The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by YJAGG, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. Hober Mallow

    Hober Mallow Commodore Commodore

    Kirk's dead, the Enterprise itself is gone... and Picard and Riker crack a couple jokes. It's amazing.
     
  2. austen_pierce

    austen_pierce Captain Captain

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    There's a great joke in the ruined Enterprise-D bridge scene:
    Riker: "I always thought I'd have a shot at this [captain's] chair" (or something like that)
    Picard: <rips the Captain's chair out of the floor and hands it to Riker>
     
  3. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    Picard's too much of a bad-ass for an emotional display like that except in private.
     
  4. Enterprise is Great

    Enterprise is Great Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Sounds like the end of a number of TOS episodes. Ofcourse that was the 60's and tv was different then.
     
  5. austen_pierce

    austen_pierce Captain Captain

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    At the end of Balance of Terror Kirk mourns with a junior female officer at the loss of her fiance, a junior weapons officer. Kirk had been in the process of marrying them when the episode began. I understand that this is an exception to the red-shirt rule, in which Kirk willl deliver a few testy lines "a member of my crew is dead!" before moving on, but it's worth noting in context of Picard 'thank you very much, moving on' attitude at the end of Generations.
     
  6. Hober Mallow

    Hober Mallow Commodore Commodore

    The Enterprise was destroyed in several episodes of TOS?

    60s TV or not, had the Enterprise, arguably the main character of TOS, been destroyed in an episode, it would have been a huge deal, not the "oh, well," it was at the end of "Generations."

    Hell, the destruction of the refitted E in TSFS was a big deal. We got the emotional, "My God, Bones." In "Generations" we get a wink and a nod from Picard as he says, "I have a funny feeling if you've been good children this year, Santa's going to bring you a badass new Enterprise..."
     
  7. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    There was definitely some sort of curse with the even numbered films, and we only have to examine Star Trek II and Star Trek IV to prove it!

    Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
    DeForest Kelley - Dead!
    James Doohan - Dead!
    Bibi Besch - Dead!
    Merritt Butrick - Dead!
    Paul Winfield - Dead!
    Richardo Montalban - Dead!

    Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home
    Jane Wyatt - Dead!
    Mark Lenard - Dead!
    Robert Ellenstein - Dead!
    Brock Peters - Dead!

    :shifty:
     
  8. jpv2000

    jpv2000 Captain Captain

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    That scene brought tears to my eyes. :(
     
  9. Leto_II

    Leto_II Captain Captain

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    "Yes, the Enterprise just got destroyed under your command, Number One...and...oh, yeah...Captain Kirk's buried right over there under some rocks. Long story. Anyway. WHO WANTS NACHOS??"
     
  10. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    Except Picard does morn Kirk. Deeply. It's one of the few good shots of the film.

    There was no reason for him to mention the Nexus or Kirk or any of that. Kirk was best left remembered as the guy who died saving the successor to his legacy.
     
  11. austen_pierce

    austen_pierce Captain Captain

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    Are you referring to the scenes in which Picard watches Kirk die and then buries him beneath a cairn? I can somewhat accept that, but still feel Kirk deserved more. Maybe a service of some sort with the captains of the three Federation vessels, which came to rescue the E-D crew?
     
  12. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    No. Because, again, that puts Kirk in the 24th century where he doesn't belong. He's belongs to the past and needed to stay there. Picard understood this; it was one of the themes of the film.
     
  13. M.A.C.O.

    M.A.C.O. Commodore Commodore

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    I sort of like the poetry of the scene. Picard buries Kirk on the site of his greatest victory. Kirk saved the crew of the Ent-D, Picard and the entire populace of Veridian III.

    I only wish Berman, Braga and Moore had written a more heroic death sequence for Kirk. Remember the falling off the cliff on the bridge was a $6 million dollar reshoot of a scene that originally involved Kirk just getting shot in the back. If you haven't listened to it. I recommend listening to the Braga and Moore commentary on the GEN bluray. It's hilarious. It's like listening to one long apology about what didn't work in the film.
     
  14. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The is no possible death scene for Kirk that people would accept.
     
  15. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    That's not true.

    But if you're going to write a major character out of the franchise make sure you put some effort into it. I felt the same way about the ends of Data and the Enterprise-D.
     
  16. Peach Wookiee

    Peach Wookiee Cuddly Mod of Doom Moderator

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    Wouldn't the Federation have to remove the body, though? What about contamination of the Veridian civilization?
     
  17. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    A fossilized toupee would be one helluva archaeological discovery.
     
  18. Leto_II

    Leto_II Captain Captain

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    The novel The Return addresses this subject, to a degree -- immediately following the events of the movie, Starfleet begins the process of removing the crashed spaceframe of the Enterprise-D saucer section, citing Prime Directive concerns over potential contamination of the Veridian IV civilization once it gains spaceflight.

    Can't remember what Starfleet's stance was concerning Kirk's body in the novel, though.
     
  19. Captain Clark Terrell

    Captain Clark Terrell Commodore Commodore

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    Kirk's body was to be removed for the same reason. Starfleet didn't want to leave any trace of any of their officers having been there. This is mentioned while Spock is seen observing a moment of silence at Kirk's grave site just as the honor guard beams down.

    --Sran
     
  20. Leto_II

    Leto_II Captain Captain

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    That's it -- thanks. Been awhile since I've read it. ;)