Why isn't Star Trek a big movie franchise?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by The Overlord, Nov 19, 2016.

  1. The Overlord

    The Overlord Captain Captain

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    Why isn't Star Trek a big movie franchise? Not only is Star Wars a bigger success in at the box office, but movies based on obscure comic book characters like Ant Man and Dr. Strange have done better then Beyond. Even Suicide Squad did better then Beyond and that movie was based on an obscure property and was garbage.
     
  2. Mage

    Mage Commodore Commodore

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    It's simply not popular enough right now. Really, that's it.

    Sure, it's still a big fandom, but not as big as the others. Not these days, anyway.
     
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  3. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Superhero movies are a juggernaut. Ant-Man and Doctor Strange aren't obscure, they're the next in a long line from Marvel Studios, and part of their massive shared universe that began with Iron Man. They also have massive merchandising operations and tie-in cartoon series so little kids know who everyone is and want to see the "real" versions in theatres.

    Suicide Squad is the next film in the Batman vs Superman universe and had amazing marketing and trailers.

    Star Wars is Star Wars. Same as superhero movies applies, but with even more merchandising.

    Star Trek has gotten lost in the shuffle.:(
     
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  4. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    cuz its star trek eww..:)
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2016
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  5. Spot261

    Spot261 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I'd actually venture here to say that in many ways some of those MCU films are delivering the sort of content that SHOULD come from trek and isn't.

    The Winter Soldier and Civil War in particular both raised questions about the extent of government power, justifying infringements on civil liberties, the intrusive nature of law enforcement and legislation, the validity of globalising domestic power bases in response to threats that do not recognise sovereign boundaries.

    ST 09 gave us a mad Romulan who wanted to kill everyone, Beyond a mad human who wanted to kill everyone. ID arguably did better in that it hinted at the relationships between terrorism and national security being somewhat blurred and gave us characters with conflicting views about the nature of security and the morality of pre emptive defence. Even there though the substance was pretty lacking compared to trek at it's best and seemed quite embarrassing when placed against another franchise which purpotes to entertain with blockbuster spectacles and nothing more.

    Even in terms of domestic issues and equality whilst neither have truly shone, the MCU has generally been the lesser of two evils in terms of being misogynistic.
     
  6. feek61

    feek61 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Star Trek does not translate well into feature films since it is an episodic series. The Star Trek format really should be on TV so that we can follow the adventures of the characters as they trek through the galaxy; not 1 feature every 3 years. For one thing; the actors age so much between features. Simon Pegg looks like an old man in the new film. The time between the films (in Star Trek time) has been about 4 years between the second and third film; what happened and what adventures occurred between the two? There is no tangible basis for any character development

    Another problem is the movies have to be SO big (in an effort to be a blockbuster) that either the earth or the Enterprise has to be in danger of being destroyed. I HATE the Enterprise getting destroyed in nearly every movie; particularly since the Enteprise herself is like a main character. It is kind of like Kirk getting killed every episode; it doesn't make sense.

    To me, that's why the features don't really work and don't do so well. I am looking forward to Treks return to TV; even as a limited episodic series of 8-12 episodes
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2016
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  7. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Sounds exactly like Into Darkness.[/quote]
    ST 09 gave us a mad Romulan who wanted to kill everyone, Beyond a mad human who wanted to kill everyone. ID arguably did better in that it hinted at the relationships between terrorism and national security being somewhat blurred and gave us characters with conflicting views about the nature of security and the morality of pre emptive defence. Even there though the substance was pretty lacking compared to trek at it's best and seemed quite embarrassing when placed against another franchise which purpotes to entertain with blockbuster spectacles and nothing more.
    [/quote]
    ST'09 gave us the most blatant "coming out" allegory I've ever seen. Beyond was a tale of strength in unity over individualism, very relevant to a country which just elected Donald Trump (not to mention another one which just voted for Brexit) and is seeing a major surge in racism.

    But if you just want to see the pewpew, that's cool. One can view the best of the MCU that way too if they wish.
    And the X-Men movie franchise arguably does equality better than both - and better than Star Trek ever has.
     
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  8. Spot261

    Spot261 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Yes it did
     
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  9. JWPlatt

    JWPlatt Commodore Commodore

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    Fandom won't let it become Star Wars.

