Worst example of Voyager ruining an opportunity to return home

Discussion in 'Voyager' started by The Overlord, Jul 20, 2013.

  1. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    She couldn't Q to keep his word. If he was lying, then not only would they NOT get home, now she'd have an omnipotent kid to look after who'd most likely destroy them all in a childish temper tantrum.
     
  2. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The Prime Directive is a Non Interference policy that gets tapped for pre warp and post warp cultures alike.

    It doesn't matter what the Ferengi were doing.

    Janeway was not allowed to interfere in the ferengi's business just like she wasn't allowed to fracture those aliens religion by extracting their gods, or prove a hokum religion to be real which might prolong their dark age for centuries, because religion is a #### who hates science.

    The Ferengi to her face argued the Prime Directive and Janeway was forced to submit to their arguments that she should follow her own laws, release the Ferengi and allow them to go back to manipulating the population down below.

    Janeway admitted that the law was on their side.

    Rather than saying "fuck the law" and tossing them in a cell, and going home, she felt obliged to beam them back planetside and then trick them into wanting to come with her because she thought that she was smarter than they were (Neelix in costume) and when that failed because she was not smarter than they were, she triggered that worlds apocalypse... I don't know if you've noticed but when ever we in the present on Earth reach some sort of deadline where the world is supposed to end, a few thousand idiots commit suicide and a handful of morons go on a killing spree to make the rapture easier for god, because gods job is hard enough as it is... One of the obvious ideas behind the Prime Directive is to avoid unforeseen consequences... What was more harmful to these people? Being turned into good Ferengi, or surviving the end of days?

    As to your example.

    1. the robber has mob connections and they kill your entire family to stop you testifying in court.

    2. The robber is starving and his family starve to death waiting for "dad" to come back with a wallet.

    3. The person being robbed is a billionaire and really doesn't care about the 200 bucks in his wallet.

    4. You bean the robber in the nose, feel like a hero, but it turns out it wasn't a robbery at all... It's was a husband and wife roleplaying a sex fantasy.

    5. You bean the robber in the nose, feel like a hero, but it turns out it wasn't a robbery at all... You had wandered onto a movie set and the producer sues you for 10 thousand dollars for interrupting filming and "damaging" an actor.

    6. The robber kills you.

    7. Trying to kill you, stopping you stop the robbery, the robbers bullets spray into the crowd and 4 children you do not know die.

    8. You successfully stop the robbery, but you killed the robber in the process and you go to jail for 20 years.

    9. You successfully stop the robbery, but you killed the robber in the process and you feel really bad about.

    10. You successfully stop the robbery, but you killed the robber in the process and the robbers family sues you in civil court and you lose everything, and there's a lean on your wages for the rest of your life.

    ...

    Janeway is not (only) a person, she is a representation of a foreign government. Everything she does to the Universe reflects on the Federation for the next ten thousand years. Your example is off slightly, since what happened each week on Star Trek was a Government (the federation) imposing, or trying not to impose it's values on other governments, which means for a real world argument comparative to the one you issued, you have to ask about how America is doing dip shit about China's occupation of Tibet... Or how China is doing dip shit about America's Occupation of Iraq... Other than harvesting their fertile oil fields of course.

    If Governments disagree there is war.

    The Prime Directive stops idiot Captains from starting wars with species they shouldn't too easily.

    If Nagus Zek (while he was still in power) found out about what happened, he would have RAPED the Federation for such inviolate persecution of his people and the criminal activities of Janeway and the audacity of this Neelix person to think that he could impersonate the will of the Nagus.

    Goods and services taxes would go up by 3 percent, and suddenly there's replicator rationing Federation wide.

    "Unforeseen consequences".
     
  3. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Commodore Commodore

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    Other than the hearty laugh I got out of Janeway-Paris salamander babies, I can't imagine Threshold being worse.

    OTOH, wouldn't leaving the salamander babies amount to abandonment?
     
