Yesterday's Enterprise battle

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by Unicron, Dec 4, 2012.

  1. Unicron

    Unicron Continuity Spackle Moderator

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    I came across an interesting version of the cool battle from YE. In this case all of the exterior battle shots have been done with CG models. Not bad overall.

    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9Kk2GINcW4[/yt]
     
  2. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It's a pretty good job. I wish they would've spruced up the combat sequences a bit if they were going to do that instead of just carbon copying the original ones.
     
  3. RAMA

    RAMA Admiral Admiral

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    I saw that about a year ago I think, they did "spruce" up some of the shots. I DO wish they would do this type of work more often on the STNG remastering.

    RAMA
     
  4. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

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    They've constant said the TNG remastering is not about adding in a ton of new HD CGI space battles. That would be too expensive to do for this kind of project.

    Not sure how they are going to handle later DS9 seasons or the entire VOY series, which would required all that. :vulcan:
     
  5. Ar-Pharazon

    Ar-Pharazon Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I've always felt Picard's battle orders in that scene were very lackadaisically given, like it wasn't that big of a fight.

    This heading & that heading & dispersal patterns instead of "fire everything!"

    It was like he was giving orders to catalog a gaseous anomaly.
     
  6. Squiggy

    Squiggy FrozenToad Admiral

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    The only shot that's significantly different is at 2:30. Everything else looks pretty much like it did in the original.

    But it would be nice if for all the CGI updates is when they say "evasive maneuvers" they actually evade and not just sit there.
     
  7. bullethead

    bullethead Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    We already had a big thread about this a while back, but the one thing that irks me about that video (besides the lack of evasive maneuvers to make the Starfleet guys look less stupid) is that they reuse the stock Ent-D instead of one that looks more like a warship (which can be done by removing most of the windows - I can't tell, but that seems like it could've been done with a texture tweak on the model used in this vid, at least).
     
  8. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    We have to consider that Picard did not want to win. He had a specific tactical goal in that battle, and it had nothing to do with destroying Klingon ships or ensuring the survival of the E-D. All that mattered was getting the E-C safely back into the timehole.

    I can buy extremely restrained fire, then: Picard would have to goad the Klingons into attacking his own ship and ignoring the E-C, while making sure the Klingons did not realize they were being goaded.

    Indeed, I wouldn't have been surprised if Picard had used surrender as one of his tactical maneuvers here; it might have been among the most effective in securing victory for his side. But apparently this war-hardened version of the Captain was blind to such an option.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  9. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It looks pretty good, but one thing though: the ships move far too slow. I hope when HD gets up to some of TNG's bigger battle scenes they make them a little more actiony.
     
  10. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Pretty much what I was getting at when I suggested the 3d model should've spruced up the combat sequences a bit. I get that in the early 90's they had to use models, so insane maneuvers were hard to pull off, but with computer animation now, that's really not a constraint.
     
  11. Mott the barber

    Mott the barber Commodore Commodore

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    Would be cool but it's unlikely given the way they're treating the remastering (preserve model work and not totally re-do it unless negatives are missing).
     
  12. Keeper

    Keeper Commodore Commodore

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    This is the problem I have with TOS-R. It still has a lot of the same crappy, jarring effects, only prettier. :rolleyes:
    *waits for TOS-Re-Remastered: The Ultimate Editions*

    (EM) And this is why I won't be getting them, either. Not caring enough to go though all the trouble & expense to make them something I'd really, really want to buy again makes me care less as well. Same goes for any of the series they decide to do a lackluster job, I ain't buying them.

    Edit, sorry for the OT rant.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  13. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I haven't bought any of the Bluray DVDs yet, and really don't see any reasons to. If they spruced up the space scenes like they did with the Star Wars ep 4 Death Star battle, that'd be cool and worth spending the money on, but just throwing a new coat of paint on an old clunker isn't enough to sell me.
     
  14. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    I still think that CGI battle looks worse than the model work in the actual episode.
     
  15. bullethead

    bullethead Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well yeah, it wasn't made with the best models, textures, and effects ever. It kinda looks like someone used Bridge Commander to make the video.
     
  16. Dac

    Dac Commodore Commodore

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    If there is just one thing I want CBS-D to add/change in the entire series - it's at the end of this Battle after Riker is killed and Picard gives his "That'll be the day", jumps back to tactical and starts hammering away at the buttons. In the original SD version, the Enterprise fires like 3 piddly phaser beams and thats it. Yes, the ship is damaged, but she's already gonna blow - I wanted to see the scene alight with phasers all towards the Klingon ships. Show areas blowing out on the Enterprise as the phasers overload or some such - nothing much, just a half second of fizzling effects. Something to make it seem like Picard has nothing left to loose and is going to do everything in his power to take out the Klingons, even if it risks his own ship. The original shot just seemed too piddly for a big finish.
     
  17. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    Why? What would that add?

    That's the problem I think Voyager and to some extent DS9 runs into, fixating too much on effects and 'splosions! Why? What's the point? What Picard is doing and why is pretty clear and has worked perfectly in that scene for 20 years now. Why change it?
     
  18. Dac

    Dac Commodore Commodore

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    Because in the live action shots, fire is everywhere, stuff is blowing up and the camera is shaking - you cut to the effects, and its as static shot with like 2 phaser beams - It really undersells whats happening.
     
  19. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    Well, I'd say it served well in 1990 when the episode came out and it's done very well ever since. I don't see why they need to add in "kewl new maneuvers and 'splosions!" just for the hell of it.
     
  20. Mott the barber

    Mott the barber Commodore Commodore

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    I see what both of you are saying...I could go for the middle ground of adding in an extra phaser shot or two.