool by having all the characters fall in love with it instead of actually making it cool.

 

[Catarina]

I never thought I'd admit this but I kinda liked Collective. Even though I audibly groaned at the promo commercial."The Borg are back!". And I put a hand to my head, "UGH, enough!"

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I'd rather watch Borg than Klingons. Okay there was some good Klingon material in DS9 but mostly they are tedious.

 

[Catarina]

Ditto, Teacake. I was just being straight forward with my initial reaction .

 

[Garren]

I watched Retrospect and I'm convinced Captain Janeway is a horrible, despicable example of a human.

Seven assaults a man and later, it is revealed, this man might have violated her to siphon Borg technology. Seven is understandably upset.

You'd think Voyager's captain would be the first in line for the sympathy train, ready to comfort Seven during a duress that brings her closer to being human than ever before. As another woman, Janeway is there to shelter Seven from the fears of helplessness that a person can suffer in this situation. She can offer a motherly wisdom that Seven has never known with the Borg and truly demonstrate what it means to be a human.

But this is Janeway... and so far in season 4, she's determined to let you know that she's the coldest frostbite on the dark side of Hoth.

Janeway: If Kovin assaulted her, took a sample of her Borg technology, we can't stand by and do nothing.

Oh.. well, I stand corrected. That was actually very passionate. I'm actually surprised Janeway just stood up for Seven after--

Janeway: In the wrong hands a single nanoprobe could lead to disaster.

Wow... not even. Not even in Seven's most vulnerable moment does she give one owl-!@#$ about her.

 

[Catarina]

Garren your reaction is understandable. This episode infuriates me. I dismiss that Janeway was written by males who don't seem to understand vulnerable sides of the woman psyche. I could be jumping to conclusions but the way I remember it- I thought Janeway seemed to cavalier. I don't understand the reason they wrote her in that direction.

 

[Guy Gardener]

A 24th Century Human woman is nothing like a 20th century woman.

 

[SPCTRE]

Yeah, in their century, they don't succumb to compassion. They have a more evolved sensibility.

 

[Guy Gardener]

And what do you think is wrong with 23rd century (human) women then?

 

[Catarina]

You do raise an interesting point.

 

[Catarina]

I should re watch it because I am struggling to put into context what seemed off. I have questions such as-is this how it has to be? She is the captain-not a civilian and so did she handle it appropriately being neutral ( for a lack of a better word). Was it neutrality to begin with and her actions weren't about not sympathizing but not jumping to conclusions?
I noticed she dreaded watching the man off himself so she is feeling remorse so did part of her believe what seven did? And that "Save the nanoprobes" line confuse that? I can't remember the episode in great detail.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

She is Kirk.

Do the transposition and it all works. Of course you can rail against the over theatrical 60's Shaternisms in a woman. Or you can let it wash over you and enjoy the ride.

 

[Guy Gardener]

The Script makes her Kirk.

But Mulgrew can't shake the 20th century assuming their was a glass ceiling in Janeway's way, and double standards once she got there.

But there is no sexual/social inequality for Janeway to have overcome to have risen to the rank of Captain, or addition fortitude needed to weather the position from haters.

Woman can do anything, and woman are allowed to do anything.

 

[Garren]

I should re watch it because I am struggling to put into context what seemed off. I have questions such as-is this how it has to be? She is the captain-not a civilian and so did she handle it appropriately being neutral ( for a lack of a better word). Was it neutrality to begin with and her actions weren't about not sympathizing but not jumping to conclusions?
I noticed she dreaded watching the man off himself so she is feeling remorse so did part of her believe what seven did? And that "Save the nanoprobes" line confuse that? I can't remember the episode in great detail.

What was so off, for me, was that for a small moment it really sounded like the captain actually cared about Seven as a person and was making a statement to say that she would do everything to fight for Seven if the accusation was true. This is a fair statement because the Captain has already declared she would remain neutral and seek the truth. But Janeway appeared, too, that she also wanted justice for Seven if she was, indeed, violated.

But she negates that sentiment by saying that she only cared about the danger the nanoprobes imposed. In effect, if Seven's claims were true at all, Janeway had said (accidentally or not) that she would do everything in her power to bring the guy down not because he violated Seven and damaged her emotionally (as a Borg, even) but because he took some dangerous technology.

I laughed when she said that line because it was so on-the-nose insensitive of Janeway and I don't think that's what the writers were going for but that's exactly how it came out.

But all throughout Season 4, Seven has been the abused Cinderella of the story. Taken from the home she knew and loved and forced to live a life that is strange to her. And even though the Captain insists on converting Seven, she doesn't respect Seven's unique upbringing, individuality, or Seven's perspective on her leadership. It's like she bought a puppy but hates that it yaps and chews on things. Well that's what puppies do.

To put it in a different position, would Janeway have behaved the same way if Chakotay were in this position? Kes? B'Elanna? Kim?

 

[Sparkle Fabulosa]

I finally finished season 6. I was very disappointed. I found it extremely boring. It was a struggle to get through. I even went a few days without watching. The only episode I really enjoyed was Tinker Tenor Doctor Spy.

Here's hoping the final season is a good one. Though I've heard many times that Endgame sucks as a series finale. I am aware of the plot. In my opinion, it can't be as horrible as the Xena finale.

Fury was an unnecessary episode. As for Unimatrix Zero, I'm getting sick of the Borg. They feel over-used as the villains. The final scene did perk up my interest though.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Oh yes, Resistance is futile.

Seasons is just how they sold collections, it doesn't really have anything to do with telling a coherent story.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I was perfectly happy with Endgame, it was an exciting finale. Sure it could have been tweaked, improved etc.. but it was gripping and interesting in its own right.

Season 6 was fine, the Icheb resolution was very interesting and poignant. Some good 7 stories. Blink of an Eye, absolute classic Trek. Live Fast and Prosper was funny, laughed my ass off the first time I watched that. Muse was also a classic Star Trek story. The way they used Barclay in VOY was great as well, so believable how obsessed he got. The ones I couldn't stand were Memorial (because of the conclusion, though once again classic Trek morality tale) and Tsunkatse because I hate boxing eps and the way sci fi always has to have one at some point.

 

[Sparkle Fabulosa]

I seriously considered throwing in the towel when I got to Memorial. I'm not much of a Kes fan but Fury was a complete assassination of her character.

 

[Guy Gardener]

What I had different to you, is DS9 side by side with Voyager and a movie now and then.

A balanced diet.

It was backward times, so I didn't know about Enterprise until Voyager had finished, other wise I would consider that I had hope for the future too, but in truth, I couldn't imagine a world without Star Trek, so I didn't need hope.