TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by TheGodBen, Oct 16, 2011.

  1. Deranged Nasat

    Deranged Nasat Vice Admiral Admiral

    Agreed. Worf holds the Klingon warrior tradition in high esteem, but in the sense of practicing a religion. He participates in ritual (various competitions, etc) and through training keeps himself in shape in accordance with the way of the warrior. That's not the same as actually having lived the warrior's life the way Klingons like Kor or Martok have. It makes him proficient with weapons and very good in a fight, but "warrior" is still an ideal for him; an aspect of identity, not a job description.

    Worf's a security man who happens to live by a tradition that promotes physical prowess and combat. O'Brien, meanwhile, was an actual soldier and saw action in disputed territories, on the ground. He may be about 1/10th as martial in terms of his outlooks and interests, and he obviously couldn't compare to Worf in terms of weapons proficiency or physical contests, but in terms of the realities of combat outside of ritualized tradition (well, to the extent that warfare isn't always ritualized tradition, but that's another matter...), I'd bet on O'Brien. Worf is often detatched from realities of non-"honourable" combat, perhaps especially emotional realities. He doesn't see combat and death primarily in terms of the people affected, he sees them as an abstract idealized frame of reference for his personal belief system.

    On a related note, in terms of experience, I'd think O'Brien was more useful on that front than Worf any day, precisely because O'Brien cares nothing for combat but has still engaged in it. Who would you rather trust in, the person whose perceptions are welded to a preconceived and often idealized idea of how combat works, along with a long list of culturally-approved descriptors designed to warp the experience into butressing a ideological framework defining his people, or the guy who had no interest in combat beforehand (or afterward), and simply found himself engaging in it at one point in his career, doing the best he could, and who can share his personal experience without anything at stake for him beyond the act of advising? ;)
     
  2. Harvey

    Harvey Admiral Admiral

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    Well, Worf did serve during the Klingon Civil War that lasted three months or so (IIRC).
     
  3. Deranged Nasat

    Deranged Nasat Vice Admiral Admiral

    Good point. :) I for one forget about that (mostly because it was a rather rushed affair and isn't mentioned by Worf very often)...
     
  4. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Looking for par'Mach in All the Wrong Places (****½)

    What is love? Baby don't hurt me, don't hurt me no more.

    [yt]v=Bs8Jfh3DSTU[/yt]

    [​IMG]

    Okay, so this isn't really a romance-of-the-week episode, I've just been itching to post that video ever since I found it. And aren't you glad I shared? ;) This is kinda more of a I-want-to-have-sex-of-the-week episode, which is very normal for most people but a departure from the format for post-Kirk Trek. Worf is sexually attracted to Grilka and in his desire to be a good Klingon he mistakes his feelings for par'Mach and attempts to get into her armour. Meanwhile, Quark also wants to get into her armour and pretends it's par'Mach to do so. For a comedy episode, this is far more grounded in actual human behaviour than normal romace episodes.

    What can I say other than that this episode episode is a joy to watch? It's whimsical, has some good gags, and actually contains some meaningful character material for Worf. I found myself grinning through most of the episode, which is an unusual change from the scowl I attempt to maintain while judging television shows. Some of the scenes may have been a little too rich in comedy goodness, but I'm willing to give it a pass.

    Meanwhile, Miles and Kira are in their quarters one night, making out with each other. As things start to get more intense, Miles begins to take off Kira's uniform. Kira smiles warmly, and says "We should have done this a long time ago." Miles leans over and nuzzles Kira playfully. "I agree," he says, "but let's not tell Keiko."

    Then they had sex right on the couch.

    Or something like that.
     
  5. gazomg

    gazomg Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    enjoyed that episode, the part with worf doing the moves for quark during the challenge came across as rubbish though and too overplayed but a minor grievance in the overall show.
    everything else was pretty decent for a light hearted episode
     
  6. apenpaap

    apenpaap Commodore Commodore

    It was a brilliant episode, a very worthy sequel to the equally excellent House of Quark. I thought the scene with Quark fighting using the control thingie with Worf was brilliant, only at the end did I remember no-one was actually being controlled; Armin Shimerman was just acting his ass off. I also liked the old Klingon quite a lot, and how, when Worf was trying to woo Grilka, he didn't go the standard shouty Klingon "DISHONOURABLE DOG, FIGHT ME TO THE DEATH!!!!" thing, but just took Worf aside and explained she was not interested like a normal person. And Worf and Jadzia playing Cyrano for Quark... Well, overall this episode was just a delight.
     
  7. Skywalker

    Skywalker Admiral Admiral

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    I laughed so hard at Quark's expression after Worf broke the transmitter. :lol:
     
  8. Worf'sParmach

    Worf'sParmach Commander Red Shirt

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    I literally LOL'ed at "his... eccentricities." Sisko makes a better Klingon than Worf.

    Agreed.

