Graham Smith of Rock, Paper, Shotgun mentioned this interesting article in yesterday's edition of The Sunday Papers:
How to Fix Star Trek Generations
How to Fix Star Trek Generations
How to Fix Star Trek Generations [Article]
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Braga and Moore were/are both fine writers, that wasn't the problem.
The issue was there was a "laundry list" of things that had to be included in the movie - some studio-dictated, others from the writers, others from the producers, and others from the cast. Off the top of my head -
- Include Kirk and more of TOS cast (I think the studio actually said they didn't have to do this, but Rick Berman wanted a 'passing the baton' thing)
-Destroy the Enterprise-D (one of the worst things about the movie, IMO; can't remember who insisted on this)
- Had to be accessible to people who had never seen the shows (studio-dictated, and sensible; how this was interpreted seemed to result in the movie suffering though)
- A 'strong, emotional arc' for Picard (one of Patrick Stewart's contractual clauses, which only got worse as the movies went on
- The character of Data needed a strong sub-plot (a Spiner-contract requirement. Again, this got worse as the movies went on)
And, for me, the one which sunk the film more than any other:
- The film had to be released in late 1994. This was at the studio's insistence (Berman, wisely, wanted a break).
There are probably lots of other bits and pieces as well.
I think everyone went into the film with the best of intentions, and there was so much hype and excitement for this. It was a great time to be a Trek fan. I think the biggest thing that hurt it was being developed alongside the two TV series at the time, and not giving enough time to that development.
Of course, the film's flaws have been discussed frequently but I still love the movie - mainly tied to the fact that I believe 1994-1996 was the best time in the sun Trek has ever enjoyed (it was everywhere! Certainly here in the UK!!), and Generations was a big part of that.
The reviewer is right, GEN is a puzzling film.
As time goes by this film just continues to get worse. In my bottom three, fighting it out with NEM and INS for worst film. Certainly the most disappointing of the series, hands down.
- The returns of the TOS films had diminished so the hit TNG was rushed off the air so the TNG crew could restore Trek to the box office big league, but then at the last minute someone panics and decides to include the TOS crew just in case.
- We are ready for TNG to dazzle us with the possibilities of a big screen budget, but they decide to make the film so cheaply the lead characters wore uniforms that didn't fit them.
- TNG's debut in cinemas should have blown us away, but the writers are producer were all TV people who, unsurprisingly churned out a very average TV episode.
- The very awkward shifts in tone : mourning over a kid being burned alive then cut to a scene of Brent Spiner's cringeworthy comedy.
- Spiner's performance - fantastic actor, but what was he trying to do here?
As time goes by this film just continues to get worse. In my bottom three, fighting it out with NEM and INS for worst film. Certainly the most disappointing of the series, hands down.
For television, perhaps. But neither had a motion picture script credit at the time.
The other way around, surely? My belief has always been that the studio mandated the "passing of the baton", because while they believed the TNG crew were popular enough to carry the movies, they still wanted the insurance there for anyone who hadn't been an avid TNG follower. A belief that stemmed, I think, from the idea that movies have got a much broader audience than television, and that there might actually be people out there in the world who just didn't have an interest in the TNG television show (or just hadn't seen it), but were still followers of the TOS movies.
Having the "passing of the baton" was a safety net.
The posts so far on why GEN turned out to be so much less than it should have been cover the issue well. In my opinion, Smith's article is a pretty good attempt to explain how it could've been at least a bit better without a lot of extra work.
I never liked the chemistry between Picard and Kirk, and I think Smith identifies at least part of the problem: Kirk should have been motivating Picard, not the other way around.
The idea that Kirk would accept where he was and have to be the one talked out of the nexus seemed out of character to me. Especially with what happened to Picard, it should've been Picard wondering why he should leave, and Kirk taking Guinan's role and saying to Picard, "You mean this isn't real and you know a way out of here? And there's a threat out there? Then, let's go! Now!" Instead, Kirk behaves as if Pike had said on Talos IV, "Hey, this isn't so bad. I can get used to this," instead of resisting and saying, "There's a way out of any cage."
The stakes could've been higher, too. Perhaps Soran may use the nexus to emerge at a different time and change real history. As Smith writes, have Kirk fall into the nexus, perhaps while preventing Soran from doing so. In many ways, it would've been more tragic than killing Kirk off because he's now stuck in an emotionally hollow paradise he knows is not real. For a man of action and deep emotion like Kirk, it would be a fate worse than death.
I never liked the chemistry between Picard and Kirk, and I think Smith identifies at least part of the problem: Kirk should have been motivating Picard, not the other way around.
