Was the Enterprise A actually the Yorktown?

Discussion in 'Trek Tech' started by CharlieZardoz, Jul 18, 2013.

  1. CharlieZardoz

    CharlieZardoz Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Hi all! Thought I'd throw this one in for general discussion. It was suggested that the Enterprise A could not have been built in so quick a time that the ship was actually the Yorktown renamed. This theory however was put forth by Gene Roddenberry and I actually don't consider him the utmost authority on these matters Tbh lol. He also suggested that only a few Galaxy classes would ever be built and well we know that turned out to be untrue. Also it is very likely that Starfleet had many Constitution refits on the assembly line by the time of Star Trek IV-VI (such as the Endeavor, Ahwahnee and Emden so I'm think it was most likely a new ship and not refurbished as Roddenberry suggested. What say you all? :)
     
  2. Captain Nebula

    Captain Nebula Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    According to Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise, it was the Ti-Ho that was renamed to Enterprise-A.
     
  3. Dukhat

    Dukhat Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    While there is no exact canon answer to your question, the visual evidence seems to indicate that the Enterprise-A was a brand-new ship. As for when it was actually built, probably not long before the end of Star Trek IV.

    It's my personal belief that in Star Trek III, when Admiral Morrow informs the crew that the Enterprise will be decommissioned, that Starfleet had every intention of eventually building a new Excelsior class Enterprise-A to replace it. But because of "extenuating circumstances," another ship was hurriedly given the name while the Excelsior class ship would eventually be the B. Once the B was completed, the A was decommissioned and renamed something else (hey, it's a perfectly good ship, why not?)
     
  4. MOSUGOJI

    MOSUGOJI Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Maybe after the E-A was decommissioned it was placed in Starfleets' Museum or something. Probably in the downstairs gift shop .
     
  5. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    IIRC, Roddenberry proposed the idea to explain how Starfleet conveniently had another Constitution-class ship ready to go for Kirk and because Yorktown was a name originally proposed when he originally conceived Trek.
    At the time TNG was introduced, the Galaxy-class was still a fairly new design. It's definitely plausible (if not logical) that at the beginning of the series, only a few were in service with more built towards the end of it. But for all intents and purposes, even with the several additional Galaxy-class ships we've seen after TNG, their numbers to other ship designs could still be considered low, IMO.
    Pick what theory works for you, because there definitely isn't an official answer. For me, I go with the Enterprise-A was indeed the Yorktown and that production of brand-new Constitution-class ships halted sometime prior to Star Trek II, with the refits done only to extend the life of the design by a couple of decades.
     
  6. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    From Star Trek V...

    SCOTTY: I think this new ship was put together by monkeys.

    So, not the renamed Yorktown:)
     
  7. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    To be fair, though, Scotty's comment still leaves room for the new Enterprise-A to have been previously the Yorktown, the Ti-Ho, or whatever.
    :cool:
     
  8. Mario de Monti

    Mario de Monti Captain Captain

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    Exactly. And it could also have been a brand new Yorktown that was just about to be commissioned when the decision was made to re-name it Enterprise.

    Personally, since there´s no on-screen reason to doubt it, GR´s word is good enough for me.
     
  9. lennier1

    lennier1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Strange, I always thought of her as an old Constitution that had just reached the end of her refit process (similar to the problems at the beginning of TMP) and was one of the first ones to be refitted to mass-production standards instead of the 1701's testbed specs.
     
  10. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    ^^^
    It's just as valid an idea as her being an all-new build is.
     
  11. Mage

    Mage Commodore Commodore

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    When you buy a second-hand car, you still have the tendency to tell people you bought a new car, since it's new to you. Doesn't make the car new though.
     
  12. vulcan redshirt

    vulcan redshirt Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Perhaps the hull was originally intended to be the Starship Yorktown (or even the Ti Ho) but prior to commissioning, events dictated that it would be launched as the Enterprise instead, and possibly even rushed out into service, hence a build quality that Scotty finds less than impressive.
     
