The Twilight Saga: Eclipse - Discussion and Grading

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Dream, Jun 29, 2010.

  1. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2001
    Location:
    Hotel Transylvania
    The third Twilight movie is released this week. Looks like more dumb fun for those, like myself, that like vampires.

    As Seattle is ravaged by a string of mysterious killings and a malicious vampire continues her quest for revenge, Bella once again finds herself surrounded by danger. In the midst of it all, she is forced to choose between her love for Edward and her friendship with Jacob — knowing that her decision has the potential to ignite the ageless struggle between vampire and werewolf. With her graduation quickly approaching, Bella has one more decision to make: life or death.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2010
  2. ialfan

    ialfan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC
    Well since noone else is posting, I shall. I found it to be the best Twilight movie yet. Yes they are guilty pleasures but imo this movie was genuinely good and managed to spotlight all the characters in some way.
     
  3. Gojira

    Gojira Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Location:
    Stompin' on Tokyo
    All the buzz is that this is the best of them so far. I must admit I did enjoy the first two despite knowing it is pretty cheesy and makes my eyes roll a bit. A guilty pleasure is a good way to describe these movies.
     
  4. Dream

    Dream Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2001
    Location:
    Hotel Transylvania
    Above average.

    I liked the movie. It was much better than Twilight and New Moon. Eclipse was the best book in the series, so its not surprising that it made the best movie. The main reason was that we learn the most about the vampries in this. David Slade, the new director, did well. All the fights at were cool.

    The first movie was dragged down by Bella finding out about the existence of Vampires, while the second movie was dragged down by Bella learning about werewolves. But in Eclipse, big things actually happen. Bella graduates from high school, thinks about how to spend the rest of her live, and there is the main plot with the newborn Vampires.

    I was only disappointed with the three flashbacks. In the book, an entire chaper is dedicated to each one and much more background is given. We only get a few short scenes in the movie. I wish we could get movies about them since they were so interesting.

    The next book is terrible. I kinda of wish Summit wasn't making it.
     
  5. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    Bring on the uterus slaughter and infantile pedophillia!
     
  6. Vonstadt

    Vonstadt Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2003
    Location:
    Madison Square Garden : Let's Go Rangers!
    Sad part is from what I hear that is kinda acurate :wtf:

    Vons
     
  7. marillion

    marillion Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2003
    Location:
    Workin' in a coal mine...
    I'm almost loath to admit that I saw it today.. A good friend wanted to see it and since we both had the day off, I agreed.. I've only seen parts of the first and none of the second, but I know the story and how it goes.

    I found it to be ok.. What action there was, was pretty good.. You can tell Tyler whatshisname has a lot of fun with the roll and doesn't mind spending most of the film without a shirt on..

    But where are the fangs? Vampires are supposed to have fangs.. LOL
     
  8. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2003
    Location:
    Warrrrrrrrrshington, DC
    Have you ever met a vampire that had fangs? :lol:

    I saw it. It's really good. I'm happy that after the farce that was New Moon, Slade replaced Chris Weitz and made this. I loved Rob Pattinson's acting in it and I feel vindicated because I said here before that I felt that he can actually act. He brought the book Edward to life. I actually liked the first movie. It had something in it that was sort of magical and whimsical. I like the indie feel it had. This was more of a true blockbuster in the way New Moon (or Bad Moon as some of us like to call it lol!) aspired toward.

    I heard it made 33 million just last night. I'll be watching to see if it has better legs than New Moon (which was pretty much front loaded). I think Twilight even had better legs than New Moon. I know I've watched it a number of times on dvd and cable.
     
  9. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    It is. Oh, it is!
     
  10. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2003
    Location:
    Warrrrrrrrrshington, DC
    I can't wait for the "Jacob's a pedo" jokes to start. actually, I think they'll be re-writing some stuff. I think Meyers is now a producer on BD 1 and 2. that fact alone portends something along the lines of a massive revision.

    for now, I'm just glad this movie's making a whole lotta dough. it's high time a fangirl saga made just as much money as that stupid Transformers crap! go Girl Power! :lol:

    ETA:

    The newest numbers have Eclipse putting up a $68.5 million total on its first day, breaking the Wednesday opening record of $62 million set by Transformers 2.

    The film also had the biggest summer period opening ever, beating Dark Knight ($67.2mil). It fell just short of the opening record set by its predecessor (New Moon) -- $72million. But that was a Friday opening.

