Was Voyager better?

Discussion in 'Voyager' started by USS Kongo, Dec 18, 2012.

  1. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    er, considering that there was a good number of Maquis crewmembers who had been stranded by and were taking orders from a Federation captain, I don't think that complaint is without merit.
     
  2. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    "The difference between men and women is friction. Friction, friction, friction, orgasm! ...Fishism."
     
  3. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I never got this. Where was this "chemistry"?

    Janeway was a tyrant at times. Chakotay didn't have a pulse. The EMH was treated as an object for much of Voyager's run, so say nothing of how rude he was. Torres was hostile to everyone to the point of violence at times. Paris was really the only guy that could get along with most everyone, but even he sparred with Neelix, the EMH, Chakotay and his own wife at times. Everyone made fun of poor Harry Kim, Voyager's whipping boy. Neelix was in your face about everything to the point of being overbearing. Seven was confrontational with pretty much everyone.

    Kes and Tuvok are the only ones who get a pass on this being they were the two least confrontational people on the ship. Kes really was the only genuinely friendly person on the ship, and Tuvok's Vulcan logic keeps him non confrontational usually. Though even he had a hard time getting the Maquis to respect him.

    Now, did this drama make Voyager more interesting at times than the TNG crew? Sure. But to say they had good chemistry is a stretch.
     
  4. Ln X

    Ln X Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Don't worry, only the DS9ers are the ones wishing for more friction. But seriously VOY didn't have that edge which TOS or DS9 had.

    Overall I would say VOY is a bit more better than TNG, due to a more consistent theme, however TNG had far more stand out episodes which were totally awesome. I always believe that VOY was what TNG should have been barring the screwed up continuity and multiple timelines and resets...
     
  5. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    "Hoary" describes every discussion we have here! That's why we get so off track, wore the track out long ago.
     
  6. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The theme was consistent because the reset button continually returned the storyline to first principles each week.

    It's like in Casper cartoons. He has no friends. He's sad. He makes some friends. He's happy. Next week he has no friends. What the hell did Casper do, where did Casper bury all those kids that agreed to be his friend and play with him? Casper is into some seriously fucked up shit in the weekend I can tell you.
     
  7. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    No arguments from me. I have had a helluva lot more fun with Voyager. Yeah TNG has far more big episodes that make you think about big issues but I'm not actually showing up to Trek to think. I want a romp, not a lecture.
     
  8. lurok

    lurok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    thank you :) I've always said the reason I enjoy VOY more than other series (even if they are dramatically better) is the VOY crew/actors seem so much nicer, and funnier. You know...human :p
     
  9. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    But if you took out all that stuff, you'd only have about two seasons worth of material! But they'd be very good seasons. :p
     
  10. The Overlord

    The Overlord Captain Captain

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    Don't see how, Harry Kim was a loser with almost zero personality that Harry Kim whom Janeway seems give arbitrary and cruel punishments to (giving him a reprimand for getting an STD) and Chakotay a big wuss who acted like a door mat and Janeway would either ignore him or punish him if he suggested anything that was contrary to her way of thinking. Janeway seemed like a my way or the highway type leader. Also Neeelix seemed to be there just to get on everyone's nerves, he didn't really add any chemistry.

    Its also hard to have chemistry with a pair of characters who have such one note personalities. Also the crew's devotion to Janeway sometimes comes across as cultish rather then family like. Also she seems to brook very little in the way of dissent, like when the Doctor tried to remove her from command in "Year of Hell" and she threaten to delete him.

    The TNG characters seemed far more dynamic and less dysfunctional. Picard may have been distant at times, but he didn't give out arbitrary punishments and was far more willing to listen to his crew then Janeway was. Also Picard warmed to his crew over time, he was very distant in the first season, but very close to them by the 7th season. Janeway never had that character development, she was constantly bipolar, taking widely different positions in different episodes and she never did lose that my way or the high way attitude. She should have been very strict and authoritarian at first, but become more relaxed in her command over time. That's why I like the TNG crew better, there was more character development.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2012
  11. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    TNG was the far better show than Voyager, but that had most to do with two things: Patrick Stewart, and the writing of individual episodes. Otherwise I think the intellectually progressive nature of the show is what makes it stand out as 'special'. TNG was something special and unique, Voyager was just a pretty good spaceship show.

    Voyager, however, has the better secondary cast. TNG's Roddenberry box was a double-edged blade. On one hand, Starfleet officers should seem like consumate professionals, not catty drama queens. On the other hand, it would have benefited from characters to counterbalance Picard and Worf's stiff introversion that weren't just exaggerated female stereotypes. Voyager's cast had so much untapped potential. Chakotay conformed immediately, Kim never did anything but shut up and do his duty. B'elana's rough edges never showed through after the eighth episode or so, Paris's showed up for one episode here and there then went away. But even the neglected characters got me more invested than characters like Troi or Laforge.

    If Voyager stuck to its premise it could have been something more special, but it decided in the end just to try to be TNG only without the commitment of message.
     
  12. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Voyager "true to it's premise" = Stargate Universe. And we saw how that turned out.

    the only thing the Next Generation crew had in common was brightly coloured spandex. The Voyager crew were a small community with a shared goal. It made all the difference. Their interactions were more realistic, less sterile than TNG.
     
  13. Creatre

    Creatre Ensign Newbie

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    I felt like TNG had the better stories, DS9 the better characterization and interaction, and Voyager had the best "fuzziness." What I mean by that is I could sit down and watch a horrible episode (which there were many in Voyager), and I would still smile or feel good by watching it. There was something about the series that just made you feel good and take you out of the real world when watching it. Like has already been said in this thread, I think it may have had to do something with how the other series were so serious, and this one just felt more loose somehow.
     
  14. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    If I want good stories with seriousness, characterization, interaction AND fuzziness I'll take TOS. Granted the fuzziness part is the fuzziness of time which sentimentalizes it into an old friend.
     
  15. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    I would disagree and say DSN had the best secondary cast for the most part, Dukat, Damar, Weyoun, Garak to name just a few. As for it's primary cast most of them got developed well, had episodes focused on them. True some more than others.
     
  16. Creatre

    Creatre Ensign Newbie

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    I agree, well said.
     
  17. You_Will_Fail

    You_Will_Fail Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Tuvok would smack you across the face for that "logic".
     
  18. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think that's part of the appeal.
     
  19. lurok

    lurok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I just think comparing DS9 and VOY is like comparing...oh, I don't know...chalk and cheese.
     
  20. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    That can be taken in many different ways :lol: