V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too easy”

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Aquehonga, Feb 9, 2009.

  1. Aquehonga

    Aquehonga Fleet Captain

    Quantum Leap finished open-ended, with Arch-, err, BECKETT never making The Leap Home:cool:

    So if Doc Beckett is still quantum leaping, why couldn't, shouldn't Mrs. Columbo & her Super-Friends still be gallivanting about the δ Quadrant en route home to the α/β Quadrant(s):confused:

    Beating a horse's cadaver, & a tangent of sorts {a cosine really:o} there's the issue(s) of Mrs. Columbo's flying saucer basically NEVER having mechanical problems & suffering from lack of a visit to the garage:wtf:

    This subtopic is a horse's corpse I know but Kate & Crew, overall, had it too g:scream::mad:d as far as a lack of seeing Starfleet's Latka Gravas goes! :brickwall:

    TPTB&B should've open-ended V'GER ala Archer on QL, I mean Dr. BECKETT!:techman:

    If Doc Beckett ain't leapin' home, why in the wide, wide world of sports should Mrs. Columbo:confused: Beckett's alot closer to his home than V'GER should ever be to theirs:mad:

    Just end V'GER with the ship still stuck in the ΔQ on course for Earth.

    Prior to skippering V'GER, didn't Janeway steal her husband Larry's novel & get a mansion on Pacifica?

    Then, didn't some weird screwball Ferengi writing student of Larry's botch his advice one night?

    This Ferengi flake, after living out “Strangers On A Train” in a holosuite, as suggested by Larry that night, then went to Pacifica & pushed Janeway off a cruiseship, thinking he bumped her off:hugegrin:

    This Ferengi whackjob then assumed Larry would knock off his beast of a mother:D

    You know how that winds up:)

    Story ends with Janeway OK after all, & the rest is. .......... history:bolian:

    Sines & Janeway's past as a literary thief aside:

    How do YOU think V'GER should've ended?
     
  2. JNG

    JNG Chief of Staff, Starfleet Command Rear Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    The possibility of a downbeat ending for the show, with Voyager as a sort of Flying Dutchman, was discussed right up to the very end.

    Ultimately, this might not have felt very Trek-like to the audience, but I do think it would have delivered on the sentiments of the pilot in an interesting way.
     
  3. miraclefan

    miraclefan Commodore Commodore

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Okay we got it! VOYAGER sucked & stanked like HELL! If you're looking for a argument you're not getting it from me.
     
  4. Aquehonga

    Aquehonga Fleet Captain

    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Quite the contrary dude:)

    V'GER is 1 of the jewels in STAR TREK's Crown:cool:

    Superior (i.m.o) to Hawk's Nest (DS9) & Beckett's Conjecture (ENT) by alot:hugegrin:

    Mrs. Columbo's trek among the stars is a more worthy successor to TNG than Star Trek: DOMINION (ds9) was, or Captain Beckett & the Galacteers (ent) was as a prequel to TOS.

    Margaret Donner's 7-year space cruise on a flying saucer is the Trekverse's 3rd best series:techman:
     
  5. kimc

    kimc Coffee Mod Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Then why are you here? Go troll elsewhere.
     
  6. jongredic

    jongredic Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Hm... that was hard to read :p I'd be interested in seeing a QL style ending, but the one I'd hoped for was Voyager getting home before the finale, and finishing off with a What Happened Next? arc.

    In theory you'd think it would be all cheers and celebrations, but Voyager is returning to a battered and weary post-war Federation, and it's likely not all of the crew's families made it.

    That could end up as depressing as never making it home. Maybe scratch that idea.

    And also, Voyager's exceptional lack of engine trouble was really more asymptotic than a cosine, and one of those many many things the series could've/should've/would've explored, but didn't :(
     
  7. Stag

    Stag Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Being an early VOY hater and having rewatched the entire series recently, i have concluded that VOY is one of the better TREK series and really in the spirit of TOS.

    I also appreciate Janeway more a I think Kate Mulgrew found her sea legs and really decided how she going to play the part. Season 4-7 of Janeway is one of the best portrayals of a TREK Captain.

    The two areas of opportunity they missed was as mentioned, show the ship having mechanical issues and having to adapt alien technology to help theirs work. Now I wouldn't have expected that to start at least until season 4 after all Voyager was a brand new starship. But I think it would have been an interesting subtext to all the Borg episodes they did - VOyager having to assimilate other technologies in order to survive.

    The second was the lets wrap it up and put it all in a nice box ending. I think a the last two or three episodes could have taken place a couple years further in the future - some of the main cast had been killed off - with the VOY still struggling to get home.
     
  8. kimc

    kimc Coffee Mod Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    According to one of her interviews the suits were so nervous about a woman captain that they didn't give Mulgrew much leeway as an actress for quite a while. It wasn't until the episode "Death Wish" that she was finally able to start playing with the part.
     
  9. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    I am not really in favor of the crew not getting home, as it seems too pessimistic and not in tone with the rest of the show.

