Voyager - What if...?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Bry_Sinclair, Jan 15, 2013.

  1. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I was thinking about this a little while ago, so I thought I would throw it out there and get some other opinions.

    What if, when the producers were developing VOY, they decided to give it a more direct connection to TNG. So instead of Captain Nicole/Kathryn Janeway, they managed to get Elizabeth Dennehy to return to Trek, but this time as Captain Elizabeth Shelby of the U.S.S. Voyager?

    Still young and ambitious, a bit of a hot-head, she would have strong views and opinions that would see her and Chakotay clash more often. Tuvok could become her former mentor at the Academy, who taught her all she knows about tactics and combat.
     
  2. SonicRanger

    SonicRanger Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Wouldn't have made much difference. "Janeway as scientist" was hardly ever used. Elizabeth Dennehy is only five years younger than Kate Mulgrew, so that wouldn't matter much either. And what portion of the audience would recognise a character in only two episodes of TNG years earlier?
     
  3. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Shelby's a bit more akin to Ransom. It would have been interesting. She wasn't a wooer, that dynamic which defined Janeway's Captaincy would have been missing. I would have liked to see hard ass Shelby in the chair, I think she would have created conflict among the crew by being so strong minded. Would she have placed Chak at her right hand like that? I doubt it.
     
  4. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Chakotay as XO was really more of a political/PR assignment than anything else. Tuvok would have made a fine Number One, but with 30ish terrorist Maquis onboard, they need to be kept in line somehow. Having their former Captain as second-in-command would see them fall into line behind him.

    Shelby may not have liked it, but I think she would do the same thing, so as to install order into the Maquis. Though I do get the feeling she'd address him as lieutenant commander every so often--especially if were pissed off at him (so probably frequently in the first couple of years).
     
  5. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'd Prefer the captain dies, and Robin Lefler is instantly promoted in the wake of such a...

    Was Missing really that bad last year?

    The action scenes (In Missing) where Ashely Judd went Charles Bronson on the entire continent of Europe were epic, somehow she's wasted all that time on crappy rom-coms when she has all the chops to be a first class female action hero.
     
  6. Dale Sams

    Dale Sams Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    1) Who would have recognized Shelby?? Everyone!

    2) It would have been interesting if Shelby's driving characteristic had been "Delta Quadrant hunh? Let's git us some Borg!!!"
     
  7. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    I suspect Tuvok didn't become First Officer because producers didn't want to veer too closely to Spock allusions. And considering how some people around here think Janeway fought the Borg too many times, would we have given up completely if Captain Shelby went gunning for Borg as early as first season?
     
  8. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Who cares if the casual fans didn't recognize Shelby? I doubt they recognized Janeway before Caretaker? I would've enjoyed seeing a series centered on Shelby, all while laughing that she made captain before Riker.

    I could see her being rather hard on the Maquis, which could lead to some interesting friction, which was supposed to be there all along anyways. It would be a great character arc for her to instantly distrust these these terrorists, but slowly become to rely upon them.

    As for the Borg? At least she'd have a reason to want to take on the Borg so often, and when she came up with a technobabble solution of the week to beat them at least we wouldn't be muttering bs so loudly. Though I don't see her siding with the Borg over 8472 at all. More like the other way around.
     
  9. SonicRanger

    SonicRanger Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Let's be realistic here. Elizabeth Dennehy as Shelby would have changed very little, if anything, because the writers would still have been the same. There's no reason to think that they'd have written Shelby any differently than Kate Mulgrew as Janeway.
     
  10. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ^
    Who knows? They have a pre-established character background to call upon, and by all accounts Jeri Taylor may not have had the same "heroine worship" for Shelby that she had for Janeway that let to so many absurd episodes.

    Besides... I just want to see Captain Shelby for that brief snippet of Riker in Death Wish.

    "Oh hello Commander," Shelby said with a smirk, "please cooperate and testify for Q. That's an order, and if you think about giving me any lip, I'll snap you back so hard you'll think you're a first officer again... oh wait, you still are!"

