Thoughts on Season 2

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by dub, Sep 4, 2013.

  1. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2001
    Location:
    Burlington, VT, USA
    Lynx, I have to say your unwavering support of all things Kes frankly, to me, borders on the creepy. Things like getting your hackles up because of one emoticon...I mean really, is that such a huge deal?

    Anyway, instead of us comparing what we've heard, how about providing sources that we can actually check against?

    It seems likely to me that she must have known well prior to filming "The Gift" given that her credit had already been changed in the previous episode, unless "The Gift" was actually filmed first. But that strikes me as unlikely.
     
  2. KaraBear

    KaraBear Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2013
    She got the information that she was going to be leaving before filming of Scorpion Part 2 because she is listed as a guest star. This is a fact. You need to take a step back and look at the facts objectively. 1) she was listed as a guest star in the previous episode, as I mentioned earlier, this involves a different contract, and different pay, 2) she wasn't in any of the season 4 promo material. Therefore she knew well before she was handed a script to The Gift.

    Just because you didn't like that she left doesn't change facts of the matter
     
  3. Lynx

    Lynx Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2001
    Location:
    Lynx Empire
    Creepy? Me? :eek:

    And I thought that I was such a nice and pleasant fellow.

    As for the emoticon, I just found it a bit annoying. Being fired isn't funny. It happened to me a couple of years ago and it wasn't a pleasant experience.

    As for my support for the character, well someone's gotta do it and the way the character was treated was among the worst I've seen in a series.

    Sources? Well, I find this information quite reliable http://reocities.com/Area51/zone/3939/lien.htm
    especially since I've heard the same from some other people as well.

    She might have gotten the information about not being wanted anymor shortly before the filming of "Scorpion 2" started, that's not impossible. But obviously she was informed rather late about it.
     
  4. KaraBear

    KaraBear Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2013
    Right, she was already a guest star in Scorpion 2 so she knew then, and as I said she wasn't in any of the season 4 promotions.
     
  5. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2013
    Location:
    Containment Area for Relocated Yankees
    According to Piccardo she knew beforehand. According to Phillips she learned in the Gift script. Neither position cancels out the other. And its always possible to retroactively put a contract in place, so the credits are no indication.
     
  6. teya

    teya Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2001
    Location:
    2 mi S of Capt Braxton's shopping cart
    Show business is a business & it's a business in which the talent is unionized. Producers & studios work under strict SAG guidelines in the treatment of actors.

    Jennifer, like the rest of the cast, had a 3 season contract. She would have known long before filming that her contract was not renewed along with the rest of the cast.

    Plus, her agent would have had to negotiate with TPTB for her salary for her guest starring roles in Scorpion 2 & The Gift.
     
  7. KaraBear

    KaraBear Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2013
    what was so horrible about the way she was treated? it's pretty standard in hollywood. You take an acting job, and at some point it ends. You seem to be more upset about the actress leaving than the actress herself! it's been so so many years since this happend, she's moved on, maybe you should too.

    and there is absolutely nothing reliable about that site. It's just some free site someone (maybe you?) whipped together in 10 minutes and wrote their own thoughts. how about a quote from someon on set?

    Like before I've provided quotes from Lien herself about how she didn't mind leaving and wasn't upset about it, and I included the magazine issue the interview where she said that was from. That wuld be a reliabl source.

    I don't find it hard to believe that it would be sad for her to go, afte three years of course it would be sad. But there is a difference between being sad, and being upset.

    It's like being a temp. you get an assignment that is supposed to last a certain amount of time, after that amount of time your contract is done and you go to the next job. It might be sad to leave if you've been there for a while, but from the very beginning you knew you were only ging to be there for a limited amount of time
     
  8. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2001
    Location:
    Burlington, VT, USA
    You may or may not be a nice and pleasant fellow, but usually when I interact with you you seem wound up about Kes and unwilling to hear anything that might be less than glowing about her. As I've already said, it damages your credibility and frankly is at the point where I don't tend to look forward to your participation in threads. I wish you'd take some time to consider our concerns regarding your lack of objectivity.

    Under some circumstances I think being fired is quite funny. For instance, when you call in sick and then post pictures of yourself drunk at a football game to your Facebook account which your supervisor stumbles upon.

    Amusingly, I was going to say that three years on a major television series is more than many actors ever get, but then I realized you were talking about the character, not the actress. Frankly I think she was treated better than Neelix. She certainly was treated better than Mayweather! Some people might argue she was treated better than Gul Dukat in his later appearances as well. Anyway, bad treatment of characters happens; it's not a crime.

