Voyager again, for the first time

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by NightJim, Feb 26, 2013.

  1. Yanks

    Yanks Commodore Commodore

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    Mad? ... she's mad enough to forget all the relationships she had made on Voyager over the years, but not mad enough to ....

    #1. Find Voyager
    #2. Get past every security system / forcefield on the ship
    #3. travel back in time.
    #4. assult herself
    #5. betray the entire crew to the Vidians (hang on to your organs!!!)

    etc, etc...

    Oh, and wasn't Kes' ship destroyed, then it was there for her to leave at the end?

    This just wasn't Kes. Kes loved EVERYONE and to just forget that because she felt betrayed was just too much of a leap for me. The 180 Kes takes is just not believable and the episode gives us no reason why she has had this change of heart.

    This was a "an old friend needs money so lets give her another episode" episode. and Jennifer's acting in this ep was horrible.

    Glad you enjoyed it, but this one is in the TATV category for me.
     
  2. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Ocampan dementia is a bitch.
     
  3. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I agree... and I'm proud to have been the catalyst for you to watch that ep.

    Well, that and the popcorn. :p

    I actually used this ep in one of my fanfics to explain why Janeway ultimately separated Tuvix. In season 1 Tuvok's vision of season 5, he was greeted as "Tuvok" by young Naomi Wildman. I saw that as evidence Janeway would use to support separating Tuvix since she already had a glimpse of the future.

    ETA:

    I also liked the bookend of her story with that of Voyager itself. We see Kes going home to Ocampa, the only place to truly soothe her wounded soul.

    Just as the crew of Voyager are struggling to go home to the Alpha Quadrant.
     
  4. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Fixed it.

    I
     
  5. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Who did she have that baby with in the Eternal Tide anyway?
     
  6. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Julian Bashir?
     
  7. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    He does like women who have been in comas..
     
  8. NightJim

    NightJim Captain Captain

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    With the book failing to grab me yet, with nothing to do Sunday night and having enjoyed Fury I decided to do a mini marathon.

    Lifeline
    Nice episode. Three appearances for Barclay, that's not too shabby. And another for Troy. Blocking was a bit off for Picardo in places, but overall he did a great job portraying two people at the same time. And the Midas array now transmits every month. Hmmm, it's cool but I wonder if it's too much. But with only one season left what does it matter. I do like the hint about the problem with the Marquis for Starfleet. Janeway picks up on the word and immediately alarm bells start ringing because she doesn't think like that any more. Chakotay hears it and doesn't bat an eyelid because he always knew the day would be coming eventually.

    The Haunting of Deck 13
    Another nice episode. But I think I'd have preferred it if Neelix was an unreliable narrator. There's hints that's what they were thinking about, but in the end he just tells the kids everything. BORING.

    Unimatrix Zero
    Ok, not as a bad as the brief synopsis made it sound. I do understand why people complain Voyager neuters the Borg though. Between this and Dark Scorpion the Borg have lost a lot of what made them awesome in the first place.
     
  9. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Lifeline was written by Robert Picardo.

    He did alllllllllllllllllllllllll that, to himself on purpose.
     
  10. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I got the impression Neelix was an unreliable narrator. You know that line where he gets caught making up inaccurate technobabble?

    Neelix was telling them the basic story of what happened but adding his own dramatic flair, which means he was probably embellishing a lot.
     
  11. NightJim

    NightJim Captain Captain

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    true enough, so it could have been a lot less interesting than what we saw, but I mean a REALLY unreliable narrator. It seemed a little bit of a waste of the flashback/storyteller trope with such a standard story. That bit at the end with Neelix on the bridge should have made it clear half his story was nonsense, and the only thing that was vaguely true was there was an energy based lifeform.
     
  12. Yanks

    Yanks Commodore Commodore

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    I don't know that a still don't know what the #@#$%#@$% this episode is all about... :brickwall:

    A skipper for me.

    I believe you are referring to Dark Frontier. :)

    Of all the borg stuff in Voyager, Uni negative zero is the worst IMO.
     
  13. NightJim

    NightJim Captain Captain

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    Ooops. Yeah Dark Frontier. I was racking my brain to remember it, and obviously it just tried to skip over to the decent one.

    You might be right, it certainly does the most to ruin the Borg. I think the introduction of the children might just be up there though. Speaking of which, where the hell were they during all this Unimatrix Zero nonsense?

    Amusingly I decided to check Wikipedia about which episodes did feature the Borg, just to check there wasn't really bad ones I'd already banished from my mind. On the Borg page, Unimatrix Zero isn't even mentioned in the character history.
     
  14. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I liked Unamatrix Zero better than Dark Frontier, though I think they wasted it when they didn't do anything with the rogue Borg storyline.
     
  15. Keith1701

    Keith1701 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm currently on Season 2 of Voyager and it is still very enjoyable.:)
     
  16. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I think the Borg lost their "awesome" quality when Locutis/Picard defeated them by putting them to "sleep". :vulcan:

    I thought it was outrageous that after that defeat, the Borg didn't bother to come after Earth for years and then decided we were so powerful they had to go into our past and assimilate pre-warp Earth. Why not just send another cube to Earth with the sleep function disabled? :rommie:
     
  17. Fruitcake

    Fruitcake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    shh JRulez, you are mussing up the myth that it was VOY that ruined the Borg.
     
