The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies XI+' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 30, 2009.

?

Grade the movie...

  1. Excellent

    707 vote(s)
    62.7%
  2. Above Average

    213 vote(s)
    18.9%
  3. Average

    84 vote(s)
    7.5%
  4. Below Average

    46 vote(s)
    4.1%
  5. Poor

    77 vote(s)
    6.8%
  1. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    Re: Star Trek XI :Did anyone dislike this movie other than me? [Spoile

    As Sulu's Lover has posted several times since I asked the above question and no reason has been offered, I'm merging this thread with the pinned grading and discussion thread. Hang on...
     
  2. M

    M Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Now, what exactly were the references to the other Star Trek series? Admiral Archer and his beagle were kind of obvious, but what about The Next Generation, Deep Space Nine and Voyager? Were they referenced at all? I guess the Cardassian drink could be an homage to TNG or DS9. Or did I miss something?

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  3. Sulu's Lover

    Sulu's Lover Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Re: Star Trek XI :Did anyone dislike this movie other than me? [Spoile

    Could you explain to me why you moved my thread ? I didn't even see you post a question to me . There doesn't seem to be any private messages on this board which seems odd to me.


    Rob
     
  4. shipfisher

    shipfisher Commander Red Shirt

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    Sep 10, 2006
    Very entertaining movie. After seeing engineering, or what most of it seems devoted to, it's obvious the 23rd century feds are a bunch of moonshiners in this alternate reality - I guess the interstellar economy had to be based on something.

    Amongst other interesting tech quirks are seriously longer range transporters, or was that perhaps a one-off upgrade using some know-how from 2387? (oh ya - stardates that obviously incorporate the calender year - big ups on that)
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2009
  5. M

    M Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Jul 10, 2007
    Re: Star Trek XI :Did anyone dislike this movie other than me? [Spoile

    It's in the very post you are quoting, actually.
     
  6. TGTheodore

    TGTheodore Writer Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek XI :Did anyone dislike this movie other than me? [Spoile

    e.e. cummings is spinning in his grave.
     
  7. Messianni

    Messianni Commodore Commodore

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    Minneapolis, Minnesota
    Re: Star Trek XI :Did anyone dislike this movie other than me? [Spoile

    :guffaw::guffaw:
     
  8. mredom

    mredom Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2005
    I haven't read this thread, but I just got back from a preview screening in Sacramento. Of this movie I can only say this...of all the Trek movies I have encountered in my travels, this was the most...satisfying.

    Seriously, I loved this movie. I have waited three years for tonight, it was worth it-I will see this movie at least 4 more times in theaters-so mark me down for at least $35.00 in gross.

    This movie will do at least $300,000,000. My two cents.

    I'm going to try to sleep now.
    :)

    MRE
     
  9. Captain Robert April

    Captain Robert April Vice Admiral Admiral

    Saw it at the press screening, and all I can say is that I'm oh, so glad that I didn't have to pay for it.

    Suffice it to say that I was massively underwhelmed. Plot contrivances, shaky camera, even in the CGI stuff, cringe inducing dialogue, a "Look at MEEE!" glory shot of the ship every five minutes, all capped off with a closing credit sequence ripped off from the Lost in Space movie....well, let's just say that just about everything I said before I saw it, stands.

    Some of the more minor annoyances:

    Pink skinned Vulcans Y'know, JJ, there was a reason they painted Nimoy yellow way back when, and it's because of that green Vulcan blood.

    The Kelvin 800 people made it off, after getting the crap kicked out it, which killed how many? And this is supposed to be a pre-TOS ship? Sorry, but that bucket reeked more of TNG, both in capacity and in the crew complement, which apparently included families, another TNG contrivance that didn't make it past "Generations" (the Enterprise-E doesn't have families on board). The interiors also indicated a much more
    massive ship, on the order of a Galaxy class starship.

