Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by jpch, Dec 28, 2012.
oh come on, I think even dedicated fans of TOS would admit they relied on formulas A LOT.
-Kirk battles a supercomputer(and tricks it with logic puzzles)?
-they beam down to a parallel Earth planet?
-they face an alien creature with God-like powers, or that practically IS a God?
I think it's unquestionable that TOS relied a lot on some key plot formulas a lot, but that was probably a result of a lot of different factors.(the parallel Earth culture plot was very handy to save money, for example)
In order of preference:
1. Deep space nine. Great and deep story arcs & insight in characters from alien worlds, dark atmosphere. Sometimes somewhat too much soap-like though.
2. TOS - I used to have TNG second place but these have switched places lately. TOS characters are just slightly more vibrant to me (of course Kirk/Spock / McCoy, but also scoundrels you can't really hate, like Mudd).
3. TNG - Great stories, but sometimes too politically correct, and too much pluche (so to speak). Everybody loves classical music onboard the enterprise-D ?
For me, the first three are close together, the largest gap in preference is between 3 and 4.
4. ENT - going before where TOS and TNG went. Or something like that. Still liked the concept of the 22nd century alpha quadrant, though. A lot more could have been done with it, I think.
5. VOY. Not bad. Just average. Still a lot of standout eps I like to watch.
Star Trek: The Original Series
There is just a 'fun factor' that TOS has that the other series lack. It seemed like the later series bought into the hype that they were something more than entertainment.
Yeah they used similar plots and plot elements from time to time but are those "concepts" he's referring to?
Just how many Parallel Earths were there? Miri's World, Omega IV. "Terra Roma" for sure. The Nazi one was the result of Human interference and not the native culture. Same for the Gangsters in "A Piece of the Action".
God like aliens seems to be a staple of all the shows. (Q, the Dowd, the Prophets, the Caretaker)
wow so many DS9 fans... come on TNG and VOY people vote XD
My list just for the heck of it:
1. The Original Series
3. The Next Generation
4. Deep Space Nine
I'm at a point where I can't pick complete series for slots two thru five anymore. I have to pick season(s) because the shows changed dramatically through the years they were on...
2. The Next Generation seasons one and two
3. Enterprise season four
4. Voyager season two
5. Deep Space Nine seasons three and four.
Yes, that's an extremely good point - certain seasons from shows lower on my list may very well best those from higher ranked iterations. I guess I just attempted to come up with an aggregate to produce an overall list.
I understand, I'm just getting nitpicky in my old age!
I don't know if it's been done, but a poll of all 30 seasons with the option to give a mark on, say, a ten scale, would be great. Then an overall aggregate would provide a definitive BBS "decison" on the favourite show! I'm not sure if this can actually be implemented here though?
4-TOS-I don't like Shatner at all
I'll answer his questions as best as I can.
Practically every episode has a love interest for Captain Kirk. Usually it's the random alien women he meets.
Then there's other characterizations that are basically caricatures, like Chekov, and Scotty.
It seems also that every episode had to have a hand to hand fist fight with Kirk and a baddie, with that famous fight music behind them trumpeting along.
And a lot of the episode were just pure 60's cornball, like finding a planet full of mobsters, or a planet exactly like Earth but with children.
None of this is meant to put down the show BTW. I like it, and will enjoy the good stuff in it, even if "formulaic" stuff gets grating.
I won't, however, specifically put in an episode of TOS on my TV to watch. I will do this with my favorite TNG episodes though.
That seems to be the general idea of what TOS is (and the idea the new film remake is built on), but if you actually watch all 79 episodes, it turns out this isn't the case at all. Except for the cornball. I personally can't watch one episode of the show without cringing. But that's just because the 60s science fiction really isn't my thing.
Welcome to the 1960s.
Kirk was the romantic lead, of course he will meet and fall in love with women. Though, just glancing through Season One there are very few episodes where Kirk actually falls in love. Most of the time he was using his charms to attain a goal. Other times there's no "love interest" at all. I'd say COTEOF was the first time he fell in love. And that was with a human. Kirk's reputation as a lothario bagging alien women is exaggerated.
Didn't people on the other shows meet guest stars and fall love too? I recall Picard, Riker, Crusher and LaForge having one off romances.
At least Chekov and Scotty had that to play with. Think about the non entities like LaForge, Kim or Mayweather. I think Scotty was more than a caricature. He does more than get drunk and play the pipes.
Yeah it was an action adventure show, so there were fights. They did those on the other shows too. Did they use the classic fight theme for every fight? I don't recall that they did.
Your definition of "cornball" is odd. The mobsters were a result of cultural contamination. The children were actually hundreds of years old and the result of biological warfare.
The modern day shows simply shifted those type of plots to the holodeck. Where more often than not, something would go wrong.
TOS, TNG and DS9 are 3 of the best television series ever aired. Right now I'd class DS9 as my favourite. The one Trek series that fully seized it's potential. Excellent science-fiction and character drama.
Since we all like to make lists:
1. TNG: best written series, likeable cast all around.
2. TOS: at the time it was brilliant, and some episodes still shine on to this day.
3. DS9(action): pew-pew!
4. ENT: had potential, but got cut short right when it was building up; best pilot ep of all; definetely grows on you.
5. VOY: inconsistent, cheesy, premise doesn't really work, most characters are either bland (Kim, Janeway) or annoying (Neelix, Kes, Chakotay, B'elana, Paris)... you know you've got a problem when the most interesting character is the emotionless Vulcan.
Very few stand-out episodes.
6. DS9(religious propaganda): as terrible as "7th heaven" at times, and that's saying a lot.
The original Star Trek is the only series I still enjoy without reservations. I think it stands the test of time much better than all the other series, is much more dynamic and imaginative and isn't bogged down by byzantine continuity and hackneyed storytelling conventions.
Deep Space 9 had a lot going for it, including a terrific cast and, from time to time, truly ambitious writing, but as I grow older I can't take it as seriously as I used to.
There are some nuggets of brilliance to be found in Enterprise, but they are few and far between.
I always hated Voyager and I can't watch The Next Generation anymore.
DS9, simply because it was epic
TOS. If for no other reason, none of the rest of it would have existed without it. It has a great blen of characters and storytelling. Doesn't get bogged down in a lot of the inertia of much of the later series.
DSN is a very close second for me. I think that it, especially in the later seasons, came closest of any of the other post-TOS Trek series to capturing the spirit of TOS.
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