    I don't believe it's been established that she "obviously" was informed late.

    FWIW I reviewed Memory Alpha (which granted is a wiki) and didn't see anything to suggest that Lien received late notice that she'd be leaving the show. Which doesn't rule it out, but I'd feel more inclined to believe the argument being made if it was mentioned there.
     
  9. Lynx

    Lynx Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2001
    Location:
    Lynx Empire
    Well, I thought it was horrible, but that's me.

    No, I didn't create that site with the quote I posted a link to. I already have a site, you can find it at the bottom of my posts.

    Frankly, I do find the information on that website more, or at least as believable than official propaganda.

    As for Lien's statement in that article, it was published a long time after the firing so I guess she had got over it by then.
     
  10. teya

    teya Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2001
    Location:
    2 mi S of Capt Braxton's shopping cart
    The only way she would have only found out that she was leaving the show when she got the script for The Gift (as Lynx alleges), would be if she paid absolutely no attention to the contracts her agent handed her to sign so that she would be paid for the 1st 2 episodes of the 4th season. She would have had to have been unaware that she hadn't signed a contract for the next three seasons.

    I just don't think Jennifer is that stupid. She'd been in the business since she was a teen. She wasn't a naive kid who fell off a turnip truck.

    She knew how the business worked.
     
  11. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2003
    Location:
    San Francisco Bay Area, CA
    There were many things I liked about Season 2, such as the Cullah/Seska and Voyager story. Then there were some stories I wish was done a whole lot better like Tom Paris acting out of line to bring out the Maquis Traitor (Investigations almost ruined that story for me). I also liked many of the episodes this year with my top 5 being:

    Deadlock
    Resistance
    Basics I
    Meld
    The Thaw

    Overall, I would say it was a good season, but not a great season.
     
  12. KaraBear

    KaraBear Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2013
    I would definatel agree with you about those being the highlights in season 2. I would also personally add Death Wish to that list because for one I love any Q episode, and two I thought the moral delema that Janeway faced was interesting.

    Resistance is one of those episodes that while I love I'm reluctant to watch becaus it makes me cry at the end, but that just means it was well done.

    I think the Thaw was really well done, the world they created bordered really well on a fun circus to creepy clown without being cheesy about it. I always wondered though, while they were being carrid to have their heads cut off, if they had just remained calm, would it have killed them?
     
  13. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2003
    Location:
    San Francisco Bay Area, CA
    I forgot about Death Wish. While I liked Q and the Gray, Death Wish was the final Q episode post All Good Things... that I would consider a classic.
     
  14. Isolinear

    Isolinear Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    I never was a fan of the Kazon episodes, so Season 2 was definitely hit and miss for me.

    Voyager travelled lightyear after lightyear, but still kept running into the same Kazon ships with Seska on board. On top of that, the Kazon were agressive morons, somehow capable of running starships!?! And don't get me started on their silly hairdo......:rofl:

    My favorite Season 2 episodes:

    1. The Thaw
    2. Projections
    3. Prototype
    4. Meld
    5. Persistence of Vision
    6. Non Sequitur
     
  15. dub

    dub Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2012
    Location:
    Location? What is this?
    Yeah, I was thinking since they've been traveling at high warp (more or less) for the past 2 years, at some point soon Neelix isn't going to know anything about "this area of space." But I'm in season 3 and so far Neelix is still providing information. I don't get that.
     
  16. Isolinear

    Isolinear Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    Actually one of the few continuity problems Voyager handled really well in my opinion. Soon my friend, soon.... :)
     
  17. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2003
    Location:
    San Francisco Bay Area, CA
    Where in Season 3 are you? Don't want to spoil anything if this is your first time so I would suggest keep watching.
     
  18. Pondwater

    Pondwater Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2011
    I enjoyed the episodes encountering the Vidiians over the Kazon. My favorites of season 2 include: "Lifesigns", "Deadlock", "Resolutions", "Deathwish" and "The Thaw".
     
  19. Isolinear

    Isolinear Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    The Thaw is a real nightmare, the only truly scary Star Trek episode. That clown was the most unpredictable villain in all of Star Trek. A 10 out of 10.
     
  20. Captain Kathryn

    Captain Kathryn Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2013
    Location:
    Captain Kathryn
    I love Michael McKean (he played the clown) so I've always had a soft spot for that episode. He is a very funny actor.