(UEFA) Football Thread - Football not Soccer

Discussion in 'Sports and Fitness' started by Jax, Apr 1, 2008.

  1. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    ^Well, I don't believe that a former England international knows nothing about Football, it's just that he spends his time asking questions instead of offering his own opinion.
     
  2. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    Well done, FIFA! You've just fraked yourselves.

    This rule is illegal within the European Union. It is an illegal restraint of trade and of an EU citizen's freedom of movement.

    The best case scenario is that the EU slaps this one down within their borders.

    The worst case scenario is that the big clubs just start their own competition outside of FIFA's influence.
     
  3. Roger Wilco

    Roger Wilco Admiral Admiral

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    Actually that'd be the best case. The FIFA (and the UEFA too btw) is nothing but a parasite on the sport. The hubris to think any of their rules could override fundamental EU policy principles is mindblowing, but it's exemplary of the opinion those corrupt technocrats have about themselves - thinking they operate outside of the rule of law.
     
  4. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    ^It would really, really hurt football. The big clubs wouldn't take the smaller clubs with them and there would be no promotion or relegation.

    As it stands, with the influx of foreign owners in to British football and number of the newly rich clubs' owners don't want to risk their investments by seeing their clubs relegated from the Premier League and have argued strongly to do away with relegation from the top flight.

    Of course, to ordinary football fans like you and me, that idea is abhorrent.
     
  5. Roger Wilco

    Roger Wilco Admiral Admiral

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    To be honest, I wouldn't mind the big clubs splitting off.
    I love the European Cup, playing against foreign clubs instead of the usual league routine (it's especially bad in the Austrian league, because there are just 10 clubs, and everyone plays against each other 4 times a season), is very fun and rewarding.
    But the difference in financial capabilities between a "middle class" club internationally (or slightly below that) like the one I support and the top clubs has become so enourmous that the game just isn't the same anymore. Three years ago, Rapid played in the Champions League and ended the group phase with no points and 3:15 goals in six games. And since then the gap has even widened for sure. Now we can barely compete in the UEFA-Cup anymore...

    Or take the Premier League as an example - you could predict with near certainty, that no club but Liverpool, Manchester United, Chelsea and Arsenal will have a shot at the championship within the next decade. Of course there are many clubs, who never had a realistic chance of winning a big title, and never will, but they could dream about it at least. How's that fair? Imo the Champions League is responsible for that.
     
  6. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    The amount of money available to the smaller clubs would decrease further, though. Sky would pay a lot less for the rights to a Premier League without the big four (and possibly the better supported non-big four sides like Everton, Tottenham, Villa, Newcastle etc).

    Yeah, the smaller clubs might win things more often, but the winner would be a small fish in an even smaller pond.

    I don't mean to be disrespectful to the smaller clubs here, just realistic.
     
  7. Jax

    Jax Admiral Admiral

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    I think FIFA need to Compromise...

    Next season we will have 18 not 16 man teams for a PL match so with that in mind FIFA should say 4 homegrown players in the 18 match day squad BUT but not starting line ups because you can't dictate a starting line up because your ruining a manager's tactics. Of course the rule could be waved for a short time due to injury and suspensions.
     
  8. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    If by "homegrown" you mean developed by the club (i.e. they played for the club between the ages of say 16 and 18) but regardless of nationality then I totally support that. Of course, I am biased because at Arsenal we have a number of such players and more coming through.

    But you can't do it by nationality, not in Europe.

    I don't support propping up bad players just because they've got the right passport. Competition is what makes players better. Even David Bentley agrees on that point.
     
  9. Daedalus12

    Daedalus12 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I think FIFA needs to stay out of business of interfering with club football period. In all the major sports in NA (football, basketball, hockey, and baseball) none of the international sporting bodies (FIBA for example) have any say over the club level competitions and that is the way it should be.
     
  10. Jax

    Jax Admiral Admiral

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    If Arsenal can't field 4 English players in a 18 man squad (don't have to start or play) then we might as well scrap international football in England. I don't agree with Blatter but the clubs need to do more and I can't see why a compromise cannot be achieved.
     