The idea that Kirk would accept where he was and have to be the one talked out of the nexus seemed out of character to me. Especially with what happened to Picard, it should've been Picard wondering why he should leave, and Kirk taking Guinan's role and saying to Picard, "You mean this isn't real and you know a way out of here? And there's a threat out there? Then, let's go! Now!" Instead, Kirk behaves as if Pike had said on Talos IV, "Hey, this isn't so bad. I can get used to this," instead of resisting and saying, "There's a way out of any cage."
The stakes could've been higher, too. Perhaps Soran may use the nexus to emerge at a different time and change real history. As Smith writes, have Kirk fall into the nexus, perhaps while preventing Soran from doing so. In many ways, it would've been more tragic than killing Kirk off because he's now stuck in an emotionally hollow paradise he knows is not real. For a man of action and deep emotion like Kirk, it would be a fate worse than death.
You know the one flaw I see in almost every single Star Trek Movie that has yet to be fixed?
The fans who can't just sit back and watch a movie for what it was & enjoy the whole thing as an individual piece of entertainment.
They have to rip through the minor details that weren't perfect, not let them go & hang onto them until they find the next imperfection and keep adding to the pile until they can't handle it anymore and throw it all into the air and proclaim "This movie sucks! I can't stand it!!"
Many fans take everything way too seriously and expect a flawless piece of entertainment where all the special effects are perfect, the writers remember all 7 years of history and character attitudes/progression to make sure the characters in the movie fit the expectations of each and every single anal fan out there.
I continually see people complain to no end about each and every single movie out there, while comparing each and every single movie out there to each other to proclaim which was the best out of them all..... And yet, if some of these fans truly used the same level of scrutiny towards every single Star Trek movie, they would most certainly hate every single one of them and never watch a ST movie ever again.
Even the Legendary Wrath of Khan and Search for Spock have huge flaws and inconsistencies throughout.... Yet all of the movies seem to be used as an excuse by many fans to parade around their technical know-how of all things Star Trek, haul out their Star Trek Gospels and go over every scene, line by line to show how wrong the makers of the movie got it while showing just how much better they think they could have done with 20/20 hindsight and having their armchair warrior time frames with no budget or time constraints involved.
Basically for some people, they're simply "Better at Star Trek" than the people who create and give us the Star Trek they so like to rip to shreds.
And because of this, they forget that there is a huge difference between Long Running TV Series Entertainment and Theatre/Movie Entertainment. Both target different audiences and both use different means of entertainment & medium to get that entertainment across.
..... And in turn, they end up sucking any fun or enjoyment that can be found in the movie(s)
As for Star Trek Generations, I liked it when it came out and thought it was done well. Over the years and after watching it a few more times, I grew to love it even more. Yes, it has flaws, as do all ST movies, and I can easily pick up on a lot of the flaws that are in each and every movie and each and every episode of all the ST shows I have watched to date.
But I don't watch the shows or the movies to dig up all those flaws and cling on to them like some personal insult to my intelligence.
I sit there and watch the movies through to the end and watch each and every scene, sucking in all the details, all the expressions, the emotions, the messages being portrayed, the overall story being presented to me and then I think to myself, "Did it do a good job making me feel for the characters? Did it do a good job making me immersed in the story presented to me? Did it make me think about the things they wanted me to think about and relate?"
I felt Picard's loss, I knew of his family that died, I felt the consequences of that tragedy hitting Picard almost as much as if it happened to me..... Hell it almost did in my youth.
I could understand the position he was in while in the Nexus and the imagery and atmosphere Picard was going through was powerful with touching music to make you feel you would want to stay there too. Sure the kids seemed like annoying British street urchins but who am I to Judge Picard's paradise?
I could also feel Kirk's position well. He started the movie not wanting to let go of the adventure he had and passing it on to someone he didn't know or had confidence in. The Ship "Enterprise" was his for so long and when he had the opportunity to save lives and do what he did best, he did it without blinking..... Then he was in the Nexus and in a sense, he was getting his reward of all the things he wished he had that he too lost because of being a Captain of the Enterprise. And yet while in the Nexus, he entered in the same way Picard did with resent memories and thoughts brought to the foreground.
Picard's recent memories were of family and carrying on the Picard line.
Kirk's recent memories were of his youth (speaking with Scotty and Chekov) and probably summing up his entire career vs the things he missed out on.
Yet when he and Picard leave the Nexus, Kirk is basically coming straight from the Enterprise he just saved and right into another adventure where he saves the day once again.... And in one final grand attempt as beating the odds. He went out doing exactly what he loved to do... Making a difference.