    :p
     
  11. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    Riker was offered Captaincy no less than three times in the first two seasons (one of which was prior to taking the Enterprise assignment). For whatever reason, Riker just wasn't interested anymore in becoming a Captain (despite earlier admissions about wanting to be a Captain by 30).
     
  12. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yes, I did watch Best of Both worlds too. ;)

    Those reasons really didn't make sense at all, especially after Riker was brevetted captain of the Enterprise and basically had the rank if he wanted to keep it given that Starfleet was stated to be expanding and building new ships.

    Really the reasoning boils down to they don't want to break up the cast mid run and we'll plug in a quasi on screen explanation.

    Shelby did have more ambition and drive than Riker to be certain.
     
  13. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It really didn't suit Riker's personality that he turned down a Captaincy. Sure it's the flagship but it still seemed likely HE would have that flagship someday or some new flagship if he took a smaller series of Captaincies first. Do I care about Riker's career path? NO :lol:

    But Shelby, she was a great character. I can see her clashing bad with B'Elanna.
     
  14. tighr

    tighr Commodore Commodore

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    Shelby was a maneater. It's very likely she would have ended up WITH B'Elanna.
     
  15. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    And everyone would have been happy :D

    I can't imagine her putting up with anything that came out of Neelix's mouth either.
     
  16. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I don't know Liz, or her views, but this is what Kate Mulgrew's moral input did to the show'... Kathryn is a born again virgin with her legs glued shut.

    The most opposite thing Liz could have arranged was to have given Berman permission to let Shelby slut it up making it open season on her cooch.

    "It's the 24h century. Women are not oppressed. It's not a miracle that a woman is captain and I didn't have to work twice as hard as a man to get here, there is equality, and my sexuality is not seen as a weakness or a liability, I want to make out with the weirdest looking aliens your makeup department can invent just like Shater, you want equality, make me as big a whore as Shatner... I want evil alien Captains not to destroy my ship because they want to fuck me and I have enough guile to string them along and suggest that that's entirely a possibility until some one in engineering fixes the damn warp drive and we can run. I like sex, and I think Shelby likes sex as much as I do, and I may never have lived in my car but Shelby can't have a long term stable relationsip with anyone since the ship is always in motion running away from whoever Shelby might be contemplating falling in love with... It's impossible for her to get a third date! Fist date wham bamm is the only option."

    Or Liz Dennehy could have entirely the same opinions on sex in the workplace as Mulgrew.
     
  17. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I wouldn't see her ever trusting Neelix after that whole lying and getting them captured scheme he pulled in Caretaker. He'd have been on his way after that one.... ooh the possibilities!
     
  18. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The thing is it's Starfleet that is all hinky about the sex. Lots of workplace rules leads to an atmosphere where people feeling free about their sexuality is seen as potentially boundary pushing. There's a cascade effect to that workplace morality, if you can't do it with your closest friends you sure can't do it with aliens without being looked at askance. So in order for Shelby to not have any preoccupations about how it looks to have liaisons with aliens she has to be bucking the system she's steeped in.
     
  19. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Caring about how things look to assholes, above your own happiness, is not how you live a complete life.

    As the Doctor said "Your only option is passing alien Captains."
     
  20. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    After Shelby got done with the Borg in Scorpion Part 1, they'd know she was major badass and would leave her alone. That way they wouldn't need to bring Seven on (or if they did make the character a hot male walking around in silver bodypaint).

    Firstly, speak for yourself, I don't need to see a Shelby/Torres relationship :). They would play off well against each other, but I don't see it going into anything more intimate. Perhaps though, since they are both strong-willed and forceful women they would find they had more in common and Shelby could take a more mentoring role with Torres (just a thought).

    Secondly, I think she would have kicked Neelix off at the end of Caretaker--unless the character was vastly rewritten into someone far more likeable.