    Eclipse opened to 33.8 million for midnight shows across the country (Tuesday).
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2010
  11. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    I just want to know how they'll going to pull off the baby's, er, "extraction."

    FWIW, I plan on seeing this movie in the theater sometime in the next couple of days with as full of a theater as possible to get the "full" Twilight experience. I half-considered going to a midnight showing the other night but, well, I wans't that obsessed. ;)
     
  12. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2003
    Location:
    Warrrrrrrrrshington, DC
    I am not concerned so much about the extraction. We're talking Bill Condon here. But I;ll be eagerly awaiting the complete revisionist take on Jacob. Either way, if they keep the "imprint" business, it'll look wierd as hell. sorta incestuous, if you ask me. But Meyers wrote this stuff so she's gotta get herself out of it. :guffaw:
     
  13. Myasishchev

    Myasishchev Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Location:
    America after the rain
    Can't wait for the Rifftrax, which is as good a justification as any movie has for existing. :)
     
  14. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    The Rifftrax got me to buy, and watch, the previous two movies but this one, and certainly the next one (two?) will get me into the theater just for the "crowd experience."
     
  15. doubleohfive

    doubleohfive Fleet Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2001
    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    I saw it this morning.

    While it was leaps and bounds better than New Moon, which was just plain awful, there was a subtlety that I appreciated, that you don't normally find in genre fare these days. It's still an emo whinge-fest to the extreme, and it's hard to not wonder if this series will have the same affect on young girls that Sex and the City had on adolescent and twenty-something women over the last few years, but as a film I can't say it was entirely all *THAT* bad.

    -doubleoh, shocked.
     
  16. Daneel

    Daneel Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2009
    Location:
    Toronto
    Haven't seen it, have no interest in seeing it, but I did go to the cinema yesterday (to see Knight and Day), and sure enough, there were hordes of teenage girls throughout the place, waiting in line-ups, a few dressed up, and a number with words like "Team Edward" and "Team Jacob" scribbled on their faces. And this is still probably more socially acceptable than Trek fans dressing up in Starfleet uniforms. ;)

    Oh, and apparently, it's already made $68.5 million. That means it made its budget back in one day. One day! I guess those emo teenage girls are a force to be reckoned with.
     
  17. UncleRogi

    UncleRogi Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2009
    Location:
    Hanover NH, the catspaw of Atoning Unifex
    Wont read them; wont watch them; they are wimp vampires.

    Talk to Lestat, Khayman, Maharet, Gabrielle, Armand, and of course Marius.

    Do your research , Kids.

    Vlad Dracul, Le loup garou
    (Silver has no effect on a were-wolf; as a cross as no effect on a vampire.)
    silver cannot be used as a bullet-chemistry.
    Why would a vampire be afraid of someone who gave His life for death? Jealousy?
    We wont go into mirrors.

    You kids are so caught up in the romance--nothing romantic about depriving others of life so YOU can live forever. Are the powers that be teaching you selfishness, at the expense of others?

    That's what I got out of Business School.

    Think about it
     
  18. doubleohfive

    doubleohfive Fleet Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2001
    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    At the risk of sounding like I'm defending the Twilight Saga (believe me, I'm not), there are different, legitimate interpretations of vampire and werewolf lore where the vulnerabilities you are discussing don't necessarily have to be present or not.

    Example: On Buffy The Vampire Slayer (the television series), vampires turn to dust when beheaded, staked, or set on fire. Vampires though don't sleep in coffins ("It's a myth!" says Angel).

    On True Blood however, some vampires do sleep in coffins, or under the floorboards, and they explode with bloody organs and entrails all over the place.

    Seemingly in the Twilight films, they shatter as if made of ice or some other weakened stone.

    I guess my point is simply that there's room for all kinds of interpretations about the mythology surrounding these types of characters, so hinging your whole reasoning for not liking the films or books on it seems ... well, uninformed.

    Think about it.
     
  19. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2001
    Location:
    Kansas City
    To me, the Twilight series took the whole thing to a bit of a... stupid level. Vampires get a random super power, they sparkle in sunlight (seriously, what the fuck is that?!) and they seem to be unkillable -even by sunlight- unless they're killed by one of the flamboyant illuminati vampires by getting their head ripped off... or whatever.

    There's many interpetations of vampires, sure, but one wonders what made Meyer call these "vampires" rather than just come up with something else or just treat them as the more traditional vampire. (They sparkle in sunlight, seriously... What... The... Fuck?!) Don't get me started on the whole "is Jacob a werewolf or isn't he" thing. (He's not.)