    I'm not complaining.

    And, it is still a significant franchise for CBS/Paramount. How many movies do you need to qualify as "a big movie franchise?" Star Trek has 13 - not enough?
     
  10. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    bear in mind of course that the original Trek movies (I-IV) and the JJ ones (first two anyway) had very big opening wkends for the time (TMP/TWOK the record at that point & IV had the biggest for that year) and very healthy top 10 domestic box office (bigger than the Bonds/XMens of the time for example). overseas unfortunately is a different story
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2016
  11. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I think 09 and ID, in particular, will become more relevant as the millennial generation ages. It's more prescient than many give it credit more, and, I think 09 resonated pretty well with audiences. I think 09 stacks just fine against the best of Trek, and illustrated domestic issues in a way that will be born out over time.
     
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  12. Hey Missy

    Hey Missy Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Why doesn't Star Trek get to be part of this modern "nerd chic" fad that includes Star Wars, DC, Marvel, and even Doctor Who, which burst its way into mainstream pop culture?
    But it's not like CBS even tries; you never see Star Trek toys or merchandise in any store, other than the Funko dolls hidden among the others.
    Someone needs to slap the shit out of whichever CBS exec who points at charts claiming "According to this, the action figures from the 2009 movie didn't sell, so we're just giving up completely"
     
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  13. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Um, Think Geek just released a "Her Universe" line of Star Trek themed clothing, Mega Bloks is producing Star Trek themed sets, as well as the collectible line of starships, in addition to a wide variety on their site.

    The problem is, they simply haven't found that outlet. The product is there, but the public awareness is not well known. So, I disagree that they have "given up" but think they need to improve their marketing and market share.
     
  14. Hey Missy

    Hey Missy Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    What I meant by "giving up" is that they haven't had a major Trek presence at stores in 7 years.
    The Mega Bloks sets? Wal-Mart, Target and other big box stores that would normally sell Mega Bloks don't carry any of those; I've only seen a few of them at mom 'n' pops.
    The clothing line is more high-end and wouldn't be found at "normal" stores.
     
  15. Relayer1

    Relayer1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What made Trek great is a poor fit for summer blockbuster type movies.

    Marvel has proved that you can have some depth of character and plot with films like Winter Soldier, but Trek has failed badly on that front. Three movies in we still have superficial action heavy popcorn flicks without much going on behind the bling.

    Trek isn't 'hot' for casual cinemagoers in the same way as Star Wars and Marvel, and isn't giving the old fanbase enough of what attracted them to Trek in the first place...
     
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  16. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Even when 2009 was at its height, I couldn't always find the merchandise in the "Big Box" stores. I found them in specialty shops, Toys R Us (which I consider a larger specialty store, not normal store).

    Their presence is out there, but "normal stores" is not their place. For whatever reason. Honestly, I think it is being driven more online and for people who actually want to go out and find it, rather than in "normal stores" because most normal stores are not willing to pay the taxes on product if it doesn't move. It may not be CBS but rather stores who are reluctant to put it back there.
    Except for 2009, which, in my opinion, did it's best in terms of stepping up its game and visibility. Unfortunately, that momentum wasn't carried through. 2009 was the best of the bunch, in my opinion.
     
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  17. Relayer1

    Relayer1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I certainly think they're getting progressively worse.

    I'm hoping the lack of success of Beyond leads to a drastic budget cut and thus a format rethink if there is a fourth film.
     
  18. Hey Missy

    Hey Missy Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Waiting too long (4 years!) to make "Into Darkness" is what killed the momentum that '09 had.
    Into Darkness was a financial success as well, but its excitement died faster than '09's.
     
  19. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    yes instead of Super8, Cowboys/Aliens etc maybe they should've quickly banged out STID for 2011/12 (Javier Barhem as Khan), then the third one in 2013/14 (Orcis Shatner time travel movie?) , then a 'Beyond' for 2016
     
  20. Spot261

    Spot261 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    This, I'm sorry but I just don't buy into the idea that the Kelvinverse has delivered, or even tried to deliver, on the aspects which made the shows great. They're pushed the big bangs and sexy, but ironically failed next to the MCU which has done a better job on that front AND given more intellectual content.
     
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