What do you dislike about The Dark Knight?

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by T'Baio, Dec 18, 2008.

  1. JacksonArcher

    JacksonArcher Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2001
    I thought that too, but if you notice, the other side of the road is also blocked off. I've seen the film four times now, and trust me, I noticed the other side of the street being blocked off, so the convoy had no other choice but to take the lower route.

    The cops do notify the SWAT van of the garbage truck, but Joker's semi pummeled it into the river and then proceeded to quickly dispatch the other remaining cop cars. It's not like they had much time to coordinate anything, since the moment they arrive in Lower Wacker, the garbage truck arrives, and then quickly after that so does The Joker.

    I think you just answered your own question.

    I'll agree with this. I also found the lack of music to assist in making the sequence feel less engaging and more plodding along, as you say. It's not as efficient or engaging a sequence as the car chase in Batman Begins, for example.

    Perhaps. I liked the quieter scenes in The Dark Knight just fine, though, whether or not it was Alfred consoling or offering advice to Bruce, or Rachel talking to Alfred about the nature of heroism or when she's alone with both Bruce and Dent...I thought they were plenty of quieter moments that easily outshined the moments in Batman Begins. I think my favorite "quiet scene" is after Rachel is killed and Bruce is in his penthouse, and Alfred consoles him. It's a clear homage to the scene where Alfred consoles a much younger Bruce after the death of his parents, and the music even mirrors that scene, almost cue to cue.

    I think the character in itself is just weak and not as interesting or well-developed as the others, but that's my personal opinion. I don't think Gyllenhaal did any better, but I think she did pull off the assertive, spunky, capable woman more than Holmes did. I also fret the way Holmes would have handled the warehouse sequence.

    Some of the music is lost in the film, but listen to the soundtrack, and especially the expanded soundtrack. Batman is given a full-fledged theme and a "sound" (a la The Joker) and some of the action beats are much more realized and enjoyable. While I will agree that the only interesting themes are the ones carried from Batman Begins, I think Harvey Dent's tragic theme is pretty good.
     
  2. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    It looked to me like Dent was trying to wiggle loose of the binds he was in or probably even trying to break the chair and he just simply fell over and knocked over the fuel can in the process.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2008
  3. JacksonArcher

    JacksonArcher Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2001
    That's what I got from it too. That it was accidental. That and the liquid fuel that toppled over and managed to only wet half of his face was merely coincidence and perhaps...fate. ;)
     
  4. Kryton

    Kryton Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Location:
    In ur Starbug
    I would have liked to see a courthouse acid-toss on Dent by Boss Moxon (or really, whomever). Either way the event still turns the DA's sensibilities on edge, but as long as they were already IN a big trial, using the original Two-Face creation would have been easily accomplished.

    Of course, they called him "Harvey Kent" in his first few appearances before deciding to change that to avoid confusion with a certain "Clark" with the same last name. ;)
     
  5. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    I thought the devlopment of Two-Face in this movie is very, very well done. If anything that's a "dislike" about TDK on two fronts. On the first front there's no "development" of The Joker's evil. He just is, and granted Heath Ledger does a great job of it, but we watch Harvey's change over from a brillant and stable DA, to his near break-down with the pyscho caputred at the parade/memorial for the old Comissioner and finally to his collapse after getting half his face burned off.

    It's a shame that at this point it doesn't look likely we'll see Dent return as his evil was really well built up in this movie.
     
  6. Snaploud

    Snaploud Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2001
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Batman was a cop-killer by the end of the first movie. He must have killed at least a few of them by the end of the Batman Begins car chase.
     
  7. T'Baio

    T'Baio Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2001
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I'm a big fan of the Batmobile's "Intimidate" mode, in which he blows a public parking garage half to hell (wonder how many civilians were trapped in the eventual collapse, HAH!) and destroys several citizens cars. :rolleyes:

    Intimidate who, exactly?
     
  8. Kryton

    Kryton Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Location:
    In ur Starbug
    Those Nissan Versa lovers over at Heroes?
     
  9. broberfett

    broberfett Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2002
    Location:
    Relaxing in Slave I listening to Holy Diver
    His stupid voice change when he is Batman.
     
  10. Kaijufan

    Kaijufan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2004
    Location:
    Amana, Iowa
    The major problem I had was that the lawyer who found the plans for the Tumbler seemed to know that Bruce Wayne was Batman, which is essentially confirmed by Lucius Fox. All he knows is that Wayne Enterprise provides Batman with his technology.

    Actually I think it would be far more likely that Batman is a average/non rich and famous citizen, but is just funded by someone rich, like Wayne.

    As I've stated before I dislike the Tumbler and the motorcycle. I'm really hoping he gets a new Batmobile in the next film and it's not another Tumbler.

    I was also hoping that Harley Quinn would be in the movie, I was pretty disappointed the Joker didn't have her helping him.


    I like his Batman voice, it really adds to his Batman persona. The only problem I had with it were that a couple of lines that are sort of hard to understand. One example is early in the movie when a fake Batman asks him what is the difference between them and he says "I don't wear a hockey mask" (which was a bad line in the first place, it should of been something like "I don't use guns" or "I don't kill people"). However I had no problems understanding 99% of his lines.
     
