The Orb - a new DS9 podcast

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by Enterpriserules, Jan 16, 2013.

  1. lvsxy808

    lvsxy808 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    There's a line in a Babylon 5 episode actually that says basically the same thing.

    To paraphrase: "Faith and science are like the shoes on your feet. You can walk further and longer with both than you can with only one."

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  2. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    Amen! :bolian:
     
  3. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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  4. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    Great episodes, as usual, this week and last week. Regarding last week's, I really enjoyed your guest, even though you could spend like 2 more episodes talking about Garak and barely even scratch the surface. I also liked the idea of Garak seeking revenge in In the Pale Moonlight towards Sisko, and it does make a little sense. It does put the episode in a different light if you think about it.

    As for this week's, you guys had some interesting selections for episodes, and one that actually came out of left field. The one that was surprising was Looking for Par Mach in All The Wrong Places. I like the episode too, but I wouldn't put it as DS9's best or even consider it a favorite episode. Were these favorites, or episodes that you guys thought showcased DS9. The other episode I did agree with was Sound of Her Voice. I love that episode, and it's one of the more understated episodes in the season. Yeah it might have been a cop out to make Lisa dead at the end, but like you guys said, it was a good Therapeutic session for the crew, something they really needed before the finale and what came after.
     
  5. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    My goal in picking mine was not just to do "the best" but also to showcase episodes that I like and think show the versatility of the series as well as it's greatness. :cool:
     
  6. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    Are you thinking about doing an episode where you talk about episodes that didn't necessarily work? You can still love the series but be critical and I would be interested in hearing what you guys thought DS9 could have done better.
     
  7. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    I think that will definitely be something we do, I am sure we will do guilty pleasures as well. :cool:
     
  8. lvsxy808

    lvsxy808 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Just listened to the Garak episode on the way to work this morning. It is amazing, isn't it, how there can be so much to discuss about a character who appeared in only 33 episodes out of 175 - less than a fifth. That's a testament not only to the writers, but also of course to the actor, who gave the writers reason to give him such good material.

    Una and you both gave me things to think about I hadn't considered before - the link from "Second Skin" to "In the Pale Moonlight," or the effects of his relationship with Ziyal and later her death. I don't think he loved her in a romantic sense, but he certainly loved having her around as simply another Cardassian, and one who wasn't involved in all the other shenanigans Cardassians generally are. Good stuff to think about.

    Onto the next one!

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  9. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    Having Una on was a honor. As anyone can tell Garak is her favorite character so to pick her brain about this enigma was just a joy and I am glad you enjoyed it! :cool:
     
  10. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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  11. lvsxy808

    lvsxy808 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    This has got me thinking now, wondering what else Garak was up to during interesting episodes where you would think he was have an interest in events but wasn't actually seen on screen. Like Una said, it's almost like there are unfilmed scenes on the cutting-room floor.

    Like, for example, what did Garak do during "The Seige", when all non-Bajorans were forced to leave as a more militant Bajoran faction (very much anti-Cardassian) took control of the station? Did he just evacuate with the other civilians, or did he stay behind and try to delay the Circle's progress from his hiding place?

    And what about "Destiny," when three Cardassians visited the station, one of whom was Obsidian Order? Would she have recognised him? Maybe not everyone in the Order knows everyone else. But maybe she would have, if Garak hadn't been keeping a low profile and staying out of her way. (We know from A Stitch in Time that they are aware of each other, at least by the post-war period.)

    Or "The Darkness and the Light," when a Cardassian madman is trying to kill a heavily pregnant Kira. Was he secretly feeding Odo leads about who might be behind it? Was Garak one of Odo's mysterious contacts? (We know from Fearful Symmetry that Kira's attack on Gul Pirak's compound was partially thanks to the OO, so maybe they kept tabs on the survivors.)

    Or just as Una said, what about "Doctor Bashir, I Presume" ? Garak must have had some interesting things to say after Bashir's genetic enhancements were revealed. And what about his discovery that Starfleet has its own Obsidian Order in the form of Section 31? Una herself dramatised that in Hollow Men, but it would have been interesting to see his reaction on the show itself.

    So much to think about!

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  12. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    It's the joy of the novels when they can fill things in well for us
     
  13. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    I've always been confused about something regarding the Orbs, and considering this is brought on by today's podcast, I figured I would ask it here.

    Was the Orb we first saw in Emissary actually the Orb of Prophecy and Change? They didn't name it, and according to this page they weren't identical.

    I liked the concepts of the Orbs, yet it feels like they should have been featured more. I think we saw 6 of them though so maybe that was enough, but what episode did they mention how the Orbs worked. I don't remember Dax actually studying the orb (But more finding the Denorios belt).
     
  14. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    This is from Memory Alpha

    Dax does study it in Emissary, that is where she has her vision, in the science lab.
     
  15. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    So based on what we know from the series and books now, the first orb was the Orb of Memory? That would make sense as I thought the Orb of Prophecy and Change was the one in the monastery, not the one given to the station. One would have thought the writers would have paid more attention to detail when it came to this subject, considering the two episodes are like 20 episodes apart.
     
  16. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    Well it seemed to me from that, since there is no other orb we see that it is P&C. But it does seem to be one of the things that the writers did not pay as much attention to as they should have early.

    From Memory Alpha again

     
  17. lvsxy808

    lvsxy808 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I was always under the impression that the Orb from "Emissary" was indeed Prophecy, not Memory, as I thought Opaka specifically said so. While it's true that what we see on screen does seem to fit with the concept of Memory more than Prophecy, I'm sure it was explicitly said to be Prophecy, so that's what it is.

    If we go by the novels, which I'm sure would have been thoroughly researched before they went to print, then Memory was not returned to Bajor until Avatar, when it was discovered on an adrift freighter ship where it had been lost for years. And then the four remaining ones returned in Cathedral were Unity, Destiny, Souls and Truth. According to the short story "The Orb of Opportunity" in the Prophecy and Change collection, Contemplation was returned some time after "Life Support" in the spirit of the new B/C peace treaty that was signed then.

    So that makes nine - Prophecy, Memory, Time, Wisdom, Unity, Destiny, Souls, Truth and Contemplation.

    I agree that the Orb that returns Dax from the wormhole doesn't count, and was not a "true" Orb, just a transport mechanism. (The same mechanism is used to return Kira from the wormhole in The Soul Key.) I wonder if the Orb of the Emissary was similar - it seemed to disappear after Sarah was released from it, so in that sense, it also wouldn't count as a "true" Orb.

    I've always had a theory that the Orbs are actually solidified Prophets, in some way. In the same way that the Orb of the Emissary seems to in fact be Sarah, perhaps when you have an Orb encounter, you are literally talking to a Prophet, and they each have their own personalities, which lead to the different qualities associated with each Orb.

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  18. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    We talk about that on the episode, that in some way the Orbs have the essence or spirit of the Prophets and that is what makes them "work"
     
  19. lvsxy808

    lvsxy808 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Ah, okay. :bolian: Only up to Worf so far...
     
  20. Enterpriserules

    Enterpriserules Commodore Commodore

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    Thanks for listening!