    As another interesting idea for how to end the series, what if we still had a two-hour telefilm a la 'Endgame' that begins largely the same - showing a retrospect of the ship's return, introducing us to the crew as they are twenty years later, and then we have interspersed flashbacks of the immediate aftermath of that event combined with a 'modern' issue that has something to do with how they got home?

    Perhaps Voyager did use the transwarp network (or a similar 'cheat' - maybe the Vaadwaur?) to get home and because of that acquired unique knowledge of a new threat that drives them all to get back together and face not only the Threat but the consequences of their actions, which we see via flashback.

    So here we focus briefly on actually seeing the ship get home, via flashback, and more on how they got home, the immediate aftermath, and the future repercussions. No throwaway deaths that Kathy has to fix or anything like that, and maybe even no Borg.

    The other difference? No time travel.
     
  10. EmperorTiberius

    EmperorTiberius Captain Captain

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    The ending they gave us was very disappointing. We don't see what happens with the characters, which was pathetic, especially after so much "tension" about what would happen with 7. What about the Doctor? Janeway promoted to Admiral right away?
     
  11. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Premium Member

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    So something similar to the way "Timeless" was written? I would have liked that.
     
  12. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Thanks. Whoa, you made me realize I accidentally re-treaded my own idea, but with a different episode. I guess it just goes to show how close in concept some of these are.

    But yeah, basically 'Timeless' + 'Endgame' - time travel = awesome :cool:
     
  13. kent

    kent Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Either:

    either it got home, but the show continued for a while with more detail as to what happened when they got back. I'd like to see seven at starfleet's advanced tech. offices, occasionally going on missions with them. Be'Lanna and Paris would stay, of course, but are now raising a daughter. Tuvok become's first officer, and Chakotay assumes command of his own ship. The two ships can go on joint missions and act independently, but it would offer more plots and character development (and possibly another spin off with Chakotay's ship. He could call it the Hakuchimoya, LOL.) Janeway is now a fleet admiral and upgrades her ship in every way (just no additional warp engines, the refit E-D looked awful.). The doctor stays on Voyager, Data builds an successful android body for him so he's not as limited. Kim stays as well, but gets a promition to commander, and takes over the tactical position Tuvok left giving him more meat to his role. An additional officer is assigned to OPS, a lesser seen species perhaps...bolian or andorian? OR ops is replaced by acting ensign Echeb. The wildemans are more prominent as well, perhaps elder wildeman becomes the main astroligical officer, and her daughter starts training for starfleet. Voyager would've gotten home after 5 years, and the next two years it's assigned to DEEP DEEP DEEP space exploration with Chakotay's ship. Seven would then be assigned to Chakotay's ship.

    OR

    The never reach home, but the series ends with them crossing the border into the beta quadrant at high warp.
     
  14. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    One nitpick, not directed at you, kent (but do chime in on the subject) or anyone in particular, moreso the concept.

    So let me play Devil's Advocate. Am I the only one who has a problem with the notion that all would be forgiven so quickly with the Maquis crewmembers? Even if it was, I don't see Chakotay being trusted with a shiny new Starfleet ship so quickly, or even Voyager as has been done in the relaunch books. (Why didn't they just make Kathy a mobile Admiral a la Ross with Voyager her flagship anyway?)

    Kirk and crew can be cited as examples, but that situation was entirely different: lifelong loyal, decorated Starfleet officers who stole an about-to-be-decommissioned heavily damaged ship, sabotaged another ship, all to resurrect a beloved comrade (another lifelong loyal decorated officer) and ended up exposing and thwarting a rogue Klingon Commander AND save the planet from annihilation to boot.

    Chakotay was a Starfleet officer turned terrorist that Starfleet clearly cared enough about to stage an intelligence operation to bring him in, who was only pressed back into service due to mitigating circumstances, and while performing admirably as Voyager's XO, didn't save a Federation planet from annihilation.
     
  15. kent

    kent Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    This is true. Perhaps...and i'm supposing.... the maquis go on trial for what they did. It's a process, and involves the first hal of the 5th season and ends in a cliff hanger. There were consequences and convictions, but no prison sentences. I personally think Janeway would take the stand, now as a fleet admiral, and vouch for each and every one of them. I think that some might be suspended from starfleet, while others remain with a tarnished record (not too tarnished though). Chakotay would remain a commander, having proven himself, and is transferred (as a part of his punishment) away from the ship he loves to a starbase in deep deep space. Seven goes with him and works on creating new advanced tech. Be'lanna gets a tarnished record as well, citing crimes against the Federation, and is blocked from getting a promotion for the next 15 years should she remain in starfleet. At Janeway's request she remains on Voyager with Paris to raise their child. Paris' record is absolved, and he is promoted to Lt. Commander and remains at the helm. Tuvok is again promoted to first officer, Kim becomes tactical, Echeb takes over Kim's position as ops officer as acting ensign like Wesley. Some of the Maquis choose to leave starfleet to pursue other careers, but I think most of them would probably stay on Voyager, at Janeway's request. The reason Chakotay was made to transfer was he was a starfleet officer and he defected, so his sentence was a little harsher.