  13. Robert Comsol

    Robert Comsol Commodore Commodore

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    Upon closer examination I believe it's actually unlikely it's the Yorktown as we just saw that ship earlier in the movie:

    CARTWRIGHT: We don't know. Get me the Yorktown.
    YORKTOWN CAPTAIN: (on viewscreen) Emergency channel zero one three zero. Code red. It has been three hours since our contact with the alien Probe. All attempts at regaining power have failed.
    CARTWRIGHT: It's using forms of energy we do not understand.
    FEDERATION PRESIDENT: Can you protect us?
    CARTWRIGHT: We are launching everything we have.
    YORKTOWN CAPTAIN: (on viewscreen) Our systems engineers are trying to deploy a makeshift solar-sail. We have high hopes that this will, if successful, generate power to keep us alive.

    Theoretically, everyone aboard Yorktown might have suffocated in the icy cold of space, so you had an empty starship looking for a new captain.
    On the other hand Scotty's remark of the E-A being a "new ship" (in the subsequent movie) seems to contradict this idea.

    Bob
     
  14. Saturn0660

    Saturn0660 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The real question is, how would a "solar-sail" generate power?
     
  15. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    They made a windmill out of it:lol:
     
  16. Irishman

    Irishman Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    That was Shane Johnson'r production. As creative and awesome as it was, he wasn't affiliated with the films, so his identification of the ship as the Ti-Ho is not official.
     
  17. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    Not really, because if the Yorktown was crippled and had to be towed back to Earth for repairs, her captain and some of his crew could have been reassigned somewhere else while the ship was in dock. Starfleet could have made the decision to rename the ship the Enterprise-A based solely on her being the only available Constitution-class ship on hand at the time. For all intents and purposes, she would still be a new ship for Kirk and the TOS gang.

    I imagine a similar situation played out for Picard and the TNG gang following the loss of the Enterprise-D in which an existing Sovereign-class ship in dock was renamed the Enterprise-E.
     
  18. SicOne

    SicOne Commodore Commodore

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    Just seems a bit daft to rename an already-serving starship from Yorktown to Enterprise-A just for Kirk and his crew. It's more likely that this ship was about to be commissioned Taiho (yeah, I know the book said Ti-Ho...) and was changed to E-A at the proverbial last minute. It's also likely that (prior to ST3) originally the Enterprise name was to be shifted to the Excelsior-class once the original E was retired in due time, but that events of ST3 and subsequent problems with the Excelsiors led to a temporary shelving of the Ex until the warp drive situation was figured out, hence the continuation of the Con-refit of which Taiho/E-A was one of the last new builds. Your mileage may vary, but that's my theory.
     
  19. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    Actually, that's no more likely than if the ship was the Yorktown. Starfleet wanted to reward Kirk with a new Enterprise and chose another Constitution-class ship. It could have easily been any vessel of that design that was in dock at the time, including the Yorktown.

    In regards to the origin of the Enterprise-A, there's more than one theory that works.
     
  20. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    Definitely so. But assuming that the ship was a newbuild carries the connotation that Starfleet still thought these ships were hot stuff. And I'd like to steer clear of such an idea for multiple reasons:

    -The ST:TMP vessel was considered outdated and ripe for scrapping, despite the refit.
    - We never see these ships after the last TOS movie (at least not intact and in use).
    - ST3 makes a big deal about Starfleet wanting to upgrade to Excelsior, ST6 has the new model in regular use for the third year at least, and ST:GEN then shows the upgrade in full swing with more ships and variants coming off the production lines.
    - Apart from the ST:TMP ship, the only Constitution we ever really get to see is the E-A anyway - and she shows signs of being another refit, what with her TOS-style shuttlebay (forced perspective issues notwithstanding, on both sides) and GNDN pipes and whatnot. All other uses of the Constitution shape are inconclusive, ranging from mere fragments glimpsed in ST4 to generic silhouettes being used in the charts of ST6.

    From Starfleet's viewpoint, building an all-new ship just for Kirk would be silly. Donating a useful ship to him would be silly. But having him wear out an already obsolete ship would be perfect, as it would serve as a symbolic reward, a factual punishment, and an elegant means of waste disposal!

    On the other side of the issue, Kirk at the end of ST6 seems to think there's still oomph left in the ship, enough for another crew to take over. For all we know (and Ashes of Eden notwithstanding), this is what happens - but Starfleet takes the flashy name off this ship and gives it to the latest pet project instead, so Kirk's second starship now continues service under some other name...

    Timo Saloniemi