    Then there's the whole thing where this book/movie series is sold and presented as some great teenage love story when a deep interpretation of it shows that it has pretty misogynistic attitudes and bad messages for teenage girls.

    (Remember girls, if a guy you really like breaks-up with you he doesn't really mean it. So mope around for several months, cry out at night like a crazy person and if you threaten to kill yourself it'll make him come running back to you! Oh, and doing dangerous things will give you that same "rush" you feel when you're with him. And you should manipulate other men to get what you want.... and C-Sections really suck.)

    And, honestly, as much as I've seen this movies and heard about the stories I'm not sure where any Mormon/LDS symbolism comes into play. My best friend who is LDS doesn't see any symbolism in it either. Whatever, Meyer. Oh, and Bella has such a terrible character flaw in that she's so perfect... except she's not because she's clumbsy.

    God these movies suck.
     
  20. doubleohfive

    doubleohfive Fleet Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2001
    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    Putting aside the qualitative (and elegantly stated!) assessment of the books and films, I do wonder about the effect these stories will have on young women in the coming years and the message it sends about manipulating young men.

    Honestly, beyond the moping Bella does for Edward, the middle-school emo elements of their relationship, and then Jacob's so-called love for Bella, the real message that gives me serious pause is simply the complete and totally unabashed way Bella clearly uses Jacob. Granted, it's nothing new, we've seen this kind of love triangle before in vampire fiction, but it's not been quite so overt or unapologetic before.

    There are teenage girls out there who will see these movies and read these books and decide that this is how they should treat men. I'm not saying all will, I'm just saying that I don't agree with the message either series is sending to young, impressionable girls.

    Then again, it's really no different than the sometimes misogynistic behavior displayed in the James Bond novels and films. Or, the way any of the sexually frustrated nerds on this very BBS turn their heads (and their staunch opinions :lol: ) the minute a pretty face appears and barely acknowledges their existence. Myself, I don't particularly care for either behavior. But people have been conditioned to expect certain treatment as a result of certain behavior.

    Example: Troi's Fabulous Wigs posts a picture of herself in a bikini, and suddenly dozens of guys who disagreed with her stance on equal marriage are agreeing with her. Likewise, if your boyfriend breaks up with you, as long as you communicate to the rest of the world how much it sucks, how sad you are, and your life (literally!) screeches to a standstill, he will come back to you and make it all better.

    For this alone, Bella is probably one of the worst female protagonists in the history of literature; she isn't proactive, she's just plain reactive. And, as I'm sure many of the male membership here can attest, the guy who is actually the better choice of the two, the one who has more to offer and to give, and the one who probably is closest to actually loving her, is just the crutch she uses till Edward the Stalker returns. Beyond the faux-tragic trappings for Romeo & Juliet and even the insipid Star Wars Episode II vibe I got while watching the last scene of the film (it happened in New Moon as well), it's just wholly ridiculous.

    I get that people can't control who they love (wouldn't it be nice if we could though?) and that it is certainly possible to be in love with two people at once (been there, got the T-shirt), and, believe it or not, I get loving someone you can't be with so much that it hurts like hell..... but the melodrama is so poured on that it taints any of the other positive or interesting elements to the story.

    I'm not so hung up on the particulars of the vampire fiction in this iteration -- if Stephanie Meyer wants to make her vampires be sparkly and pretty, let her make them thusly. It's her baby, her world to build. I don't know that I'd make my vampires sparkly in my (hypothetical) vampire novel, but that's me, not her. Translation: this is a superficial element to a piece of literature and cinema with larger, far-reaching implications in our modern culture.

    As someone with a younger 20-something kid sister and who also has younger 20-something female friends and as someone who has seen first-hand the geek-squee-ing and tacit approval given to Edward's stalking and Jacob's constant spurning, it just bothers me that these are the role models in fiction that kids today can look to.

    Say what you want about the Harry Potter books and novels, they were at least smart kids and (mostly) wholesome role models.


    As for the Mormon/Latter Day Saint influence/content, well, I don't know enough about the tenets of either to speak to this part of the discussion, but again -- it's Stephanie Meyer's universe, so of course she's going to be informed by her faith while writing. Just because I don't agree with said tenets or religion, doesn't automatically make their inclusion wrong or bad.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2010