The Complete Guide to Starfleet Style: The TOS Movies Rad Suit

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by neoworx, Jun 14, 2013.

  1. neoworx

    neoworx Lieutenant Red Shirt

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  2. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

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    It wasn't that rad. Tubular? Certainly, but rad? Definitely not.
     
  3. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Admiral Admiral

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    Some feedback on OP article:

    Is that really the name of these? Memory Alpha refers to them as simply "engineering suits".

    That's false. There were hazard suits seen in TOS.

    No. There's no mention of the red collars used on the suits in The Wrath of Khan, which I assumed were for the cadets.

    Also, there's no mention that Lieutenant Cleary wore the black collar of the "rad suit" with his gray jumpsuit uniform.

    There's no bibliography, and so no way to authenticate what's said, without the readers digging on their own, so that's hardly helpful. Generally speaking, I don't bother with pages that claim to report a lot of facts, but don't have bibliographies. There're also no credits and no acknowledgements of copyrights on the photos and no appropriate claims of fair use.
     
  4. neoworx

    neoworx Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Memory Alpha isn't canon. In the Christies "40 Years of Star Trek" auction, they were referred to as Engineering Radiation suits. It was archived by Mike Okuda so that's good enough for me.

    Yeah, see, an occasional view of some guy in a hallway wearing SOMETHING that's not defined in ANY episode isn't remotely comparable, IMO. Not one episode refers to these as "engineering suits" or "hazard suits" or indeed refers to them at all. When you can show me an engine room full of guys wearing those, then I will concede your point. I stand by my statement.

    My article isn't about collars or other uniform permutations. It's about Rad suits, and the Lt. isn't wearing one.

    And yet you bothered with mine. Tell you what, since I'm obviously just a hack writer who offends your sensibilities, "generally speaking" feel free to ignore me. That will make life easier for you.

    And I just noticed that there's no footnotes either! Why, it's almost like I'm not doing a scholarly paper but rather a story meant to be informal, informational and entertaining.

    I've gleaned info from many, many sources, not the least of which are my own observations as an owner of several specimens. As for the photos, the screen caps are obviously that – screen caps. This very Board is filled with them. Every other photo belongs to me and if I choose to not credit myself, I'm good with that. The one image that I got from another collector is appropriately credited.

    Polite, constructive criticism is always welcome. Your "feedback" is neither. Obviously you just want to be snarky and insulting. Good news – you've succeeded! Now run along and let the adults talk about things they know about from first hand experience rather than from reading Memory Alpha.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2013
  5. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Admiral Admiral

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    "Engineering Radiation suit" is not "rad suit", so it's clear that you have taken a liberty. If you consider a source archived by Mike Okuda to be authoritative, then you should have stuck to the name of the suits, as given on that site.

    No, he's just wearing a piece of one.

    OK! :techman:
     
  6. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Wow, you two are both being ridiculous.
     
  7. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Admiral Admiral

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    Well, if I'm being ridiculous, I apologize. It was my intent to be neither ridiculous nor pedantic, but rather to offer constructive feedback.

    Something being advertised as a "complete guide" that answers "everything you ever wanted to know" is surely not immune to criticism. If a thread like this isn't for offering feedback, then what's it for?

    If my comments were on the level of mere nitpicks, it was because I could find nothing more major to comment about. (Edited to Add: By this, I mean, my criticisms were limited to the ones I voiced.) However, in response to my efforts, the OP invited me to ignore him, and went on to accuse me of being snarky, insulting, and, by implication, childish, when I don't believe any such characterizations were warranted.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2013
  8. Richard Baker

    Richard Baker Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I liked the addition of the Rad Suits in TMP- also the Security outfit with extra padding and a helmet. I think having special outfits for certain functions which have hazards help makes the whole being on a ship vibe.
     
  9. neoworx

    neoworx Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Agreed. Having specialized uniforms is an extension of the navy metaphor that started with TOS. In the modern US Navy, specialized jobs have specialized uniforms like those worn on the flight deck of an aircraft carrier. It lends a sense of credibility and verisimilitude to the environment.
     
  10. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    ...One wonders what this suit really protects against, though.

    I mean, it apparently did zip against the one type of radiation we saw threaten the ship, in ST2. It was used in ST6 purely for camouflage, and no functionality beyond that (say, the ability to withstand vacuum) could be discerned.

    It wasn't a "precaution" type of protective suit, worn in special times, as there were no helmets readily available in ST2 - the crew grabbed simple breathing gear instead. But it could have been a type of suit to be worn in certain rooms, the anterooms of which would feature helmet racks, and Scotty et al. didn't bother to take it off when working elsewhere.

    Whatever the in-universe use of the suit, the one thing it was never associated with was radiation protection...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  11. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

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    If the suit is intended to protect against radiation, and it is typically worn around the reactor equipment in engineering, then those spaces must be hot (in the radiation sense, not temperature). So apparently Starfleet decided it was more effective to insulate the crew than to shield the equipment. I wonder why.
     
  12. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    The suits probably aren't supposed to be doing their job in those environments where the helmets aren't being worn. And we do see a specially sealed environment right next to the helmet-free spaces, with its revolving-door radlock.

    So the whole purpose of having the suits on in ST:TMP, ST2:TWoK and ST6:TUC might be that key personnel are standing by to enter irradiated spaces (because it's the first hot test of the new engines; it's a training opportunity for the cadets; and whatever the reason in the final example). They are not needed where worn, but taking them off would not make sense, either, because donning them again when entering the special spaces would be too slow and clumsy.

    The "hot" spaces would be shielded, then - but situations would arise where a key valve or hatch would need to be opened (just like Spock pried open that fancy pedestal) and the shielding breached, and the suits would need to be standing by for such an occasion.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  13. publiusr

    publiusr Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That makes sense. Spock didn't feel he had enough time to put one on (may not have made a difference at that concentration)

    I think there was a repair robot that was broken in the novel adaptation.
     

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