    As for the Equinox crew...they're all sent to prison rehibilitation, and are expelled from starfleet, and charged with crimes against sentient life. The woman who helped Janeway get's a slightly lighter sentence and a better rehabilitation center. The rest are basically screwed.

    At first, seven is almost put on trial for crimes against humanity and sentient species, and this is a consternation for janeway. But her friends, family, and Fleet Admiral Janeway all come to her defence and the bigots are laid to rest. She joins Chakotay at his space station, a small depot capable of deep space scanning, defense, and resupply. Voyager is sent on a deep deep space mission and that station will be its home base. Largely, it is out of contact with Starfleet as it's charting deep unkown space.

    As a result of this assignment, Janeway orders her ship upgraded. Her phasers are upgraded to produce firepower similar to an wartime Galaxy, it's warp core is replaced with a slightly larger swirl lattice design to produce more power. The secondary warp core is built and activated to supply even more power, though that one remains the same. The shields are replaced with regenerative shields, and the future hull armor is integrated into the shield grid so the generators aren't as big of a target (or in my mind as ugly LOL.) and so it seemlessly activates AS the shields are dropped or go down. The crew is increased by 50, so they now have a crew of 200. The ship now carries quantums and photons, on foward tube fires a quantum, the other a photon, the same goes for the back tubes. transphasic torpedo's were deemed too powerful by starfleet, and they are working on a "dumbed" down design (absolute power corrupts absolutely was their reasoning.). The new design will undoubtedly be twice as "powerful" as quantum's, eliminating the need for photon's and relegating quantums to the photon's previous status in the fleet.

    Voyagers shuttle bay is also expanded and the door enlarged. Interior space is increased 25% and the bay opens up into the fantail space ala refit enterprise. It now carries delta flyer shuttles almost exclusively, and starfleet is using delta flyer shuttle types instead of the Danube class for the most part. The danube is still being used for transport and mission specific missions. Ablative hull armor is also added to Voyager. A hybrid warp drive is eventually created by Seven, which uses the focusing ability of slipstream drive (it focuses the warp fields so much that it creates that super slipstream tunnel.) with the warp nacelles warp fields, creating super efficient warp ability, which boosts the warp range to about 9.999, causing Starfleet to re-number the warp scale. Voyager now has a top cruising speed of warp 13, and top emergency speed of warp 14.6. It now travells about 25,500 times the speed of light. the new drive system sweeps across all federation ships. Voyager is still exploring, though now is exploring never before seen sections of the Alpha and gamma quadrants. Chakotay's station is still home base.

    Their first mission ivolves mapping an area of space closer to the gamma quadrant, and parts of the gamma quadrant itself. In addition to finding new worlds, it's sub-mission is finding habitable planets to settle on and planets rich in rescources so the Federation can claim it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2009
  16. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    I like a lot of your ideas there. Janeway and the other Starfleet crew having to take the stand for the Maquis would be excellent drama.

    Here's another thought, too: even though clearly they did, wouldn't it have been interesting had Starfleet called Janeway into question rather for some of her more dubious choices than immediately promoting her? And doesn't Fleet Admiral seem a bit much for her?
     
  17. kent

    kent Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    She could've been. I think that would be a part of it. It would involve a lot of debate, perhaps that plot point would involve more of the admirals themselves, and the drama of convicting one of the Federation's greatest explorers...I doubt anything would come to fruitition though, I think in the end it would be decided she did the best she could under the circumstances. But it would be GREAT drama.

    The reason I chose fleet admiral is because i can't see her sitting behind a desk all the time. She's a woman of action. Fleet Admiral's get to choose their own ship from what I understand, and if she is operating in conjunction with a space station that would be a logical promotion. Although I guess she could be a regular admiral, similar to a commodore, and still choose her own ship. Generally speaking though, considering her experience with coordinated attacks and battles, she could definately be a fleet admiral. Remember the Void? Or when she battled the time ship Axiom? She was pretty good there too.
     
  18. kent

    kent Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    I would like to ammend the new hybrid drive's top speed. It's too fast. WAY too fast.

    So, with that said, the new top speed of the hybrid drive is warp 9.9977, which is about 15,500 times the speed of light. That's in an emergency though, and can only be sustained for probably 4 hours or so. The top sustainable speed would likely be warp 9.9976, which is about 15,100 times the speed of light. The cruising speed would be 9.997, which is about 13,500 times the speed of light. So, top emrg speed would be warp 14.7, top sustainable speed would be warp 14, and cruising speed would probably be warp 11 or so. That's much more reasonable then 25,000 times the speed of light.

    if they had done something like my ideas, the show could've lasted a lot longer then the standrad 7 years, like stargate did.
     
  19. Bacl

    Bacl Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    I thought Voyager got it backwards. They give us a finale where we hear all about this alternate future, and then everything gets changed but then we never see what really happened.

    They should have shown it "backwards."
    Get them home, then roll into the future, showing us what REALLY happens to the crew.
     
  20. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: V'GER should've ended the way QUANTUM LEAP did. They had it “too e

    Agreed.