    The technology Compared to TOS, most it, quite frankly, sucked. The front window/viewscreen was blurry and distorted, the transporter didn't work half as well as even the NX-01's, and the phasers, both shipboard and handheld, all behaved more like Star Wars blasters and turbolasers than their TOS predecessors. And need I mention Sulu's automatically unfolding katana, which helped him in his dashing impression of Luke Skywalker in the barge scene in "Return of the Jedi"? Or how the ships going to warp bore an uncanny resemblence to SW ships going to hyperspace? Should George Lucas be flattered or should he be calling his lawyers?

    Delta Vega As an astute poster over on trekmovie.com pointed out, the name of the neighboring planet that Spock was stranded on really didn't have any bearing on the story, but by invoking the name of Delta Vega, the writers shined a big bright spotlight on this bit, making it quite clear that, deep down, they don't know what they're doing. A big part of "honoring canon" is getting the details right; otherwise, it's just meaningless name dropping and pandering.

    Chekov Excuse me, but exactly when did Chekov turn into Wesley Crusher? Also, at age seventeen, he should be starting his first year at the Academy, not already be a commissioned officer. But then, these clowns clearly don't know a thing about military protocol, since they also take a guy who was a cadet facing some serious charges a couple of days earlier and give him command of their biggest and most advanced ship. At the very least, it's clear they wouldn't know the chain of command if someone came up and beat 'em about the head and shoulders with it.

    And my complaint about Spock still remains: He knows how to achieve a time warp, and he knows precisely what happened when, why it happened, and how to circumvent those events. So why doesn't he get a ship, do a few time jumps, and fix everything that got screwed up? He could not only restore the timeline, but finally cement a lasting peace between the Romulan Empire and the Federation.

    So why doesn't he do this?

    Because Spock has to have a sudden attack of the stupids in order for JJ to get his own Star Trek universe to run amok in.

    Urban was good as McCoy, Pine was okay as Kirk, can't really grade Greenwood as Pike since we never got that much from Jeffery Hunter to form a basis of comparison, but taken on it's own, he gives a good performance, Yelchin was downright embarrassing as Chekov, Quinto just seemed to be PMSing all the time, and the rest of the cast was just sort of there.

    The ship still looks stupid, and the decision to build it on the surface is the singlemost idiotic move in the entire history of the franchise. It didn't help that the "Riverside shipyards" were clearly a present day industrial facility, either an oil refinery or electrical substation. Engineering looking alternately like a water treatment plant and, like it is in real life, a brewery, only adds insult to injury.

    The choice of "Crap on a stick" isn't available, so I voted "Poor".
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2009
  10. Devon

    Devon Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2005
    Suuuuure.

    Coming from you, that's a big shocker.
     
  11. Captain Captain

    Captain Captain Cadet Newbie

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    May 7, 2009
    Saw this on another board as a possible explanation for why Spock doesn't just time travel to fix things:
    Makes sense to me - if the Narada can lay waste to anything from that time period, why would Spock try to go back in time to stop it when he has nothing that would help?
     
  12. hal9500

    hal9500 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Dublin
    With all due respect, that is perhaps the craziest most stupid thing i ever heard.... its like saying stalin was a nice guy...... with the exception of purges, murders, secret police, megolomania, historical revisionism......
     
  13. Captain Robert April

    Captain Robert April Vice Admiral Admiral

    Hey, don't forget the bit about how Hitler liked his dog.
     
  14. Captain Robert April

    Captain Robert April Vice Admiral Admiral

    Feldercarb.

    Did Spock have access to any of this "red matter" any of the three times he's been involved in a slingshot maneuver ("Tomorrow is Yesterday", "Assignment: Earth" and ST IV)?

    Go back before Nero attacks the Kelvin and changes the timeline, then go forward to make sure that supernova is dealt with before it destroys Romulus. Presto, all problems solved, a grateful Romulus signs a peace treaty with the Federation, and Nero gets to make little bald Romulan babies with his hot Romulan wife.
     
  15. Captain Captain

    Captain Captain Cadet Newbie

    Joined:
    May 7, 2009
    But would traveling back before that point in time (Kelvin incident) guarantee that moving forward would move you into the right timeline to begin with? You might end up in a timeline that's very similar to where you were but isn't completely the same as the time travel back could still cause some alteration to the timeline unbeknown to the traveler.

