TMP Klingons: what were they thinking?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Captrek, Aug 17, 2010.

  1. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Let's remember that the ship starts out from LEO on a tangential path where the sunrise is behind her. That's not the trajectory she follows moments later... She's probably still in the previously established process of turning towards the sun in that reverse view scene, then, making it possible she's heading very close to the sun after all. :vulcan: ;)

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  2. USS Triumphant

    USS Triumphant Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Go ahead, caller. I'm listening...
    I've kinda always figured the Klingons that were investigating V'Ger were Klingon Defense Force ships, and sort of the equivalent of the poor bastards in the helicopters with the signal lights in the movie Independence Day. They weren't there because they wanted to attack, or were looking for treasure, or anything else. They were there because the Klingon government said, "go find out what that is and if it poses a threat or can be turned to our use" and so they followed orders.
     
  3. Joshuavance1701

    Joshuavance1701 Cadet Newbie

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    Here's a discussion you don't quite see everyday. Fan of this great film and related media materials.

    The visuals and depiction during these scenes are somewhat ambiguous, however I believe the intention was definitely that the Klingons as well as Enterprise encountered/confronted the Vejur cloud at warp velocities.

    Kirk indicates to Scotty that the Vejur cloud is "less than 3 days away from this planet" at the time of Epsilon 9's data transmissions alerting Starfleet of the approaching cloud. It would not be possible for Vejur to reach Earth from the Klingon/Federation border at sub-light velocities.

    The novel though not official canon, elaborates greatly on the notion of how the Klingons and Enterprise achieved approaching the "intruder" cloud. The cloud was stated as traveling at Warp 7 in the novel if memory serves. At that velocity the cloud passed through Klingon space so rapidly, that particular formation of cruisers were the only ships available to intercept. They simply happened to be on patrol of the border. I believe the intention was that the cloud did not traverse the entirety of Klingon space but rather popped in from another region and skirted the Klingons frontier sectors.
    The Klingons and Enterprise would have overtaken the cloud from behind as it traveled at warp velocities. This would infact give the appearance as they approached of both objects traveling at sublight velocities as they maintained a constant velocity relative to each other. Its entirely possible though no evidence to suggest, that the cloud was of such enormous power it would have been possible to infact disengage warp once the power field was penetrated and still be "carried" along with the vessel at warp velocities, much as our own heliosphere around our solar system acts as its own self contained enviroment from instellar space.
    The Klingons of course possessed the same scanning technology as Epsilon 9 and the Enterprise. They simply reacted with hubris to the violation of their space by an unknown "intruder." Being a war-like species this hubris blinded them to the threat a mere "cloud" could pose. Once their weapons were rendered ineffective and the first cruiser was "digitized", the Klingons then retreated. One could argue they simply could have dropped out of warp and immediately been millions upon millions of miles away from harm as the cloud and plasma energy weapon discharges sped away at warp velocities. No doubt there was a certain amount of panic involved when the first cruiser was reduced to data. It should be noted it is a true testament to the Enteprise technology and shields to survive even one direct impact of the plasma bolt. The Klingon starships are built for combat and warfare and their deflector screens could not absorb the plasma energy. It was said Vejur has knowledge that spans the entire universe, and Spock witnessed not only Epsilon 9, but planets, moons, stars, even entire galaxies that had been digitized and reduced to data by Vejur. In the novel, it indicates Vejurs curiosity was piqued when the Enterprise wasn't initially digitized by the offending plasma bolt. Poor Epsilon 9 didn't know what hit it.
     
  4. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Just FYI it's considered bad form to resuscitate long dead topics like this one. If it's old and long-inactive it's preferred that you start a new post on the topic. But welcome.
     
  5. inflatabledalek

    inflatabledalek Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Whilst I get the logic flaws, I love the Klingon scene in TMP. It's probably my favourite "straight" (ie, I enjoy it as intended rather than because it's inadvertently quite funny like the "PHOOOOTON TORPEDOOOOOOESSSSSS AWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYY" scene) bit of the film, nice and tense and looks gorgeous. Odd how the Enterprise in the same situation later in the film can't muster up any of the same tension.
     
  6. dub

    dub Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Location? What is this?
    I always assumed the Klingons were initially probed by V'ger prior to the start of the film, so as Klingons their first instinct was to attack. Size matters not to Klingons (and Yoda). The actual calculation of the size of V'ger is not something I ever cared to analyze. It was clear the writers were trying to say this thing was bigger than anything ever imagined, and that was good enough for me.

    I know this isn't quite on topic, but I think it would have been far more interesting if the crew was seeing memories ("data") of planets, aliens and objects on the screen as they initially passed through on the way to the center/heart of v'ger -- the sort of stuff hinted at during Spock's walk, but more of it and earlier in the film. So much time passes and we're just seeing reaction shots cutting back and forth to beautiful but random animations. That should be the most jaw-dropping part of the film, but it's the point I usually fall asleep. But even if it were scripted that way, I'm sure it would have been impossible given the level of effects back then and the budget/time concerns. They were lucky to get those animations I suppose. But it would have been more interesting to watch, IMO. That, and changing the uniforms. ;)