Why the hell don't they make a new cartoon?

Discussion in 'Future of Trek' started by punkydrewster, Dec 19, 2008.

  1. Too Much Fun

    Too Much Fun Commodore Commodore

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    I think it's just not possible because the landscape in television has changed too much since the '70s. It seems the main motivation for the original animated series is that fans were hungry for new Star Trek in some form, and there wasn't a budget available for a new live action series, so the cartoon was made as a valentine to fans. It's quite the opposite of the situation now where after two bad movies and two series that weren't very successful overall, people are burned out on Star Trek.

    If the last three shows had never happened and people were missing TNG so badly because there hadn't been any Star Trek on TV since 1994, things would be different, but the reality is this is probably the least promising time for Star Trek on TV in the whole history of the franchise. With that said, to just forget about the reality of the situation and talk hypothetically, I too would love a TNG-based animated series.

    Patrick Stewart has already proven on "American Dad", "The Simpsons", and many other voiceover performances how beautifully his acting and awesome voice can translate into animation and has become quite adept at voice acting. I'm sure he'd be great as an animated Picard and would lead the other actors nicely. The animation would also probably be much slicker and smoother than the primitive filmation stuff, and just as it was with that show, it would be lovely to witness the adorable spectacle of those familar Star Trek voices coming out of drawings. I can especially imagine how enjoyable it would be to see a cartoon Data, resurrected and once again in season 1 shape, without Brent Spiner even having to go on a diet. :)
     
  2. Aquehonga

    Aquehonga Fleet Captain

    If there is to be a new ST cartoon, make sure the folks who make Transformers:Animated are no where near the show & have nothing to do with any future ST cartoons whatsoever.

    We don't need a STAR TREK: Animated on the Cartoon Network {or any channel} featuring Kirk, Sisko, Spock, Data, Picard, Janeway, Tuvok, Quark, Archer entc, entc, entc, ent al with chins huge enough to fill the Grand Canyon.

    Ever seen Transformers:Animated?

    TF:A should be called
    “Attack of the Giant Robo-Jay Lenos from Outer Space”.

    :wtf: is up with those EFFING HUGE-ASS CHINS:brickwall:
     
  3. miraclefan

    miraclefan Commodore Commodore

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    Because it would not be considerd part of continuaty?
     
  4. Aquehonga

    Aquehonga Fleet Captain

    Don't you mean canonuity bub?

    Most aficionados don't realize TAS isn't part of Trekverse canonuity, which is horse hockey if you ask me. & you haven't!

    TAS should be part of ST canon/continuity {canonuity}. Be MADE part of canonuity.

    Its boulderdash that its not:mad:

    A new cartoon, made right, ought be canonuous with the rest of Trek.
     
  5. Too Much Fun

    Too Much Fun Commodore Commodore

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    It seems to vary...sometimes it is and sometime it isn't. For example, in DS9 they have referenced some aliens, ships, or events from the animated series, but they have also contradicted it with some statements. For example, Dax saying Koloth regretted never facing Kirk in battle, even though their ships exchanged fire in "More Tribbles, More Troubles". I don't know the exact status of it, but I think Gene Rodenberry originally said it officially isn't canon but that was later changed?
     
  6. Aquehonga

    Aquehonga Fleet Captain

    That figures.

    Yet another example of ST's only consistency being inconsistency.

    Seems STPTB pick & choose what is, & isn't, canonuity from TAS:mad:
     
  7. hellsgate

    hellsgate Commodore

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    No, not the canon characters, but maybe one of the Fan Productions should get lucky...or "Star Trek: New Frontiers" with Mackenzie Calhoun or Captain Morgan Bateson would be cool. New / old "Phase 2" designs being used. "Localized Fleets", etc.
     
  8. jefferiestubes8

    jefferiestubes8 Commodore Commodore

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    make a new cartoon?

    Yes Star Trek (2009 feature film) will be a commercial success and then what? no other Star Trek feature has been greenlit, written, or in production so that means nothing until at least 2011 other than Blu-Ray re-releases of past projects.

    Too Much Fun wrote:
    Animated programs on the Cartoon Network are no longer aimed at kids under 15.
    although ST has a limited older fanbase but like punkydrewster wrote:
    Aquehonga wrote"
    I would like to see some designs used from either the TOS, TNG, Star Trek VI, or Enterprise. Actual blueprints for sets to create CGI sets. Actual blueprints used to create models of ships used that are recreated in CGI.
    There is a fanbase willing to pay for more visual entertainment (other than books or videogames) be it live-action or animated series or movies.
    So even if they use just voices from the actors who formerly acted their character in live-action it would be similar to TAS in 1973-1974. Get TAS DVDs and check out Shatner, Nimoy, and Kelley along with most of the rest voicing their animated characters. If Paramount did it not on a tighter budget like TAS was but more like 'SW:The Clone Wars' movie or a CGI animated Trek miniseries.
    I'd really like to see something like the 60 minutes of CGI animated cinematics in-game created for "Star Wars: The Force Unleashed" that was released September 2008.
    see:
    http://www.gametrailers.com/player/36012.html
    If Paramount was capable of creating gorgeous CGI like that trailer I'd buy a Blu-Ray of a 4 hour miniseries in HD 1080p.