    And I brought up the red matter not because of time travel, but because it was what ended up destroying Nero's ship and was the only thing he could possibly use in that timeline to stop Nero if he could somehow get his ship back, otherwise he had no realistic options to do so. I thought the point I was trying to make there would be obvious to someone who has seen the movie.
     
  16. Orac Zen

    Orac Zen Mischief Manager Super Moderator

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    I'll go back and read the rest of the thread in a moment (I already know some of what I'm going to see, of course), but I have to say I enjoyed the hell out of this movie.

    Is it perfect? Of course not.

    Is it Star Trek? Yes.

    The opening sequence is quite brilliant and the movie only improves from there. I was thoroughly engaged and engrossed. Almost everyone worked for me, acting-wise and as the character I've known and enjoyed for all these years.

    Acting / casting: I have some quibbles (see below). Pine was terrific. Quinto absolutely nailed Spock. I'd expected him to be good, but not that good. Saldana was a terrific Uhura. Almost everyone else did pretty well with what they were given. On the whole I think all involved did well.

    Plot: Better than I'd expected. I suppose in some ways it was recycled from stuff we've all seen in and outside Trek but it worked pretty damned well. No blatant holes evidenced themselves on first viewing.

    The effects were pretty good, I suppose. Quite frankly they're about the last reason I watch a movie and unless they're utterly godawful I tend to pay attention to characters, plot and the like first and foremost. Having said that the movie looked damned good.

    Really, really enjoyed the score. :bolian:

    Quibbles: Ben Cross was simply awful. Granted, I'm a dyed-in-the-wool fan of Sarek and Mark Lenard, but even so for mine Cross completely lacked any sort of gravitas and presence. That was my single biggest disappointment. Whoever it was who played Chekov (no, I haven't kept up with every detail :p) overdid the "Russian" accent. I don't completely buy Urban as McCoy (but McCoy is my favourite ever Trek character and DeForest Kelley ruled, so I willingly admit that was pretty much a given). I'd dreaded Winona Ryder as Amanda and I'm glad her part was so brief. They're my main issues at this juncture; maybe subsequent viewings (of which there will be a few) will reveal others. Or not.

    (Nimoy looked ancient, though. :eek:)

    Basically, after the past couple of years of anticipation, of learning bits and pieces about the movie, of reading this forum :p, I wasn't disappointed. On the contrary, I genuinely enjoyed this movie. :bolian: I hope it succeeds and this group gets the opportunity to boldy go a few more times.

    And the dedication at the end brought tears to my eyes. A really classy touch. :bolian:
     
  17. donners22

    donners22 Commodore Commodore

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    ^ I missed the dedication. What was it?
     
  18. Orac Zen

    Orac Zen Mischief Manager Super Moderator

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    The pic was dedicated to Gene Roddenberry and Majel Barrett Roddenberry.

    I just thought it was spot-on. :bolian:


    Edit: Okay, I've read the rest of the thread (and seen pretty much exactly what I'd expected to see). Some additional comments:

    And about damned time, too. That cliché was beyond worn out.

    I missed that. What a marvellous touch. :bolian: Don't anyone try and tell me Abrams and co. don't respect what they're dealing with here.

    That was another (relatively minor) negative. Thankfully that was the only piece of gratuitous product placement (so to speak), but I didn't go for it much.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2009
  19. Roshi

    Roshi Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Dans ton cul, cherche bien...
    With all due respect too, allow me to say one thing: riiiiiiiight. Please point me to the logical parallels you can draw from both our statements. Shall I emphasize on the modal auxiliary "COULD". For all we know, V'Ger is still en route to Earth, Khan's sleeper ship is still drifting somewhere, there's still a vineyard belonging to the Picard family in Labarre, and so on...
    And kudos to the poster just after you for Godwin'ing this thread! :techman:
     
  20. Sulu's Lover

    Sulu's Lover Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    I agree...........What more can be said . Give some rich guy , with a big ego , tons of money and artistic license ,and this is what you get .


    Rob