  11. TheArsenal

    TheArsenal Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    First off, it's an attack on the Premier League. Other leagues use far more "home grown" players and the rising dominance of the English clubs alarms the anti-English sentiment of FIFA, and Blatter in particular. The insulting, but accurate, implication is fielding more English players will bring down the quality of the big sides.

    Secondly, Hermiod makes a point. It's less about English than "home grown". Most believe this will harm the Gunners the most. Not true. As soon as Blatter began belching out this noxious idea, and a little before, Wenger has been planning for it. Arsenal buying 16 and 17 years olds a ways from the first team, looks less head scratching when you consider it in light of the potential rule change.
     
  12. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    We can, but you tell me Justin Hoyte deserves to be in the Arsenal side more than Bacary Sagna.

    International football is artificial. People only care about it once every two years when England scrape in to a tournament. They scraped in to Euro 92 and failed to qualify for World Cup 94 when most players in the Premier League were English.

    Arsenal do more to develop young players than anyone, we mix local kids up with kids from all over the world.

    The fact that there's been an English side in the last four Champions League finals is scaring the crap out of FIFA. We're back. The last attempt to kill us by kicking us out didn't work, we didn't stay down. We dominated in the 80's and we're dominating again.

    FIFA will be in for a scare when the likes of Jack Wilshire, Henri Lansbury, Mark Randall, Jay Simpson, Paul Rodgers and Kieran Gibbs break in to the first team next season.
     
  13. Roger Wilco

    Roger Wilco Admiral Admiral

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    Why does the FIFA even care about club football?
     
  14. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    ^Because they govern all football, not just Internationals.

    Another point. They want African football to develop. How, exactly, are they going to do that when clubs like Arsenal who have brought through players who are now some of Africa's best aren't allowed to play them anymore ?

    African clubs, sadly, don't have the facilities to do it themselves. I hope one day they will because their players are a gift to football, in my opinion.
     
  15. Daedalus12

    Daedalus12 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Which is why I suggested there should be a divorce between FIFA and club football.
     
  16. Hermiod

    Hermiod Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, and I don't disagree.
     
  17. TheArsenal

    TheArsenal Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The trouble with a divorce between club and international football is the clubs will run all over the international game, the non-European confederations in particular will suffer. They try to do that now, every chance they get. Without a body controlling both club and country football, I doubt seriously a player would ever be released for say, the African Cup of Nations.

    The problem, as I see it, is not FIFA itself. It is the people who run it. They are very uncomfortable with the shift in power from international to club football where they can exercise less control. Add to this power shift the fact they are even more uncomfortable with the 4 of the biggest clubs in the world being situated in England. And even more worrisome for the pinheads in Zürich is the largest emerging football markets, Asia and North America, naturally gravitate to the English game. More treasure into the Premier league's coffers. More dominance of English clubs.

    But instead of learning to live and grow with it, they fight it stupidly with such mad measures as this 6+5.
     
  18. Daedalus12

    Daedalus12 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The World Cup and the Euros won't be ran over. The same can be said about the Asian Cup, the Copa America, and the Gold Cup. I think a divorce would be good as it allows both sides to negotiate more instead of just FIFA dominating over everyone. The African Nations Cup should be moved to every 4 years. FIFA should also compensate the clubs for any player on international duty which has caused the said player to miss at leat one club match.

    Do you really want a massive world government style sporting body wielding a hammer over the state of your domestic football leagues? There is an old saying: "power (and money in this case) corrupts all" and FIFA has way too much power.

    For me FIFA is nothing more than a monstrosity. They are worse than the U.N. in the sense that they actually have great power.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2008
  19. Jax

    Jax Admiral Admiral

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    Didn't see this one coming...

    Don't see the point, I mean I like Beckham and think he should start every ENG game but he won't take the captaincy back full time and nor should he have it. Capello should of let Barry have it IMO though its a two horse race between Ferdinand & Terry anyway.
     
  20. Daedalus12

    Daedalus12 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I don't see Becks as a permanent captain. Don Fabio probably just want to douse out the burning speculations. There has been some rampant conflagrations in the media about Rio being the new permanent captain on the flimsy evidence that he is the only one from the Chelsea/Manc camp who is traveling to T&T. Imagine the firestorm if Rio is the captain in Sunday's game.

    By Calcio tradition though Becks should be the captain since he is the most senior and has the most caps.