(added: In regards to why it should have been Kirk telling Picard it all wasn't real, it makes perfect sense for Picard to talk Kirk out of the Nexus because Picard went into the Nexus knowing what it was, Kirk didn't. Even with Picard's knowledge what the Nexus was, it was very powerful and he wasn't prepared for it. Kirk wasn't out of character at all. He had no idea what the Nexus was and was no way prepared for it.)
I could go on about Data, the Duras Sisters, etc. But this post would only get even longer.
I just think it would be nice if some people can unfocus their eyes from all the little blemishes and flaws and focus more on the overall messages and emotions that are trying to be portrayed.
The fans who can't just sit back and watch a movie for what it was & enjoy the whole thing as an individual piece of entertainment.
They have to rip through the minor details that weren't perfect, not let them go & hang onto them until they find the next imperfection and keep adding to the pile until they can't handle it anymore and throw it all into the air and proclaim "This movie sucks! I can't stand it!!"
Many fans take everything way too seriously and expect a flawless piece of entertainment where all the special effects are perfect, the writers remember all 7 years of history and character attitudes/progression to make sure the characters in the movie fit the expectations of each and every single anal fan out there.
I continually see people complain to no end about each and every single movie out there, while comparing each and every single movie out there to each other to proclaim which was the best out of them all..... And yet, if some of these fans truly used the same level of scrutiny towards every single Star Trek movie, they would most certainly hate every single one of them and never watch a ST movie ever again.
Even the Legendary Wrath of Khan and Search for Spock have huge flaws and inconsistencies throughout.... Yet all of the movies seem to be used as an excuse by many fans to parade around their technical know-how of all things Star Trek, haul out their Star Trek Gospels and go over every scene, line by line to show how wrong the makers of the movie got it while showing just how much better they think they could have done with 20/20 hindsight and having their armchair warrior time frames with no budget or time constraints involved.
Basically for some people, they're simply "Better at Star Trek" than the people who create and give us the Star Trek they so like to rip to shreds.
And because of this, they forget that there is a huge difference between Long Running TV Series Entertainment and Theatre/Movie Entertainment. Both target different audiences and both use different means of entertainment & medium to get that entertainment across.
..... And in turn, they end up sucking any fun or enjoyment that can be found in the movie(s)
As for Star Trek Generations, I liked it when it came out and thought it was done well. Over the years and after watching it a few more times, I grew to love it even more. Yes, it has flaws, as do all ST movies, and I can easily pick up on a lot of the flaws that are in each and every movie and each and every episode of all the ST shows I have watched to date.
But I don't watch the shows or the movies to dig up all those flaws and cling on to them like some personal insult to my intelligence.
I sit there and watch the movies through to the end and watch each and every scene, sucking in all the details, all the expressions, the emotions, the messages being portrayed, the overall story being presented to me and then I think to myself, "Did it do a good job making me feel for the characters? Did it do a good job making me immersed in the story presented to me? Did it make me think about the things they wanted me to think about and relate?"
I felt Picard's loss, I knew of his family that died, I felt the consequences of that tragedy hitting Picard almost as much as if it happened to me..... Hell it almost did in my youth.
I could understand the position he was in while in the Nexus and the imagery and atmosphere Picard was going through was powerful with touching music to make you feel you would want to stay there too. Sure the kids seemed like annoying British street urchins but who am I to Judge Picard's paradise?
I could also feel Kirk's position well. He started the movie not wanting to let go of the adventure he had and passing it on to someone he didn't know or had confidence in. The Ship "Enterprise" was his for so long and when he had the opportunity to save lives and do what he did best, he did it without blinking..... Then he was in the Nexus and in a sense, he was getting his reward of all the things he wished he had that he too lost because of being a Captain of the Enterprise. And yet while in the Nexus, he entered in the same way Picard did with resent memories and thoughts brought to the foreground.
Picard's recent memories were of family and carrying on the Picard line.
Kirk's recent memories were of his youth (speaking with Scotty and Chekov) and probably summing up his entire career vs the things he missed out on.
Yet when he and Picard leave the Nexus, Kirk is basically coming straight from the Enterprise he just saved and right into another adventure where he saves the day once again.... And in one final grand attempt as beating the odds. He went out doing exactly what he loved to do... Making a difference.
(added: In regards to why it should have been Kirk telling Picard it all wasn't real, it makes perfect sense for Picard to talk Kirk out of the Nexus because Picard went into the Nexus knowing what it was, Kirk didn't. Even with Picard's knowledge what the Nexus was, it was very powerful and he wasn't prepared for it. Kirk wasn't out of character at all. He had no idea what the Nexus was and was no way prepared for it.)
I could go on about Data, the Duras Sisters, etc. But this post would only get even longer.
