was NX01 ever referred to as 'The' Enterprise?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Khan 2.0, Sep 18, 2013.

  1. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Who's upset? You're wrong, and I'm correcting you, that's all. :D And I'll keep correcting you until you say "Enterprise", and not "the Enterprise".
     
  2. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    You are. Otherwise, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
    No, I'm correcting you. It's not wrong. It's just not what some people would do. That's all.
    Eternity is a long time for you to be correcting nothing...
     
  3. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    So, you don't correct people who are wrong? You just let them be wrong? If someone said 2+2=5, then that's just their custom?? How can you be so apathetic about mistakes? Do you not care about people?
     
  4. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Okay, this is getting circular. Can we move on?
     
  5. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    What's to move on from? The OP's question was answered. The fact that C.E. Evans wants to say people have the right to make mistakes and call them "customs" is intriguing, and I was hoping to follow up on it.

    So, why the Enterprise and sometimes the Defiant, but only once (that I recall) the Voyager? DS9 was usually just "the station", which makes sense, because it's one of many and the characters were referencing the station that was of primary interest to them. But would it ever be called the Deep Space 9? Why or why not? Is Enterprise a special name that demands the specific article? Why not just an Enterprise? There were many of them, after all. Why would all of them be the Enterprise? Wouldn't that be confusing?

    Maybe the Enterprise is just Kirk's ship?
     
  6. BK613

    BK613 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    In casual conversation, both modes were used when I served (US Navy). Any differentiation was whether you were speaking of the command (peeps serving aboard) or speaking of the object (the vessel itself.)

    Of the command:
    "Enterprise has been ordered to the Neutral Zone."

    Of the object:
    "The Enterprise has sustained heavy damage."

    Never a hard rule though.
     
  7. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    That's getting melodramatic over something extremely trivial. You repeatedly keep claiming that a widely used form of address as being wrong, when there isn't an actual law that says it is. As such, you're really fighting windmills here.

    Once again, it's not a mistake, just a different manner of address.
    The majority of people couldn't care less. Ships are addressed both with and without "the" in their names. It's unimportant to the general public and not something it gets upset about.
    It's this in a nutshell, Pavonis. No one is a bad person and going to be sent to prison or Hell if they address a ship with "the." Some people may do it, some people may not. It's just that simple and not something to get all worked up about.
     
  8. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    Well, what did you expect on a message board? i think anyone who gets melodramatic over nontrivial issues on a message board would get better results by focusing their efforts elsewhere. Naturally that just leaves trivial issues!

    No law? What about grammar? Languages do have rules.

    I say it is a mistake, the C.E. Evans

    The majority of people are of average and below average intelligence; why should we let them set the standards?

    How do you know? Maybe judges are sending people to prison for just that rule violation all the time. Maybe I'm saving you from a bad experience by enlightening you! You're welcome.
     
  9. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    Not histrionics.

    At this point, this conversation was way run its course and has changed nothing, nor will it ever. The general public has historically addressed ships with "the" as part of their names and will continue to do so regardless of what you think.
     
  10. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    I think I have a new mission in life, the C.E. Evans; thank you for giving me a goal to work towards! I will fix the world - starting with grammar!

    ;)
     
  11. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    Be sure to give me updates on your progress.
    :cool:
     
  12. DaveyNY

    DaveyNY Commodore Commodore

    I'd luv to be able to go visit THE Deep Space 9 space station.

    Alas, it'll never happen in my time.

    That coming from THE DaveyNY.

    :p
     
  13. Yanks

    Yanks Commodore Commodore

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    Under what basis do you claim this?
     
  14. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Actually I may have gotten it backward, but the information I can find is conflicting. For instance:

    http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=605089

    This thread contains conflicting claims.

    And:

    But:

    Conversely:

    Elsewhere, I found this:

    http://www.titanicebook.com/terminology.html

    So there doesn't seem to be a fixed, universal rule. Some say the article should be used, some say it shouldn't. So that means neither "the Enterprise" or "Enterprise" is definitively wrong. Customs vary between different people and different times. Commercial ships take the definite article, but some naval veterans say their ships should never be referred to by the definite article while others say they do it all the time. Basically it seems to come down to a matter of preference, or what scans better in a particular sentence.
     
  15. Yanks

    Yanks Commodore Commodore

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    Damn.... :lol:

    That's pretty complete. :bolian:

    A little wrench to add...

    There is a Navy ship named "The Sullivans"...
    (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_The_Sullivans_(DDG-68))

    Here we can have our cake and eat it too!
     
  16. Dick_Valentine

    Dick_Valentine Commander Red Shirt

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    Watched Shuttlepod One tonight, Reed says "The crew of The Enterprise" at one point (though it came after other sentences such as "The Starship Enterprise might...." and "The brave Enterprise Crew..." so the actor probably just forgot.

    I have no problem with the references to Saratoga and Reliant, etc, but when it comes to our most fabled ship.....well, to paraphrase another, long running show.

    "You may be AN Enterprise, but this is THE Enterprise, the definitive article, you might say..."

    If they didn't want the "The" used every time then they should name their ships Sarah or Sammy or something.....:p
     
  17. Bow

    Bow Cadet Newbie

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    Sure it was but it was 'Enterprise' and not 'USS Enterprise', the NX class ships were built (pre federation of planets), there were 5 NX class ships built.
     
  18. WarpCore

    WarpCore Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Vernacular with:
    Oceans, seas, rivers, deserts, mountain ranges, cultural regions, large forests, nicknames

    Without:
    Lakes, creeks, springs, specific mountains, parks, most countries, states, cities

    Follow?

    The Atlantic, The Pacific, etc
    The Mediterranean, The Baltic, The Caspian
    The Mississippi, The Amazon, The Nile
    The Sahara, The Gobi
    The Rockies, The Andes, The Himalayas
    The South, The Mid-West, The Mid-East, The Rhineland
    The Amazon (rainforest this time)
    The Big Apple, The Windy City, The Outback

    Those are still proper nouns, so yes it IS that hard.

    "Going on a road trip from Chicago, driving through mid-west, and staying a night at Grand Canyon before backpacking in Mojave."

    Can you honestly say that sentence is either proper or natural?
     
  19. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    And as we've established, the vernacular for the usage of "the" before ship names goes both ways. Some feel it should be used, others feel it shouldn't. There's no universal consensus. But clearly the makers of Trek changed their preferences somewhere along the line.

    And it's not just Trek ship names. Is it Batman or the Batman? Different writers seem to have different preferences. Sometimes it seems that "the Batman" is used by people less familiar with him and "Batman" by those who know him personally. On the other hand, there was a whole animated series called The Batman in which he was routinely referenced with the article -- and, symmetrically, his foe who's usually called the Joker was known simply as Joker.

    Come to think of it, why is it "the Joker" and "the Riddler" and "the Penguin" but not "the Catwoman?"
     
  20. jespah

    jespah Commodore Commodore

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    Have you ever visited the New England?