Uniform colours- is there a system?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by LilyB, Nov 21, 2009.

  1. Snaploud

    Snaploud Admiral Admiral

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    I think Data should have transitioned to red sometime during the show (part of his progression to take over the first officer position--which really should have happened by the series end). It was a huge WTF moment when Deanna Troi was promoted above Data in Thine Own Self.
     
  2. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    The switch was because the TOS movies' use of wine red for all Starfleet officers' jackets, viewers had begun to associate wine with Admiral Kirk, Captain Spock and command.

    Patrick Stewart tested better in wine (colour-shifted from TOS red) than mustard. It was also felt that using mustard for security diluted the old doomed "redshirt" jokes. The blue of science was colour-shifted to teal to avoid problems with bluescreen.

    TMP increased from three (TOS) to six division colours:
    White: command, Science: orange; Ship's Services/Helm: yellow; Engineering: red; Medical: mint green; Security: grey. The uniform colours were officers' personal choice of grey or beige.

    ST II-VI, plus "Generations" prologue:
    White: command, Science/Ship's Services: grey; Engineering/Helm: yellow; Medical: mint green; Security: black; Cadet: red. In the background, several other collar/cuff colours could be seen. The uniform jacket colour was wine.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2009
  3. iguana_tonante

    iguana_tonante Admiral Admiral

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    Thank you, I was too lazy to check. :)
     
  4. Ryan Thomas Riddle

    Ryan Thomas Riddle Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Moreover, Thesis used a darker color-value for the TNG uniforms. And the teal would continually be messed with throughout the life of the series, as Crusher's uniform color isn't very consistent from season to season.

    The uniform colors had a specific meaning as well per the Sackett book (see the interview with Bob Fletcher).

    Blue-grey: command
    Beige: bridge officers
    Brown: Non-bridge personnel
    White: Techs
    Loden-green (looks dark gray): Planetary personnel

    Of course, Ilia should've been in beige like Sulu, Uhura, and Chekov. But then again costuming is often dictated by what looks good on the actor/actress. Perhaps, and this is speculation on my part, they wanted Persis Khambata to stand out from the rest of the bridge rats since she had a prominent feature role in the film.

    Black was the color for the enlisted personnel--as worn on their jumpers. Red was for both officer-cadet and enlisted-traniee. There was also a complex system for the shoulder and arm bands to further dilenate department and role--seen in TVH.

    Security was a Windsor green per Fletcher's notes.

    Those notes have been used to create this TWOK division chart.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2009
  5. Admiral Shran

    Admiral Shran Admiral Admiral

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    God bless you. I was starting to think I was the one who thought that.
     
  6. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I hope ST XII introduces Marines. I've always wondered what they would have been like in TOS' time. I think they should wear the standard TOS style uniform, but in BLACK. :techman: (meaning, a black uniform shirt as opposed to a red, gold or blue one)
     
  7. Snaploud

    Snaploud Admiral Admiral

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    We're apparently not alone:

    http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Thine_Own_Self_(episode)
     
  8. iguana_tonante

    iguana_tonante Admiral Admiral

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    Marine should be in olive green, not darker. That's for, wait for it, Black Ops. :p
     
  9. Red Ranger

    Red Ranger Admiral Admiral

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    Well, I also understand that in addition to Brent Spiner not "testing well" in blue because of the makeup/contacts, Patrick Stewart and Jonathan Frakes didn't test well in gold, either. So they decided to switch command to red instead. Good move.

    I also agree that Data looked better in red. The makeup and contacts went well with that color in the two eps he wore command red. I also wish he had switched to command red in Redemption, Pt. II when he commanded the Sutherland.

    Red Ranger
     
  10. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Naw, that'd be too much like the gold color. Black would really stand out and look cool.
     
  11. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Data assuming commnd of the Excaliber was a temporary assignment, on the other hand we didn't know if Jellico was ever going to leave.

    As just a counselor, Deanna may have reached a rank 'glass ceiling', only by training as a bridge officer could she be promoted at all. We saw in Tapestry that a officer (Picard) can spend their entire career not being promoted. Also we don't know how long Deanna was a Lt. Commander.

    Marines should be khaki brown, like the current marines class B's, also have red piping (blood stripe) running down the outside of both uniform legs. Now that would be cool.
     
  12. Snaploud

    Snaploud Admiral Admiral

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    According to Datalore, Data was promoted to lieutenant commander in 2060 (after 12 years as a lieutenant), so, by Thine Own Self (2070), Data had been a lieutenant commander for 10 years. It's unclear exactly when Troi was promoted to Lieutenant Commander.
     
  13. Red Ranger

    Red Ranger Admiral Admiral

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    I agree. He did wear red when Jellico temporarily appointed him first officer after relieving Riker in Chain of Command, Pt. II. I wish Picard had done the same in Redemption, Pt. II, when Data was given command of the Sutherland. The only other time we saw Data in red was in Future Imperfect. I think your idea is a good one, Snaploud. Would've definitelly made sense to have Data shift to command as preparation for assuming more responsibility. -- RR
     
  14. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Riker remembered her as a "Lieutenant" in "Encounter at Farpoint" - that is, he initially called her that, despite her new rank pins. This would suggest she had held Lieutenant rank when the two last met - meaning 2361 or later if "Second Chances" is to be believed. So we could argue her rank of Lieutenant Commander was basically brand new in 2363 when "Encounter at Farpoint" happened.

    As for the departmental color charts of ST:TMP and ST2 through 6, artist intent is one thing; onscreen reality is another. The TMP chart may hold for the most part, because it was just one movie, but Fletcher's colors for the next five movies plus the odd TNG or VOY flashback were mangled by so many costuming department decisions and mishaps that they probably aren't to be trusted as such.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  15. iguana_tonante

    iguana_tonante Admiral Admiral

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    This is my kind of Marine. ;)

    (caption reads: Silvia Russo, First woman Marine in the "San Marco" Regiment of the Italian Military Navy).