    For a CGI animated show we've been talking about any of the music from ST: TNG, Voyager, Enterprise could be re-used. Really. There are hundreds of hours to choose from.

    It doesn't have to be a super-epic taking 18 mohths to create like a 6 month delay of ST (2009 feature film). Good script, great CGI, sound FX, and reused music. Keep it closer to the 'Battlestar Galacticas' miniseries in terms of budgets.
    As far as using the original ST:TOS characters I'd also like to explore the time period from STII to STVI.
    Hell I'd also like to see George Takei voicing Hikaru Sulu, captain of the USS Excelsior (just like he did in ST:VI) but all on a CGI Excelsior. And they could even make the CGI Takei look like he did in 1990 when they shot ST:VI.

    Paramount would be taking risks of not confusing new fans from ST 2.0 but a miniseries on TV with older characters broadcast in February 2010 would be okay I think as they would get their Christmas sales in 2009 without confusion.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2009
  9. Jbarney

    Jbarney Commander Red Shirt

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    I think another cartoon would be good, if done right. I don't think it would prevent them from doing another series, either. The possibilities of doing a cartoon would be endless.

    Would love to see one based during the Dominion War.

    Jason
     
  10. Dukhat

    Dukhat Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The concept wasn't all that great, and the animation was pretty meh.

    Don't get me wrong: I love cartoons. But I think that the majority of the viewing population just wouldn't take an animated ST series seriously, unless it was produced like the Clone Wars. And even then, I'm a die-hard SW fan, and even I don't watch CW.
     
  11. jefferiestubes8

    jefferiestubes8 Commodore Commodore

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    make a new cartoon

    This is my argument. CGI animation looks better. It has more depth.

    CGI animated in-game cinematics created for "Star Wars: The Force Unleashed" are really amazing quality. Sure the faces and jaws don't move 'enough', the hair doesn't flow enough or look like Shrek the Third (ShrekIII)'s tiny hairs but it looks damn good for telling stories that don't require building expensive Star Trek sets of ships and planets.
    Also they can move the camera and really make it a cinematic 'film feel'.
    They can now use the technology to give it much more of a feeling with steam, gas, smoke, snow, rain that looks very similar to the CGI work done on a feature film.
    See the link (from previous post) from 1:25 to 1:35 of that trailer for the visuals that are just not possible with 2D animation.
    http://www.gametrailers.com/player/36012.html

    As ST fans we are used to seeing all of the space scenes since TNG as CGI anyway. Will we allow animated characters to tell the stories?
    The beauty of using CGI for the space scenes is Paramount can use the models already created for all of the ships since ST:TNG.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightwave

    see my post here for more details about the CGI models created of the Enterprise-D :
    http://www.trekbbs.com/showpost.php?p=2693205&postcount=21

    Once the model is made it can be used for any CGI work.
    I wonder if the models created for the movies and series were ported over to the new MMORPG videogame Star Trek Online (working title) for 2010?

    Along similar lines that atmospheric effects and lighting is evident even in screenshots of another VG:
    CGI in-game work that duplicates the visuals of the 1986 'Aliens' film lit and photographed by Director of Photography Adrian Biddle.
    2010 videogame
    Name: Aliens: Colonial Marines
    http://www.avpgalaxy.net/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=176

    actual gameplay engines have gotten so good and things like the Playstation3 are able to render these environments in realtime. Not just the 3D models of an environment but the lighting, shadows, and atmospheric effects (smoke, dust, snow, rain, mist, fog). In realtime!
    Not a huge networked renderfarm at some visual effects company but a PS3 system you can buy for $399.99 .
    If all the sets of a ship are created by a visual effects company and a 'in-house PS3 game' authored in-house for the sole reason of making camera movements and static backgrounds that separate CGI characters can be inserted into these.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2009
  12. jefferiestubes8

    jefferiestubes8 Commodore Commodore

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    The beauty of it is once a model is built in a standard CGI software (Lightwave 3D) it can be used for a number of things: magazine cover renderings, feature films, TV series, poster renderings, graphic novel renderings. The question is whether the CGI model designer is willing to license the CGI model.


