TSFS - Horner's nod to Prokofiev?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by dub, Nov 13, 2013.

  1. dub

    dub Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I know I'm late to the game, but I just noticed this. Am I crazy or did James Horner take some inspiration from Prokofiev's ballet Romeo & Juliet for the part of the Star Trek III score when the Enterprise self destructs and burns up in the Genesis atmosphere?

    Starting at around 28:19 through around 28:36. It's even in the same key. :)

    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coxgnE3aTs0[/yt]
     
  2. RyanKCR

    RyanKCR Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It sounds almost identical. Start at :44
    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeLqsvFO31o[/yt]
     
  3. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    Sounds like a pretty obvious lift. Although, refreshingly for Horner, it's from a classical source rather than himself!
     
  4. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    Horner frequently lifted from the classics, and from himself. Some of his music during Cocoon lifts phrases from his Star Trek scores.

    It's not an uncommon practice. The Wizard of Oz is full of echoes from other music, from traditional tunes ("In the Shade of the Old Apple Tree"), to Mussorgsky's "Night on Bald Mountain".
     
  5. dub

    dub Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I knew Horner quoted himself a lot. I love his music. One of my favorites is "The Land Before Time," and there are even motifs in that score from TWOK. I've worn out my CD of that soundtrack. But today I was listening to Pandora, and the piece I mentioned in the original post was playing and I heard it -- I thought, that must be James Horner. I went to look, and it was surprised to see it was Prokoviev. I found another video on youtube someone made pointing out the similarity between the two scenes. The scene he was quoting was apparently Romeo at Juliet's grave. So Kirk is Romeo and Enterprise is Juliet? I think it's a beautiful metaphor. I do think it would have been neat to have that as a footnote on the soundtrack or something though. I'd love to hear him talk about it in an interview. What his thoughts were on that. What made him decide to use it, etc.
     
  6. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    I've not read an interview with him since the 20th century I think, and he'd said he'll never go back to Star Trek and that it's behind him. He wasn't happy that he was forced to use bagpipes and "Amazing Grace" in TWOK.
     
  7. dub

    dub Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Wow! "Amazing Grace" was great there! If I remember correctly...it wasn't included on the soundtrack I have. That explains why.
     
  8. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Captain Captain

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    If you think about it ... it's very appropriate to use that Romeo & Juliet Opera for inspiration, considering Kirk's long love affair with the Enterprise...
     
  9. 22 Stars

    22 Stars Commodore Commodore

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    Lol THIS
     
  10. Borjis

    Borjis Commodore Commodore

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    ^^ ha ha

    I was just watching TSFS yesterday and realized part of that scene (when the klingons are in the corridors of the enterprise) music reminds me A LOT of the horns section in the Aliens soundtrack when the Marines are being surrounded.

    Ya Horner does this quite a bit...more so than any other composer it seems.

    There's elements of TWOK that sound almost note for note similar to his work in: Krull.
    (with that giant spider)
     
  11. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Horner's boat chase music in Cocoon is a thinly revised version of some of his Mutara Nebula stuff.
     
  12. LMFAOschwarz

    LMFAOschwarz Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I remember that, Maurice...it was pretty distracting, actually!
     
  13. RyanKCR

    RyanKCR Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Check this out starting at 1:07:
    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BRv_3vMHCU[/yt]

    and compare with this starting at 3:25:
    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PR2v62mfdX4[/yt]
     
  14. LMFAOschwarz

    LMFAOschwarz Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Wow, it's worse than I thought!

    What, is James Horner the Irwin Allen of composers? :lol:
     
  15. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    That track from Battle Beyond the Stars has a little bit of Horner's The Mask of Zorro score in it, too.

    He's written three or four really great scores, and then reused them again, and again, and again...
     
  16. Indysolo

    Indysolo Commodore Commodore

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    "Juliet's Funeral" plays as Kirk enters Spock's quarters and encounters McCoy. The opening of "Stealing the Enterprise" quotes "Romeo Resolves to Avenge The Death of Mercutio". I joked that the liner notes for this expanded album should have been titled, "Star Crossed Trekkers".

    And if you like the moment from Trek II that also surfaced in Cocoon, check out this clip for the origin.

    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDqEBUFRWs8&feature=youtu.be&t=11m38s[/yt]

    Neil
     

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