    This gets touched on very briefly in "Let He Who is Without Sin" )or as I prefer to call is "That Episode We Do Not Speak Of"). Worf is kind of a textbook Klingon who has all these ideals but has never lived with Klingons aside from a few months here or there. He acts all "tough Klingon" but what does he really know? When push comes to shove, he'd much rather have a glass of prune juice than anything else.

    Also agree on how fun "Par'mach" was. I even liked the O'Brien/Kira thing, it was a bold yet realistic direction for them to explore. It sucks that the follow up to it ("That Episode We Do Not Speak Of") was so craptastic.
     
  9. Ln X

    Ln X Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Looking for... Wrong Places is probably one of DS9's most funny episodes! I could say more but I'm down with one nasty cold. Though I would like to say shame on O'Brien for even thinking about making out with Kira! But he can be included with the few men to see Kira naked: Bareil, Shakaar, plus Odo of course.
     
  10. apenpaap

    apenpaap Commodore Commodore

    Hehe, I had forgotten about the O'Brien/Kira subplot. I loved that, especially the moment when they suddenly both realised what was happening, as well as how mean Odo was when talking to Kira (Who'd ever have guessed he'd act like that to her? It left me wondering whether Quark or Julian was on the other side of that table for a moment).
     
  11. BennyRussel

    BennyRussel Commander Red Shirt

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    I don't know about that. I'm sure Kira had to use her sex appeal on more than one occasion in the name of the resistance. We already know she likely had an affair with a Bajoran collaborator (in order to get close enough to kill him.)

    She was also smart enough to send some horny Cardassian hoodlums to their doom with their pants around their ankles.

    I would say Bareil, Shakaar, Odo and O'Brien are the only men to see Kira naked ... and live to talk about it.
     
  12. Seven of Five

    Seven of Five Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I love the Par'Mach episode. Worf controls Quark to avoid embarrassment with Grilka. With sexy results!
     
  13. Ln X

    Ln X Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    What happened to the reviews? :shrug:
     
  14. apenpaap

    apenpaap Commodore Commodore

    Maybe GodBen watched a few episodes onwards and died of spontaneous haemorrhaging in his brain caused by watching Let he Who is Without Sin...
     
  15. Worf'sParmach

    Worf'sParmach Commander Red Shirt

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    LOL. A high plausible explaination.
     
  16. Sykonee

    Sykonee Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Hopefully, it's just something like Diablo 3 eating up his time.
     
  17. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I've never actually played a Diablo game and I have no idea what they're about. :shrug:

    I watched Nor the Battle... a few weeks ago and half-wrote the review, but then I got called away and I just haven't gotten around to finishing it for some reason. Hopefully not much longer.
     
  18. Sykonee

    Sykonee Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Heh, neither have I. From what I can gather on the internet, Diablo 3 is a game about trying to log onto some external server. If you stay online for more than a few hours, it means you're winning.

    Sounds like a boring game if you ask me, but it's apparently a huge seller.:borg:
     
  19. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I have a similar game on my phone, it's called the Connectivity Menu.
     
  20. TheGodBen

    TheGodBen Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Nor the Battle to the Strong (*****)

    I went back and forth about the score for this episode, I don't hand out five star reviews lightly (as you may have noticed), and I struggle to justify them to myself when I do, often focusing on minor flaws so I have some reason to strip the episode of half a star. And this episode does have some minor flaws to it, such as the randomness of the Klingons breaking the ceasefire and then reinstating it, or how it's sometimes a little wearying with the "war is hell" message. But this episode does one thing perfectly, and that is utilising a character that usually gets the least development and giving him a story that's meaningful, and which suits where he's at and where he's going.

    Star Trek focuses so much time on Starfleet officers and the heroic deeds that they get up to that it's all too easy to forget that these people are supposed to represent the best that humanity (and alienity) have to offer. But what about the civilians, what about the carpenters, and the factory workers, and the writers? They just lives their lives doing normal things. Maybe they'll happen upon someone drowning one day and become an accidental hero by rescuing them, but for most of them the closest they come to heroism is reading about it in a book, or acting it out in the safety of the holodeck. Star Trek normally ignores these people, they're the extras in the background that run for cover while the heroes are shooting things. And there's nothing wrong with that, they're not cowardly for not wanting to be in the line of fire, but we're just so used to following the heroes that it comes across that way.

    Jake's not a coward, and he's not a hero, and it's interesting watching him grappling with the complexities of just being normal. And while it may be a little too neat to end the episode with the message that Jake's willingness to admit he's not brave makes him brave in a different way, it's kinda true. I've had moments of cowardice in my life that I'm not going to write down and admit even anonymously over the internet, and I'll continue to overemphasise the moments of bravery I've had 'til the end of my days. Because I'm a coward like that. But perhaps my willingness to admit that I'm a coward about my cowardice really makes me brave? And does my willingness to mention my bravery just then really make me a coward? But does that make me brave?

    For creating this never-ending loop of rhetorical questions, this episode earns five stars.