Why The Hate For Superman Returns?

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Trek4Ever, Jul 9, 2013.

  1. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    If you're on the road and a tornado hits you, where are you going to hide? If there is an overpass, and nothing else, you get to the overpass. Or would you rather keep staying on the road?
     
  2. Dorian Thompson

    Dorian Thompson Admiral Admiral

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    Actually, you're better off lying in a ditch if you can find one. Too many documented cases of people getting sucked out from under overpasses. The winds accelerate under an overpass.
     
  3. The Old Building & Loan

    The Old Building & Loan Auld Lang Mod Moderator

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    Going to elementary school in Indiana, they drilled it into us that if you got caught on the road during a tornado, get out of your car and into the nearest ditch.
     
  4. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Four words: "fix the wall vision".
     
  5. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I've been thinking about your points, Christopher. I think the fault here lies in the flashback scenes that were chosen. There is nothing really in the movie to suggest that at other points in his life, Jonathan did not be the type of father figure your are suggesting. In fact, dialogue in the movie specifically states that he had been, even if we don't see it.

    The scenes that we are shown in the movie specifically relate to the times in Clark's life when his parents were worried that his secret would be revealed--and there is no arguing that Clark would be taken away from the Kents if it were. Jonathan does not have answers for Clark during these scenes but it is shown that he believes that Clark will find them some day. These flashbacks are presented because they specifically relate to the alien invasion and paranoia themes in the story.

    Maybe in a future movie, we will see the type of Jonathan Kent scenes that you feel are missing. I could very well see flashbacks in the upcoming movie comparing Bruce and Clark's upbringing in their journeys to become heroes.
     
  6. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    But that's part and parcel of the film's core problem. Everything that's important to the mythology and spirit of Superman in this film is just paid lip service to -- there's dialogue referring to it, but it isn't shown, isn't earned, and what we are shown tends to work against the ideas and ideals hinted at in the dialogue. That's deeply flawed storytelling, failing to live up to one of the most basic rules: show, don't tell. Whatever worthwhile ideas this movie had were hampered by a very problematical execution.


    Oh, I can argue with that. They might try to take him away, but really, how could they hold him? Not to mention that, despite the popularity of the trope of the government taking people away, all it would take is some publicity and there'd be a public outrage over such unlawful detention of a minor, and legal action could be taken to stop it. It would be a PR disaster for the government to claim that this innocent-looking boy was a threat that needed to be locked away and experimented on.

    Really, that's part of why I hate the fictional trope of keeping special abilities secret. Secrecy just encourages abuse and injustice. Really, if you had superhuman abilities and were on the run from the government because of it, the absolute best thing you could do would be to hire a lawyer, call a press conference, and tell the world everything. Our legal system and free press, when they're working right, are the greatest tools against injustice and persecution ever devised by humanity.
     
  7. Set Harth

    Set Harth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    "I will make it legal." - a Sith
     
  8. DWF

    DWF Admiral Admiral

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    Jonathan's paranoia existed in the first Donner movie as well.

    And in MOS he says almost the same thing.

    And the Smallvile ep. Vortex.

    So blaming it all on MOS seems alittle shorted sighted to me.
     
  9. The Old Building & Loan

    The Old Building & Loan Auld Lang Mod Moderator

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    Another fictional trope is that when the U.S. government is set up as the antagonist, they tend to be uber-competent and uber-resourceful in such matters, and can keep their black operations out of the public eye. This is movie U.S. government, not real life U.S. government.
     
  10. DWF

    DWF Admiral Admiral

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    Well it worked for some nine years on The X-Files and a number of other shows. And when it comes to movies and TV shows it's best not to compare them to reality. Even movies like Chariots Of Fire which was based on a true story got several facts wrong for the sake of drama.
     
  11. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    This. :techman:
     
  12. davejames

    davejames Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Maybe for most things, but documentaries like Taxi to the Dark Side make it clear that, when it comes to imprisoning people indefinitely out of fear or paranoia, our government unfortunately does a very good job.
     
  13. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It also taps into the cultural psyche of America. People tend to mistrust the government. The right to bear arms is not there to defend your home or defend the country from a foreign invasion, but to specifically take up arms against the government if necessary.

    The truth is that there is a lot that goes on beyond public knowledge in the government--the fictional part of comics though is that the Black Ops is always highly competent, arms with sophisticated secret weaponry, and fights aliens and supernatural invasions on a regular basis!
     
  14. Shaka Zulu

    Shaka Zulu Commodore Commodore

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    That, and I think that expanding the concept of stalking to what Superman did in this movie is going out there a lot (I also think that the concept of stalking has been overblown and turned into a law that should have never been; we're criminalizing being in love just because somebody got murdered?)

    With regards to MOS, I'll say this again; people are getting the Superman movie they deserve.