T.W.O.K vs STID

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Infern0, Oct 13, 2013.

?

vote

  1. I prefer the Wrath of Khan

    110 vote(s)
    72.4%
  2. I Prefer Into Darkness

    17 vote(s)
    11.2%
  3. I like them both the same

    25 vote(s)
    16.4%
  1. Infern0

    Infern0 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Or The Wrath of Khan vs The Wrath of John Harrison

    which do you prefer
     
  2. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    England
    Definitely Into Darkness. Although I enjoy Wrath of Khan and think it's a good movie, I think it's overrated. I always preferred the fun and adventure of III - that fun and adventure which ID has LOTS of.
     
  3. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2013
    Location:
    CommishSleer
    "The Wrath of Khan" is my favourite movie of all time.
     
  4. bbjeg

    bbjeg Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 24, 2013
    Location:
    Right here buddy.
    Into Darkness was fun but I think Wrath of Khan was better. The series history gave it more substance.
     
  5. Mage

    Mage Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2007
    I like both the same, both for different reasons.
     
  6. jpv2000

    jpv2000 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Location:
    Georgia, United States
    Same here. :techman:

    I absolutely love the whole trilogy.
     
  7. webb3201

    webb3201 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2001
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    After watching TWOK until my tapes wore out, I had left the movie behind for about a decade. My memories were that it was a bit cheesy, but fun. After STID, I rewatched TWOK with new eyes and it was phenomenal. Every beat was great, the pacing was great, the characters were focused and the story was well built. It really emphasized what a mess STID was. Watch both in a setting and I can't believe anyone would choose the STID over TWOK.
     
  8. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Location:
    The glorious Shetland Isles!
    TWOK of course.

    Better plot, better Enterprise, better guest characters (can't beat the real Khan and Kirstie Alley's Saavik), better all round feel.
     
  9. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Per Ardua
    I like them both. :shrug:

    It's really tough to compare two movies made thirty years apart against each other. The differences in technology, society and audience expectations are astounding.
     
  10. R. Star

    R. Star Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    Location:
    Shangri-La
    Wrath of Khan. While on the surface it was a simple enough movie on the surface, it was subtly deep on a lot of levels with the themes of getting old, rebirth, revenge impossible odds and death. Heck, Khan's own bookshelf on the Botany Bay foreshadowed this nicely.

    The action sequences in ID were no doubt better, but 30 years later that's a given. The difference between the two movies is TWOK used the action sequences to enhance the movie, while ID used them pretty much to carry it.
     
  11. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Location:
    T'Girl
    Has to be TWOK, it was a better story. The story included the "re-birth" of the aging Kirk, and his introduction to his adult child (we knew he had to of had some). The death of a major character that wasn't fixed suddenly by the end of the movie, you had to watch the sequel to see that.

    STiD had better SFX, but to it's detriment it had too many action sequences. Don't get me wrong, I like to see some, but they should not get in the way of the story telling.

    The first couple of time Star Trek trotted out "the evil admiral" it was good story telling, by the time of STiD it was cliché and tired.




    .
     
  12. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Per Ardua
    With seven-hundred plus episodes, everything is going to feel "cliche and tired".
     
  13. Galileo7

    Galileo7 Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2010
    Location:
    east coast United States
    Agree. :vulcan:
     
  14. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2013
    Location:
    Ladies love Riker's beard.
    Easily WRATH OF KHAN, no question.
     
  15. T'Girl

    T'Girl Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Location:
    T'Girl
    Not at all, I thought the death of Pike (even though we seen lot's of deaths before) was depicted quite well.

    The scene with Scotty in the club bitching with his friend, receiving a call on his "cellphone" was funny and interesting.

    Scotty (again) stating that he had to sign off on everything that was brought aboard to ensure it did interact with the M/AM reactor made a lot of sense.

    Really too bad these were such isolated good moments.

    :devil:
     
  16. austen_pierce

    austen_pierce Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2013
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    TWOK, for all the above, and specifically the Ceti eels brought an eerie, creepy factor that STID lacks.
     
  17. Gojira

    Gojira Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Location:
    Stompin' on Tokyo
    I do like them both pretty equally. I give the slight edge to StiD which has much more action and adventure than TWOK.
     
  18. JediKnightButler

    JediKnightButler Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2000
    Location:
    Indianapolis, Indiana
    I suppose that TWOK was my favorite of the two though l enjoyed ID a lot. I just felt like Khan didn't play much of a pivotal role in ID as he maybe should have. In TWOK there was also a personal history between Kirk and Khan (though I hadn't seen Space Seed at the time I first saw TWOK) that didn't exist in ID- for obvious reasons (i.e. it wasn't Kirk who initially encountered Khan as in the Prime universe). ID's take on Khan actually- for a short while- made him somewhat sympathetic- being upset (and who wouldn't be?) that Marcus had killed his "family" and I kind of liked Kirk and Khan teaming up with each other (briefly) to go after Marcus. That was a neat twist that I hadn't seen coming- but then as soon as they got the drop on Marcus, Khan went back to being "pure evil" (Kirk was smart enough to realize that he would turn on them but misjudged his ability to keep him down with a phaser stun). I'm somewhat glad that they didn't kill Khan at the end and left open the *possibility* that he may return in a future movie (though hopefully not the next one) as I feel like we got as much of him as we deserved to get. BD did a great job with the role IMHO.
     
  19. maneth

    maneth Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2010
    Location:
    Rebuilding Cardassia after the Revolution
    STID. But that's mainly because I utterly detest Montalban's Khan. He's so slimy and sleazy and disgusting, the kind of guy I'd rather throw out the nearest airlock. I much, much, much prefer the ice cold Harrison. That said, I think the movie wouldn't have suffered at all if Harrison had been Harrison, simply another augment gone awry, rather than the remake of a legend. I admit Khan is a legend, even if he profoundly disgusts me.
     
  20. Stoo

    Stoo Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Location:
    circle of the tyrants
    WoK has more substance to it, with the subplot of Kirk dealing with his aging. And the battle in the mutara nebula still stands up after 30 years. The pacing actually isn't great, it gets off to a really slow start. But it remains a more important film than STID (which was still a lot of fun).