The trouble with trailers for 3D films.....

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies XI+' started by Transwarp Drive, Oct 20, 2012.

  1. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    I recall reading something about them shooting scenes as written, with all actors in place and dialogue spoken, and then for each scene doing a "second pass" through the empty set, duplicating exactly all of the camera movements of the filmed "live" take. Would that second pass be with a 3D or digital camera, do you suppose?


    "Siberius". It was confirmed using Software, remember?
     
  2. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's not possible.
     
  3. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    Could you explain why it's not?

    Anyway, I think this is the bit I remember reading. If it isn't the identical interview, it's talking about the same process I was attempting to describe in the post previous:

    http://trekmovie.com/2012/06/06/exc...us-3d-process-team-already-talking-3rd-movie/
     
  4. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Then they shoot with motion control rigs ONLY. No steadicam, nothing. There's no camera operator in the world that can do the exact same move twice.

    I don't think this can be true (at least not the way Lindelof describes it), because a shoot with 3D cameras would be a whole less troublesome and complicated than doing that.
     
  5. Tom Servo

    Tom Servo Commodore Commodore

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    That's true, unless it's motion control, you really could not get the exact same move. I'd assume that they're doing it as sort of a reference pass to assist in the conversion. They won't be using the 3d footage directly, but as a reference to line up their 3d cards when they do the actual conversion.
     
  6. DaveyNY

    DaveyNY Commodore Commodore

    I remember reading some where on the Internetz that JJ also used IMAX Cameras to shoot parts of the movie...

    Isn't that 75mm... ?

    I think this was the compromise with Paramount and the 3D thing.

    They apparently can use 75mm film to make a 3D copy some how.

    (I'm searching for where I read this...)

    Found It
     
  7. Gep Malakai

    Gep Malakai Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Probably film as well, since I figure they're using the reference pass to rebuild the backgrounds behind characters for the 3D conversion. The second pass wouldn't be 3D itself, just gathering image data to help with conversion, and you'd need it to match the appearance of the regular footage to do that.

    This is just an assumption on my part, but I assume the purpose of the second pass is to plug any holes in the image produced by "cutting out" the characters for the 3D conversion. As I understand it, normally they have to artificially generate the content seen around the edges of foreground objects (a la the clone stamp tool in Photoshop) as part of the opposite eye frames; if they have clean BG images, that task would be much easier. They'd still have to track it all in make everything line up, but I bet a clean plate would make that task much easier.
     
  8. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Commodore Commodore

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    Yes. I was at a 3D movie where they first showed a batch of previews in 2D. After that, a disembodied voice said "please put on your 3D glasses now" for the last preview or two, which were in 3D.

    I'm not saying they would do this for Star Trek; if the movie is 3D, thenthe trailer would be 3D. However, in theaters where that movie (the movie which the Star Trek trailer is attached) is only being shown in 2D, the Star Trek trailer would also be in 2D. There are theaters that show movies only in 2D -- even the 3D movies.
     
  9. Keeper

    Keeper Commodore Commodore

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    I'm sorry I wasn't clear, at the time of the above experience my conclusion was - that a 2D preview can be inserted within a block of 3D previews without the glasses causing any kind of appreciable distortion to the 2D image. They just were not in 3D.

    This was at an AMC theater, btw. It may be different for other movie houses.
     
  10. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Commodore Commodore

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    ^
    ^^I wouldn't think that the modern 3D glass would cause appreciable distortion while watching a 2D movie. They are only polarized, and even though they have a slight tint, they do not noticeably make things darker (maybe very, very little).

    Even though we were told when to put on our glasses during that showing I was talking about above, I think that was only to inform us when the 3D portion of the previews/movie was coming -- not that we couldn't be wearing our glasses during the 2D. Some people may watch those first few 2D previews and not realize that they are supposed to be only 2D (although it should be obvious to most people).
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
  11. Keeper

    Keeper Commodore Commodore

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    I think we agree then, the OP statements:

    Is not necessarily true.
     