  4. Turd Ferguson

    Turd Ferguson Commodore Commodore

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    Actually, besides using Q, Threshold is the worst example. Paris sat in sickbay for at least a day before turning into a salamander fully. The Doctor knew the radiation dosage to make Paris human again. Just warp 10 to the Alpha Quadrant and cure everybody before they start evolving.
     
  5. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    You do realise you've just ended the show.
     
  6. Silvercrest

    Silvercrest Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I always thought "Unimatrix Zero" was the worst. At the end, they've got allies in a liberated Borg sphere with transwarp capability. Maybe the show could contrive some reason why the sphere couldn't take them home-- but they didn't even ask! They completely forgot!
     
  7. The Overlord

    The Overlord Captain Captain

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    It seems like there were several things the Voyager could have done to prevent the Ferengi from escaping, they could have put them in hand cuffs, put extra guards at the Shuttle Bay, disable their shuttle, lock their shuttle, have competent security people take the Ferengi to the Brig. It really looks bad for the Voyager that the Ferengi were able to escape so easily and reclaim their shuttle.
     
  8. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Wouldn't they have made it home in Hope and Fear if they hadn't gone back for Seven?

    Voyager had to back track all the way to the rim of Borg Space which cancels out most of Kes' Gift she gave them in Gift.

    If I was Admiral Janeway and knew that Seven was going to die anyway half way to Earth, it would have been a clear fix to jump in at that moment and kill Seven before Janeway had to go out of her way 60 thousand light years to rescue her bionic ass.

    (Or sidesteping Seven's capture by Arturis is perhaps a less blood thirsty option.)
     
  9. Bob Karo

    Bob Karo Captain Captain

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    Using a timed explosive or leaving behind a security team to blow up the caretaker array? Just letting Kazon have it?
     
  10. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Legally according to Tuvok she was supposed to let them have the array.

    So that suggestion Bob is %200 the opposite of out side the box thinking.
     
  11. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Kazon were already proven to be dumb to the first order. They valued water... when they had space ships. Even if they're so dumb they can't figure out how to synthesize any, they have space ships... they can fly to another planet with water... except they didn't figure that out. Hell let them have the Array, they'll probably blow it up just as quick as those tricobalt devices.
     
  12. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Caretaker, who was hopelessly caught in the clutch of senile dementia, disagrees with your sketchy opinion, explaining to Janeway at the time exactly how wrong you are with complete certainty and sincerity.
     
  13. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Also, corn.
     
  14. bigdaddy

    bigdaddy Vice Admiral Admiral

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    They could have done at least a season with the show being at home, and done probably another season going through space near The Federation on their way to Earth. Paramount wanted a TNG ripoff anyways.


    :techman:

    The whole show was based on that one stupid part too! SHould have just made them get stuck there with no hope of getting back.
     
  15. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    They got home in Lost at the conclusion of the third season without any significant drop in quality.

    Voyager was more lost than lost?

    Someone was trying to hard.
     
  16. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I never understood why they didn't just return Voyager home in season six. DS9 was off the air by then, so there wouldn't have been any conflict with having two shows set in the Alpha Quadrant. And it might have opened the show up to some new narrative thinking after the whole 'stuck in the Delta Quadrant' thing had kind of run its course and become stale. Ironically, returning to 'established' Trek settings might have helped give Voyager the new creative impetus that the show so desperately needed at that point.
     
  17. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    There was more to Lost than just being Lost though. That's the point I'm trying to make.
     
  18. You_Will_Fail

    You_Will_Fail Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Well to be fair, the alternate crew in Course Oblivion was using an "enhanced warp driveā€œ, it wasn't slipstream drive.
     
  19. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well the slip stream drive the real Voyager used in Timeless was powered by some crystals they found that were "decaying" or something that they could only use it then and there. So maybe the demon Voyager found something different, ran into a new alien technology or something.
     
  20. Pondwater

    Pondwater Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Caretaker's Array. Then if they utilized that to get back home there might not have been a series. :-( If Voyager had used the Caretaker's Array...then the Equinox would of been the Federation ship in the Quadrant.