  11. Aragorn

    Aragorn Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2002
    ^ I didn't like that conversation between Fox and Reed either. You would've only needed two more lines of dialogue and then continue the scene as written. Something like...

    Fox: "You think Wayne Enterprises is funding the Batman?"

    Reed: "No, Bruce Wayne is Batman."
     
  12. T'Baio

    T'Baio Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2001
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    He actually said; "I'm not wearing hockey pads." His point was that he has the means to do what he does relatively safely and professionally, for lack of a better term.

    Safely for him, that is, not the many civilians who may have been injured by flying shrapnel from the parked cars he blew out of his way while riding the Apple Bat-Pod.
     
  13. The Borgified Corpse

    The Borgified Corpse Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2000
    Location:
    Ouch! Forgotten already? You were just down ther
    Actually, it's possible that Lucius Fox gave away Bruce Wayne's cover. You're right. At that point, all Reese knows is that Lucius Fox is secretly providing Batman with equipment. It's Lucius that connects the dots for him by suggesting that "one of the richest, most powerful men in the world" is the same man who "spends his nights beating criminals to a pulp with his bare hands." Your bad, Lucius! Take the shame, mate.

    As for Harley Quinn, I still think there's posibilities for putting her in a sequel as an obsessive fangirl who sees herself as the Joker's soulmate. Perhaps she can even act as the Joker's surrogate while the Joker is in prison (allowing the Joker to have a presence in the film without recasting the late Heath Ledger).
     
  14. MyCylon

    MyCylon Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Location:
    Am I a Cylon?
    You really made me uncertain there for a moment so I popped the DVD back in and checked again. The other side of the road, as far as I can tell from the available shots, is perfectly clear.
    Apologies for the bad image quality. I think the burning fire truck is clearly visible. But I think you can also see that there is nothing blocking the other side of the road (left of the down ramp), neither on the height of the fire truck nor further behind:

    [​IMG]


    Music is definitely lacking in the scene, agreed.


    I suppose it's really a question of preference, in the end. I do like the scenes you mention but they just never manage to touch me emotionally the way the ones in BB did.


    I definitely agree that the character is pretty weak in both movies. It's a real shame that these movies which are so much more dedicated to characters and the story than many of their Hollywood counterparts are unable to produce even one truly convincing female character.


    I'm basing my opinion purely on the movie since I don't own the soundtrack. But I can definitely imagine that it's good seeing as how good the music for the first film was.
    A shame then that some of it is lost. I remember the same thing happening with the music for "Jurassic Park: Lost World".
     
  15. JacksonArcher

    JacksonArcher Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2001
    I just watched the film on Blu-ray and if you look a little ahead, there are vehicles on the road up ahead. The picture just cuts it off where the intersection lies. Trust me.
     
  16. suarezguy

    suarezguy Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2008
    Location:
    Albuquerque, NM, USA
    I actually thought Caine sounded a bit too condescending when he explained to Rachel "He chose not to be a hero."
     
  17. Timby

    Timby LIKE LIGHTNIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIING Administrator

    Joined:
    May 28, 2001
    To be entirely fair, even if I were to accept your assertions, I shouldn't need to watch a Blu-ray Disc version of a movie to get the whole thing.

    I love The Dark Knight, but the move down to Gotham's equivalent of Lower Wacker Drive is not an excuse for poor scripting and editing.
     
  18. Kaijufan

    Kaijufan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2004
    Location:
    Amana, Iowa
    It sure looked like he killed some cops in that chase, though there's no way he did, Gordon wouldn't be willing to work with him if he did, and the cops would of actually been trying to figure out who he is.

    I would imagine that in the next one Gordon will continue to work with him in private since he knows that Batman didn't actually kill anyone, but they wont be able to work together when cops are around (like in the bank or at the jail in the Dark Knight).

    The cops may actually set traps for him in the next film, though I imagine Gordon will warn him about the traps in advanced so he doesn't get caught/killed.

    Hopefully he'll get a less destructive vehicle in the next movie. Driving around in a tank just isn't safe for the people around him.

    Maybe they could even go with the Batman TAS origin and have Harley be an Arkham Asylum psychiatrist twisted into a female Joker by the Joker. They wouldn't even need to show he with the Joker, she could tell Batman or someone her origin and it would be believable. I do have my doubts she'll appear in the sequel though, I think they'll move in a different direction and go with some of the other classic villians.
     
  19. JacksonArcher

    JacksonArcher Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2001
    No, if there was a bigger picture, you would be able to notice the cars up ahead.

    The acting commissioner in the film even said, and I quote, "The roads will be cleared along your route", and the flaming fire truck obstructed their route. They could not deviate to the other side of the street because it was not blocked. Diverting down to Lower Wacker was the only available option.
     
  20. paudemge

    paudemge Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Gordan faking his death is probably the only thing that bothered me. Dent dieing would be bad for a comic book, but remember even if Batman continues to rake in the bucks, there still will be relatively few stories shown in the movies, they won't need to repeat any villain. And I like that the joker just shows up not explanation, basically just a force of chaos and evil.

    And as far as the blocked road, you might have been able to see it in the theater also, I don't remember; I remember that scene didn't bother me at the time, and stuff like that would usually bother me.
     

Share This Page