I just think it would be nice if some people can unfocus their eyes from all the little blemishes and flaws and focus more on the overall messages and emotions that are trying to be portrayed.
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I don't think anyone is saying there's nothing about this movie to like, or that no one should like it. I think the basic tone is some believe it could've been done even better, which is actually a positive criticism.
As far as Kirk not being out of character goes, it's true Picard does go to pretty much the exact moment when Kirk entered the nexus, so Kirk may not have figured it all out yet. For all Kirk knows, he was just thrown back in time a few years. The problem is, that makes it even worse, because Kirk just decides to give up. He says he won't argue against history for thinking he's dead. He says this time, he's going to live the life he wishes he'd led. Screw duty. It got him nowhere. This time, he's going to be personally selfish. Sorry, I just don't believe James T. Kirk would respond that way to that situation. He thinks he's nine years in the past. He thinks he's in reality. I can't see him deciding to thumb his nose at his years of duty and loyalty to Starfleet that easily, whether he's being affected by the nexus or not.
I actually think the first half of Generations is a fairly decent flick. But, once Picard gets sucked into the Nexus, the air is completely sucked out of the film.
The other way around, surely? My belief has always been that the studio mandated the "passing of the baton", because while they believed the TNG crew were popular enough to carry the movies, they still wanted the insurance there for anyone who hadn't been an avid TNG follower. A belief that stemmed, I think, from the idea that movies have got a much broader audience than television, and that there might actually be people out there in the world who just didn't have an interest in the TNG television show (or just hadn't seen it), but were still followers of the TOS movies.
Having the "passing of the baton" was a safety net.
Berman always said it was his decision to bring in the original series, not the studio's. They had hired him to produce a Star Trek: The Next Generation film. That was his remit, not to pass the baton. When he came to them with the plan to kill Kirk (apparently born from a lack of ideas on what keeping him alive would mean), they asked him if he were sure, and he said he was.
I look at Generations now not as a "passing the baton" film but as a TNG film with a guest star the television series couldn't afford.
That was an idea Moore and Braga brought to the table. They wanted to do that in the season six finale, but the saucer crash couldn't be achieved on a television budget.
Go back in time and prevent the movie from being made. For me, Generations is the worst of the bunch. Bottom of the list. And people call Abrams films Garbage...
These are my feelings about the movie to a tee - everything up to that point stands shoulder to shoulder with almost any Trek film, it's full of intrigue, outstanding cinematography, great visual effects and a solid score. The whole thing just seems to unravel big-time as soon as we get to the nonsensical Nexus scenes. It's such a shame they couldn't have come up with a better way to get Kirk in the film, and NOT kill him off.
Picard ending up back amongst the rocks isn't a very good place to be, but if he were to reappear earlier, you'd end up having to re-tell a chunk of the movie all over again, albeit with different outcomes...
With that in mind, though, how is it Picard can reappear before entering the nexus, and therefore never enter the nexus at all...yet be there by virtue of the nexus?!
This might be more puzzling than Captain Christopher being beamed into himself in Tomorrow Is Yesterday... 
With that in mind, though, how is it Picard can reappear before entering the nexus, and therefore never enter the nexus at all...yet be there by virtue of the nexus?!
This might be more puzzling than Captain Christopher being beamed into himself in Tomorrow Is Yesterday...
^ IMO the only way to reconcile it is to say that he never left the Nexus at all. Everything on that second round on Veridian III was just him "getting his wish" to fix the problem and stop Soran, but in reality it was probably just as false as the Christmas dinner or Kirk's log cabin, and Picard is probably still living out this pretend fantasy life in every subsequent movie. Which is unsatisfying, obviously, but it's the only logically consistent way to look at it, given everything else we were told about the ribbon.
Everything that is wrong with this movie comes down to the Nexus being a crap plot device. It has to be said.
Everything that is wrong with this movie comes down to the Nexus being a crap plot device. It has to be said.
Generations is an oddity to me: It's a great and horrible film at the same time.
I attribute the good to the good performances. The bad to the writing. The cast elevated the material.
The Christmas dream, I thought was good because Patrick Stewart got to really do some acting.
I attribute the good to the good performances. The bad to the writing. The cast elevated the material.
The Christmas dream, I thought was good because Patrick Stewart got to really do some acting.
The only problem with that theory is that Worf, Troi and Barclay appear very much alive in DS9 and VOY after Generations. Other than that, the Ent-D and Picard's crew were never mentioned at all in the subsequent TV series. So if Dorn, Sirtis and Schultz didn't reprise their roles, then it would have been entirely possible that the subsequent films could have just been Picard's Nexus fantasy.
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