  12. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Commodore Commodore

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    ^
    ^^ Agreed.

    My point was that I've seen trailers for 2D movies attached to 3D movies, and I've seen trailers for 3D film attached to 2D movies (obviously the trailer was in 2D, also).

    Also, A 3D movie isn't ALWAYS shown in 3D everywhere. My 14-screen theater often (but not always) has a 3D film on two screens -- They have a showing of it in the 3D IMAX screen, but also have a showing of it on a 2D screen. Other times, a 3D movie may only be show on the 3D screen for the first 2 weeks or so, and then it is only shown on the 2D screen.

    I often go to the 2D screening of a 3D film, rather than the 3D screening.
     
  13. Transwarp Drive

    Transwarp Drive Lieutenant

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    I disagree, what's the point of going to all the bother of doing it with 3D in mind if you aren't going to promote it appropriately especially as most of those going to see it will see it in 3D?

    To deny/disgree with this is just lunacy. Is it a full moon tonight?
     
  14. Transwarp Drive

    Transwarp Drive Lieutenant

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    I disagree, what's the point of going to all the bother of doing it with 3D in mind if you aren't going to promote it appropriately especially as most of those going to see it will see it in 3D?

    To deny/dissgree with this is just lunacy. Is it a full moon tonight?

    :guffaw:
     
  15. Keeper

    Keeper Commodore Commodore

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    Sorry. I misunderstood what you meant by "need to be...".

    As a function of "promotion" sure, I agree that would certainty help.
     
  16. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    Not for another week, where I am.

    Now, I don't have much experience with 3D movies, so I don't really know what the practices are concerning the showing of 3D trailers, but there do seem to be some variations from theater to theater, from chain to chain, or from region to region. I'm also not sure whether we can expect a 3D trailer for this movie right away, or perhaps sometime later in the promo cycle.

    I do think, however, that insinuations of lunacy are probably best done without, even ones with the (at best-ambiguous) "guffaw" graemlin appended.
     
  17. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Commodore Commodore

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    Well...yeah. If someone really wants to promote that a film is in 3D -- and the best way to do that is showing the trailer in 3D.

    Having said that, are they really planning to "push" the 3D-ness of this film? I know it has been converted to 3D (and some scenes shot in 3D), but does that mean they will be pushing the 3D so much that they won't want to attach the trailer to a non-3D film -- such as Skyfall? Could they still attach the first trailer to Skyfall, and promote the 3D-ness through other means?

    For example, Marvel's The Avengers was in 3D, but the studio do not go all-out promoting it as a 3D film. I saw one of the first trailers for The Avengers, and it was in 2D (and I saw the film in 2D). So not every 3D film always has trailers in 3D -- Why would ST "need" to be any different.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
  18. Sindatur

    Sindatur Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Also, we're talking about a Teaser Trailer, and Teaser Trailers often don't have any actual footage frm the Film, so, if that's the case, if it's just going to be a Logo, and a Voice over, and maybe some reused footage from the First movie, I wouldn't expect that to be in 3D.

    First full trailer (Possibly with The Hobbit?) yea, maybe it'll be a 3D trailer.
     
  19. Transwarp Drive

    Transwarp Drive Lieutenant

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    I think you have to contextualise what this film will be, promoting it with a 3D trailer, whether its teaser or not, is an unparalleled opportunity.

    I think they'll go with SFX shots like TOS opening titles where the Big E flies towards you at speed, that sort of thing, a Starfleet emblem in space that has depth never seen before etc etc.

    I haven't been to see a 3D film where there weren't 3D trailers, hence I ask again, what's coming out in the near future in 3D because that's where the trailer will likely be.
     
  20. Transwarp Drive

    Transwarp Drive Lieutenant

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    Sorry about the lunacy thing, no malice intended.
     

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