Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Lance, Jun 5, 2013.
Well, to be fair he didn't expect Picard to be stupid enough to go there himself.
Generations annoys me the most. The Nexus can send anyone anywhere back or forward in time. Picard's had a shit week:
- His uncle and nephew are dead
- Armagosa went nova, wiping out a star system
- Geordi was tortured by the Klingons
- Veridian went nova, wiping out a star system
- The Enterprise and her crew died in said supernova (although Picard may not have known this)
So he has the chance to go back and stop Soren; he could've gone back to 10 Forward and arrested him, preventing the loss the Armagosa star system.
He could've gone back a week and prevented the death of his family members.
So what does he do? Go back in time to 3 minutes before the trillithium device launches and tries to fight Soren exactly the same way but brings back a 67 year old guy to help.
But he's Picard's clone! He should have known that Picard would go to the planet because that's what he'd do!
If I had reviewed that script before production, I would have made some serious alterations to it. Just for Enterprise, I'd have Riker call Picard and apprise him of the situation, so that when he came back from the Nexus he could warn the Enterprise, they would chase the Klingon ship away and blow the hell out of Soran's installation.
Kirk lives, Enterprise is saved. Yay for everyone.
There is an even bigger plot hole in TFF, It said that there were other ships are in the area, but command specfically wanted Kirk. Given that the Ent wasn't really fit for duty, all that had to do was given Kirk command of one of the starships for the duration of the mission.
Watched TSFS earlier with my girlfriend and she spotted a plot hole, of sorts - I told her near the end of the film that Spock's homeworld was one of the main Federation planets, and she asked how the Enterprise crew got to land on Vulcan without being arrested by the Feds for terrorism offences, let alone walk about freely to watch a religious ceremony...
Spock has family in high places. See: Amok Time.
The Federation has never been very smart, security-wise. There's never a ship near Earth, and the Breen manage to bombard the very center of the Federation.
Yup. I don't know how someone can argue against GEN for worst plot-hole offender.
The entire third act is a plot hole.
Regarding Reliant not knowing the difference between Ceti Alpha V and Ceti Alpha VI... it just occured to me that Chekov doesn't think to mention Khan until they get down onto the planet. Sure, it's been 15+ years, but surely if one of humanity's most badass super enhanced villains (who actually brought Earth to its knees) was once stranded on a planet in the Ceti Alpha system, you'd think Chekov would at least tell Captain Terrell and the rest about him. Instead it's like he sees the Botany Bay name and he shits his pants. "Oh fuck, I knew there was something I'd forgotten about this star system!"
Basically the entire plot hinges on Chekov being a bit of an idiot.
ST-TWOK: McCoy forgetting to scan Chekhov and Terrell with a tricorder after they told him they had both been infected by Khan with a mind controlling bug!
The Romulans have two pieces of knowledge about future events.
One would be from interrogations and "mind sifting" of the survivors of the Enterprise-C (in particular Tasha Yar) in 2344, who could tell them about Picard, the Enterprise crew, the Enterprise-D, and the future strategic situation in the quadrant... with a twist: In this alternate universe, the Federation is much more militaristic due to being in a constant state of war and is on the verge of being conquered by the Klingons.
The Romulans might have based their whole strategy around this glimpse of what they didn't know was an alternate future. They take an even more aggressive stance toward the Klingons, they return to the galactic stage, they build massive ships twice the size of the Enterprise-D for intimidation purposes, and they begin formulating a plan to replace high level captains (and possibly others) like Picard with clones.
The other glimpse of the future would be from Romulan captain Telek R'Mor in 2351 who made contact with the USS Voyager in the future through a micro-wormhole and could give them technical observations, scans of the ship, the crew's personal messages to their families and official reports to Starfleet, and vague details about the Federation's future.
Excelsior, I put down to Scotty programming the engines to put the ship into a parking orbit with the station before they conk out. The rest was sound effects programmed by the old miracle worker.
This. You beat me to it.
What terroist offense did they commit?
They were charged with
Theft of Federation Property (USS Enterprise)
Destruction of Federation Property (USS Enterprise)
Sabotage of Federation property (USS Excelsior
Disobeying Starfleet Orders
Assult on Federation Officers (at least 3 counts)
If they had commited a terrorist offense why weren't they charged with one.
Chill, that's just the off-hand comment my girlfriend made when watching the film with me (she literally hadn't seen anything Trek before apart from TWOK and the Abramsverse films), with a hint of sarcasm, I mean in the real world it seems like nearly everything criminal is a terrorism offence these days. We haven't gotten to watching, or rewatching in my case, TVH yet.
Just rewatched The Wrath of Khan and while still great, it's awfully convenient that Khan didn't go to the transporter room yet Kirk did (especially with it having the last coordinates noted); also kind of weird that Khan didn't understand the "code" when Spock pretty much announced its meaning.
That is not a plot hole, as the nameplate muck does not challenge story credibility. Yours is just a complaint.
Being a genius does not make one a master of space battle strategy. Kirk had decades of experience kicking butt in all manner of methods. That allowed to him to see options where Khan only saw wound+hunt=death.
When was the last time Starfleet was in the area--or paid attention to every natural event? From "Space Seed," we get the impression the system is remote, hence the reason Kirk used it as the location to deposit Khan and his followers.
Remember, Kirk offered to beam himself aboard--along with info on Genesis. Once Kirk used that breathing room as a means of attack, with the Enterprise leaving the area, Khan was more interested in mass destruction, with Kirk at the top of the list. Khan's vanity prodded him into wanting to out-captain THE captain in battle, thus his fate was sealed.
Magical? We have no idea how a terraforming technology will operate in the late 23rd century, so the Genesis device falls under the description of projection, if anything.
According to..? No one ever said ST was mysticism or religion free, and since Vulcan is an alien culture, you have no position on which to claim there's anything out of the norm for the ST concept.
Not a plot hole in the least.
All organic material--the planet, and anything "born" on it was aging rapidly--like the planet.
Again, not a plot hole.
You're kidding--right? This is Star Trek, not NOVA. This is the same ST where never-gonna-happen transporters, warp drive, space stations the size of a small town exist. It is sci-fi, not a physics instruction manual.
Again, no plot hole.
You say you love the old movies, but you capped off your argument with a protective post about the assbrained nuTrek films, which are to classic ST what the Star Wars prequels were to the original trilogy: a CG final exam with no heart, or much sense.
Picard was simply only one of many Starfleet officers to be replaced. And twenty years before Nemesis he was already Captain of the Stargazer.
No time travel needed to explain it.
I was under the impression that Shinzon had had accelerated aging. No ? Haven't seen it in a while.
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