  18. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Oops! :alienblush:

    Uh... that's right.

    It was Voyager that destroyed the superior Borg mythos by finding an individual Borg drone and teaching it the meaning of individuality and gasp, friendship. They even went so far as to name this drone, turning it from a simply cog in a massive mechanistic race to a being in its own right.

    "Hugh". ;)

    Yet another step on the path to destroying the Borg.

    ETA: Just found this and had to share it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BuLr1IHlkQ

    [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BuLr1IHlkQ[/yt]
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2014
  19. NightJim

    NightJim Captain Captain

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    Well yes, I won't deny I've thought of Hugh a couple of times during Voyager. Seven certainly, but at least she was played differently what with not wanting to leave the collective and/or wanting to go back. Also being a hot blonde woman.

    Yet the one that really got me was "Drone" which felt just like a remake of I, Borg but with a future borg and Seven mummy issues.

    Anyway, after an incredibly late saturday night - well 5am Sunday - and a raging hangover. I did a marathon yesterday. No mini marathon. This was 11 episodes long. I thought it was 12, but it turns out I missed Inside Man. I did think it was a little odd that no one did anything big with the monthly transmissions.

    Imperfection
    HAHA first proper episode of season 7 and they get rid of all the kids except for Icheb who has decent story potential. Then immediately shows just how much potential he has. Great performance by the two borgs.

    Drive
    As a race fan there was enough to keep me going, and the Paris/Torres relationship becomes the Paris relationship. I especially liked Tom's reasoning of "well you're a pretty gruff woman, I didn't think you liked the mushy stuff". It's that type of thinking that usually gets me into trouble too.
    Oh and more Harry just being rubbish at picking women, this time with the xenophobic terrorist. Oh Harry, you can certainly pick em.

    Repression
    Hey, that's the bloke from Angel. Nice episode for Tuvok, and the Marquis thing rears it's head after a very long time. Is this going to be a thing? Especially after that mention in the closing stage of season 6?

    Critical Care
    Oh, a stinging attack at the US Health Care system. Done pretty well.

    Body and Soul
    Holy Crap. Jeri Ryan's performance as the Doctor is incredible. It's moments like this that you get reminded how good an actor Ryan is, and why the show does get a little Seven-centric at times. She deserves it.

    Nightingale.
    I like that this episode addressed the fact that Harry is still an Ensign, and that's of th firm belief that under normal circumstances he'd go higher. I'll give him maybe Lieutenant because of his engineering ingeniuty, but this episode is all the proof anyone needs that Harry just isn't cut out for the big time.
    RON GLASS SHOUT OUT.

    Flesh and Blood
    I'm not entirely sure this needed to be two episodes, but it did allow the viewer to go along with the Doctor's thinking that the holograms had a point. Keeping Iden's megalomania quiet until halfway through episode 2 was a good twist. Janeway's anti-hologram prejudice is still completely intact too. She might have accepted the Doctor, but it seems she can't see others like him as the same. Good moment where they steal those three holograms that have no personality.
    I wasn't sure about Janeway not dishing out any punishment to the Doctor. Sure he can now be fallible

    Shattered
    If there's one thing that Voyager does really well, it's the episodes set across different eras. They nail the separate timelines perfectly. Especially like they got some old actors back to re-inforce it. Yay more Seska being creepy around Chakotay. Oh and more Marquis reminders... this is going to go somewhere, isn't it?
    It's not a half bad Chakotay episode either. If Beltran didn't get himself into that weird I won't bother working till I get decent material the First Officer would have been a lot more interesting.
    Old Icheb and Naomi was nice too. She grows up rather nicely. I wonder why they went with those two and not other descendant since next up is:

    Lineage
    Well the ending is touching as hell, and so far season 7 has a lot on offer for Paris and Torres, and it's pretty amazing to give an entire episode to discovering a pregnancy and a character's tortured childhood. That said, most of this episode is spent thinking Torres is god damn mental. She's got these massive hangups about being half Klingon but throughout all we see is a little light teasing as children do (and the sort of stuff you could look back on and realise that's all it was, despite how awful it felt at the time), and B'elanna just being mopey as hell. That knockout punch about her Dad at the end was a killer though.

    Repentance
    Soon as they revealed that the brain surgery had fixed the 'bad' prisoner it became obvious that the 'good' prisoner Neelix was cosying up to was going to go south. Really Neelix is crap. We had that episode a while back where Tom and him are worried they're losing their edge, and go about proving that they aren't. Then we get this (and Critical Care where he got done again) and he can't even do what the character was first thought up as. Still, kudos for not giving the happy ending.
     
  20. Jeri

    Jeri Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yesterday I saw at startrek.com their latest poll, where they ask what species is most likely to destroy the Federation. Species 8472 was voted second, but the Borg were still voted first by a wide margin. So apparently VOY in fact did not destroy the Borg.