What's with the Uniforms?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies XI+' started by Bry_Sinclair, Apr 12, 2012.

  1. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2001
    Location:
    Ferguson, Missouri, USA
    Not really. Seems fairly straightforward.
    The aforementioned noncom stripe (descriptions can vary). Garrison was said to be a chief warrant officer, so having a stripe like that would correspond with that.
    You mean on some hazard team vests? Those aren't rank stripes. Firefighters wear similar wide stripes on their jackets (they reflect light, which comes in handy in dark, hard-to-see environments).
    I don't believe her rank was ever mentioned onscreen though, so I'll go with the no stripes meaning enlisted.
    There was also a commander rank during that time.
     
  2. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Location:
    New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
    The skant does has a divide in it. And there's probably a regulation jockstrap/undergarment underneath. :vulcan:
     
  3. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    Imagine how Data would feel (provided he had his emotion chip) whenever Riker wore a skant and propped his foot on the ledge of Data's console...
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2012
  4. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Location:
    The visitor's bullpen
    I always assumed that the rank of Commander was created to depict the officer who actually runs the ship - the Captain used to be just the one who OWNS the ship and did not actively command it. Is this what you were meaning?
     
  5. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2007
    Location:
    inside teacake
    This is the most repulsive thing I've ever read.

    Thankfully there is NO RIKER in NuTrek :D
     
  6. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    #istandwithcbs
    ^Just for that, JJ's gonna put Cupcake in a skant, and give him a chair next to Kirk.
     
  7. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2001
    Location:
    Ferguson, Missouri, USA
    Nope, there was an actual rank of commander between lieutenant and captain during those times. But it was also used as a title for the captain of any vessel.

    A general rule of thumb was that the first officer oversaw the day-to-day operations of a vessel while the captain was in charge of its overall mission and any orders assigned to her from fleet command.
     
  8. ROBE

    ROBE Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    I always thought it was stupid that an ensign had no rank stripe, this was corrected in TMP when ensigns got Lt. Jg rank stripe as the higher rank seem to have vanished.
    Okay in the Royal Navy midshipmen who are equal to US Navy ensigns have no stripe but they do have a button and white patch to show their rank.
     
  9. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2001
    Location:
    Ferguson, Missouri, USA
    It probably would have been better in TOS if there had been separate uniforms for officers and enlisted, but ensigns and crewmen were indistinguishable from one another. At one point, I thought the department-colored coveralls were enlisted uniforms, but we saw officers (such as Lieutenant Kyle) wearing them too.
     
  10. ROBE

    ROBE Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    This also lead to some publications thinking that ensigns and enlisted are one and the same.
    The guy who designed WOK uniforms new what he was doing.
    One uniform for officers and another for ratings, clear insignia for petty officers etc and clear insignia for officers.
    Also white for command, yellow for engineering, grey for science, light green for medical, dark green for security, light blue for services and red for officer cadets and trainee ratings.
    Just a pity nobody seemed to follow his notes when doing manuals or later movies.
     
  11. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Location:
    T'Girl
    Sure there is, the date of his birth was changed along with nuChekov's by the arrival of the Narada. He'll be in Star Trek Twelve/Two.

    Not quite, Captain Pike actually described the Federation with those terms, which is a little scary.

    Pike: "You understand what the Federation is, don't you? It's important. It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada."

    I took that to mean that Starfleet was like the Israeli and Canadian military, where there are internal divisions for things like the navy, the army, so forth. But without there being completely separate branches. The forces are integrated.

    Purple suits.

    :)
     
  12. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only time Mr Kyle wore a jumpsuit was Mirror Mirror. So likely Kyle is an officer in the Prime Universe, but enlisted in the MU.

    Of course, then there's Mr Leslie who did wear both uniforms in the Prime Universe. Of course, Leslie wore different uniform colours, was referred to by several names, worked at least three different departments, frequently canged his rank stripes between Ensign and Lieutenant, and even continued eporting for duty after being killed, so maybe he isn't the best precedent to cite.

    I love TWOK's uniforms, they are probably among the coolest in all Trek. But they are confusing as hell. As big a Trek nerd as I am, I've never been able to figure out the department colours beyond white for command and red for cadets, and the only rank insignia I can identify are the ones for Captain and Admiral. I'm glad Trek eventually reverted to a simpler division colour code and simpler rank identification.

    Not the first time Star Trek has sloppily referred to Starfleet and the Ferderation as one and the same, and probably won't be the last.

    Although essentially correct, it's a bit more complicated than that. Canada does have seperate rank structures for its Army, Navy and Air Force. But yes, the entire military is considered one whole organization, with there being only one actual chief of staff.
     
  13. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2001
    Location:
    Ferguson, Missouri, USA
    Yeah, you're wrong.:D

    Kyle wore a jumpsuit--either blue or red--in many of his appearances in TOS, including "Space Seed,"
    "Tomorrow Is Yesterday," and "City On The Edge of Forever."
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2012
  14. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Location:
    New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
    Doesn't Uhura wear a coverall when she's under the console fixing something?

    "Keep your eye on the ball, Data."

    "Ah, a saying from old Earth, Sir?"
     
  15. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2001
    Location:
    Ferguson, Missouri, USA
    Yep (although she was wearing it over her regular uniform). Spock also wore one when he was laid up in sickbay. It was sorta like a general utility outfit, IMO.
     
  16. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2001
    Location:
    Out of my brain on the 5:15
    I don't recall the TOS dress uniforms having any rank insignia, unless the collar/stripe means something. Though, Spock, Kirk and Stone all sport the same collar/stripe while holding different ranks.
     
  17. ROBE

    ROBE Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    RE dress uniforms. Scotty and McCoy as Lt Commanders had thin gold stripes around their colars and fronts.
    Spock while same rank was acting up to Commander and had a thick gold stripe. Kirk had two additional thin gold stripes running down from his colar to his arms, so I resume this shows he is captain. The commodore had two thin gold stripes running down each arm from colar shoulder to cuff.
    So ranks from Lt Commander to Commodore were shown.
    The only Lts ever seen in dress were the female prosecutor who wore a shiney female uniform with a longer skirt, thin gold stripe around her black colar, star base symbol and lt rank stripes on her cuffs.

    As usual later on. They messed things up by having a Commodore wear the same dress uniform as Kirk and a Lt and head of security wear a Lt Commanders dress uniform (although he may have been acting up like Spock?).
     
  18. Takeru

    Takeru Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2007
    I don't think he did, while he thought about a gazillion division colors and rank insignia, he forgot to make them noticeable, when I watched the movies as a kid I didn't even realize the division colors still existed, I thought they were all wearing red, even today I have no idea what most division colors mean and I never figured out the rank insignia, I can't even describe them.

    Show me a picture of an extra from any series and I can tell you rank and division, show me an extra from movies 2-6 and all I can tell you that this person serves in Starfleet, wears a red jacket and probably sweats like a pig if he has to wear it all day.
     
  19. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2001
    Location:
    Ferguson, Missouri, USA
    In a real sense, the rank pins used on the TWOK uniforms are no different than the rank pins used by the U.S. armed services in which you have to be familiar with what the individual insignias means. To someone not versed in them, they're just a bunch of meaningless pins too.

    I didn't really have a problem with the undershirt branch colors, though.
     
  20. ROBE

    ROBE Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    I had no problem with the department colours or rank insignia.
    The only complaint i would have is the rank insignia of rear admiral to admiral is too similar, i believe this is why they added bars to the coloured strap worn by admirals on left arm.

    Modern US military often wear small insignia on their shoulders or collars.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2012

Share This Page