    Lightwave 3D http://www.newtek.com
    "$1000 to $2000, Windows, Mac, Linux
    This 100% ‘fan made’ model of the Enterprise (2009 Trek 2.0) is based solely on reference material available (the official image release, the three trailers and even the toy images).
    Star Trek Illustrations for the Official Star Trek Magazine by German CG Artist Tobias Richter a veteran CG artist and owner of The Light Works graphics studio in Cologne, Germany,
    http://trekmovie.com/2009/02/23/first-look-at-tobias-richters-uss-enterprise-wallpapers/

    So as of now you have 2 models of the new Enterprise. The official Paramount Pictures one from the movie and Tobias Richter's one. Both CGI models can be repurposed by licensing them for any of the needs to show the new ship. (i.e. a miniseries based on the movie).
    Once a CGI model is licensed camera moves are added, moving starfield/planet backgrounds, and lighting before it is rendered for the resolution needed (250 dpi for a CMYK movie poster or magazine, 72dpi at 1920x1080 pixels for HD video @ 24fps)
     
  13. I am not Spock

    I am not Spock Commodore Commodore

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    We shouldn't give Roddenberry too much credit. He did create this whole sandbox that we all love, but, he didn't think TFF or TUC were canon, either. And clearly they are.

    Paramount have released TAS on DVD, so their 'non-canon' stance might have been relaxed a bit.
     
  14. jefferiestubes8

    jefferiestubes8 Commodore Commodore

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    CGI models of NX01 interior

    this is what I'm talking about:

    the semi-finished NX Enterprise mod for Star Trek Voyager Elite Force videogame.
    [​IMG]
    and these great other screenshots of the NX01:
    http://screenshots.filesnetwork.com/4/files2/25351_4.jpg
    http://screenshots.filesnetwork.com/4/files2/25351_1.jpg
    http://screenshots.filesnetwork.com/4/files2/25351_8.jpg


    source

    Website: Enterprise NX-01 Mod:

    originally from this post:
    http://www.trekbbs.com/showpost.php?p=2734178&postcount=15

    Wouldn't it be great if this game's models and game engine (Quake III) could output HD quality rendered backgrounds for a CGI animated cartoon series [with any scenes based on the NX-01]? The animators would then animate the characters and add them over these backgrounds.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 24, 2009
  15. Jeyl

    Jeyl Commodore Commodore

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    A new animated series? Ok. If they want me a part of the show, I have two corresponding conditions.

    - Female Captain.
    or
    - Crew should be equal in the male/female count.

    I'll do the darn show for free if both ends are met!

    And it's going to be 2D cell-type animation. I've seen what the new Star Wars: Clone Wars can do, but that's not what I think Star Trek needs.
     
  16. mosh

    mosh Ensign Newbie

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    I'd put money on a Star Trek animated series being made if the Star Trek film is successful.

    It will likely be based in the movie-verse, and feature Kirk, Spock and McCoy. Animation will also allow them to use different actors than the films. This has precedents; from Toy Story to the current Clone Wars series.

    Though expect the plots to be fairly juvenile though.(Don't expect Spock to go on the Pon Farr, or Kirk to luck out so overtly. But do expect those villainous Klingons to be terrorising a group of pacifistic, mining Tellarites. ;) )
     
  17. jefferiestubes8

    jefferiestubes8 Commodore Commodore

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    a new cartoon?

    Speaking of 'Star Wars: The Clone Wars' here is how much it cost for the 98 minute feature film and how it was done.
    review SOURCE

    The budget for 'Star Wars - Clone Wars Animated Series' that looks very similar to the feature film.
    StarWars Clone Wars Animated Series Sneak Peak trailer from 2008.

    SOURCE.

    SOURCE

    When you compare it with the low budget 1973-74 TAS it looks way better.
    No 'Star Wars: The Clone Wars' does not look like "Star Wars: The Force Unleashed" videogame (released Sept. 2008) AMAZING cinematics shown in this trailer but The Clone Wars TV series look good enough to be able to tell a story and would be good enough for a Trek animated series in 2010-2011.
    And with this style the possibilities for time travel are endless (even though that is a bit of a hot button topic on the fan boards) and cameos from old crews would be much simpler as well as being able to show the various ships interiors without having to actually re-construct them to shoot live action scenes.
    Of course a first-time consideration would be the ship computer Majel Barret voiceover narration .
    Cameos simpler? The actors from the Trek series can be in any voiceover booth anywhere in the world to record their lines with the director on a in a different city directing them over a real-time voice hookup.

    So if you had the option for a series that looked like 'StarWars Clone Wars Animated Series' or no Trek series at all would you welcome it?
    Would it be geared towards under age 15 audience or over age 21 audience realistically for marketing?
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2009
  18. KirksFlyingFist

    KirksFlyingFist Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I don't think many people would watch it aside from die hard fans and kids.

    That's probably why.
     
  19. Anthony Sabre

    Anthony Sabre Commodore Commodore

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    I don't know. For some reason I just don't take animated series as seriously. The exception being Batman, which had a sophisticated storyline and some nice arcs. I am somewhat of a Star Wars fan and the only time I watched Clone Wars was by accident. I was sitting at my desk and hadn't changed the channel after the show I was watching previously ended.
     
  20. Jeyl

    Jeyl Commodore Commodore

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    ^ You should try Samurai Jack.
     

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