Why are the TOS movies better then the TNG movies?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by The Overlord, Sep 23, 2011.

  1. The Overlord

    The Overlord Captain Captain

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    In terms of a general consensus amongst film buffs, there have been several good TOS films, but only one good TNG film (First Contact).

    So why are TOS films better then the TNG films?
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2011
  2. Starbreaker

    Starbreaker Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The stories were pretty poor. Nothing more than oversized episodes.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2011
  3. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    The first TOS movie was an onscreen cast reunion after a ten year absence of new live-action ST stories. Everything was greatly upscaled, esp. the SPFX. Each movie was a huge anticipatory event for the fans (and general public).

    TNG went straight from a popular seven-year TV series to a series of overblown telemovies made for the big screen, which we had to pay $$$$ to see - while DS9, and then VOY, were still on free-to-air TV, essentially in competition. Ho hum. Only "First Contact" seemed to capture that cinematic experience that Paramount was seeking.
     
  4. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I can only say it was immensely disturbing to me when it was pointed out that "Nemesis" and "The Wrath of Khan" were both made about the same amount of time after their respective series started, and just comparing the energy level of the cast between the two. The TOS crew was more lively than that even in "The Undiscovered Country." And I'm (relatively) fond of "Nemesis."
     
  5. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    They look "bigger" visually (even though Generations kicks ass visually, too). More on par with the other science fiction films released at the same time. The stories are more interesting. And yeah, the characters are more likable. Or at least I don't like the focus on Picard and Data in all four TNG movies. If I needed to choose between Generations, Nemesis and The Final Frontier, I'd pick TFF first, Generations second, and pass on Nemesis.
     
  6. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

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    All of them feel like TV movies with the exception of TMP and STXI.
     
  7. Herbert

    Herbert Captain Captain

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    I believe that much of the success of the TOS movies is due to the participation of Nicholas Meyer.
     
  8. Donny

    Donny Captain Captain

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    I couldn't agree more. Nicholas Meyer knew how to direct a movie, and how to get really good acting out of Shatner. TWOK and TUC are my two favorite Trek films hands down. His darker, hard-edged militaristic approach really gave both those films a more dramatic look about them, which I believe TSFS was lacking, although I love that film too. The sets look a lot cheaper in the films he didn't direct.

    He also helped write IV, which is also considered one of the best (although I'm not too fond of it).

    The TNG films all suffered from a tired franchise, IMO, and because they didn't have the ensemble cast interplay that the TOS films had (for example, how all the TNG films were very Picard/Data centric)
     
  9. Gojira

    Gojira Commodore Commodore

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    I agree! I do like all of the movies but the first and most recent are the only ones to feel like a big production theatrical release.
     
  10. Balrog

    Balrog Commodore Commodore

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    I'm going to say it - Rick Berman.

    He should have stuck with television.
     
  11. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    um, I thought the TNG movies were a product of Braga, Moore, Piller, Spiner, and Logan.

    Was I misinformed?
     
  12. Agenda

    Agenda Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I can think of at least two reasons:

    -The TOS movies weren't afraid to take more risks with the main characters, which in turn made the films seem more worthwhile. For instance, Kirk tries to overcome the limitations of getting older, while Picard turns into a young-at-heart Rambo. Which character's struggle is more engaging?

    -I liked that some of the TOS movies were actually *about* something. They were morality tales that covered important issues of the time - to me, that was the heart of Star Trek as a series. You had a pro-environmental message with Voyage Home and an anti-cold war message with Undiscovered. The closest we got to a real issues-based flick with TNG was Insurrection, and I'm not really sure what that flick was about - the displacement indigenous populations? Not exactly a hot topic of the time.
     
  13. RyuRoots

    RyuRoots Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    They're not. TOS has 6 movies, and two good ones (TVH and TUC)

    TNG has 4 movies and two good ones (GEN and FC)

    TNG has a BETTER ratio, if anything. And frankly, nothing in INS or NEM touches the cartoonishly forced plot events of TWOK or the juvenile idiocy of TFF (although Insurrection tries, on that second one).
     
  14. Agenda

    Agenda Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Okey Dokey.
     
  15. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    TNG tried doing stuff with the characters. Data got the emotion chip. Riker and Troi got together.

    Picard lost his brother and nephew. Geordi traded in his VISOR.

    Dr. Crusher..... Dr. Crusher... er, um...
     
  16. RyuRoots

    RyuRoots Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I'm glad you're contributing so much to the thread by apparently enjoying my signature, but did you have any replies to my POST, perchance?
     
  17. xortex

    xortex Commodore

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    After seven seasons, Braga and Moore were lost and highly dispersed. TOS was steeped in tradition and older more experienced writers who knew how to write allegory not just metaphor however irrelevant it was in the TNG movies.
     
  18. Agenda

    Agenda Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Your signature shows just how biased you are against TOS, so in a way it is a reply to your post.
     
  19. Broccoli

    Broccoli Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Rick Berman served as executive producer for all the TNG films in addition to contributing to each film's story. In this role, he basically was the guy in charge of everything.
     
  20. KarmicCurse

    KarmicCurse Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    The TOS movies felt like movies. It's not so much a matter of special effects or sets as it is about pace and scale.

    The TNG movies felt like a TV show. I keep expecting a fade-out to a commercial. Also they were too kid friendly, as the sequel shows were way too often.
     

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