Superman and Batman to join forces with Islamic superheroes

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Dusty Ayres, Jul 30, 2009.

  1. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Or better yet, would it hurt you to read something that might ask you to question your biases and philosophy suggesting that the truth may be larger with a lot more grey than black and white?

    Here is a link to an interview with the creator of the 99. There is some other stuff in the episode too, but I think the segment relevant to this thread is first up:

    http://podcast.cbc.ca/mp3/qpodcast_20090713_18062.mp3

    It is a
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2009
  2. TheMasterOfOrion

    TheMasterOfOrion Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    As long as the Jews or Israelis don't show up in its pages this series should do fine in the middle east :alienblush:
     
  3. QuasarVM

    QuasarVM Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Yeah really! :lol:
     
  4. Nardpuncher

    Nardpuncher Rear Admiral

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    Just be careful that you aren't defending one religion ( Islam) so hard that you are doing it just to make yourself look open minded.
    If you didn't really like the idea of religion before you read this thread, don't defend it in any guise after you've read it.

    Here's the list of the 99 attributes of Allah. If anyone really believes that this is somehow the way that the universe began or anything close to that, or that this is any way the world really works is ...well, they're very religious...let's say that. http://www.jannah.org/articles/names.html
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2009
  5. Dusty Ayres

    Dusty Ayres Commodore

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    For once, and only this one time in this thread, we agree.
     
  6. Thrall

    Thrall Commodore Commodore

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    If thousands of Polish jokes proved anything, it's that racism is funny.
     
  7. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    There have been Islamic and Arab characters in American comics before. What makes this unique is that it's American comic book characters crossing over with foreign comic book characters.
     
  8. firehawk12

    firehawk12 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    EXILE + ATTON = GUUUUUUSH!!!! (pic by aimo)
    I think this is a cool idea. It'd actually get me to read a "mainline" DC book again anyway.
     
  9. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    [
    I've no idea who or what "Magdalena" is. If it's from Image I most likely ignored it. That company set comics back a decade.


    I've seen such list before. They tend to rely on guess work. "He's Italian? he must be Catholic" type logic.

    All those characters are "re-engineered". The Silver Age was all bout "re-engineering." Any character created before 1986 probably was "re-engineered" when it came to religion, because such thing wer not part of the characters in the 40s, 50s or even the 60s. Dave Cockrum and Len Wein had no idea Nightcrawler was a Catholic. The idea that Magneto was a Jew never crossed Stan Lee and Jack Kirby's minds.
     
  10. Mr. Adventure

    Mr. Adventure Admiral Admiral

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    I bet this is the most popular character.
     
  11. darkwing_duck1

    darkwing_duck1 Vice Admiral

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    Top Cow, actually, and one of their more popular second-string characters.

    Each character has an article that explains the documentation.

    We aren't talking about re-jiggering details about the planet Krypton, or minutiae like that. We are talking about fundamental aspects of the identity of the character.
     
  12. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'll take your word for it. Top Cop to me it just Image lite.

    Referencing stories that "re-engineered" their religious affiliation for the most part, by people who did not create the characters. Though how many of these characters were motivated by their Christianity? Or is it just a bit of window dressing to add the illusion of depth?

    I dunno, making Kurt Wagner a Catholic sounds pretty major. Making him a priest even more so. Magneto's affection for neo Nazi uniforms and extreme views on "race" makes him an odd candidate for Holocaust survivor.

    Now making Bruce Wayne gay might be a stretch (the whole playboy thing) but it would not change who Batman is. He would not be any less a detective or martial artist if this happened.

    Out of curiousity how many comicbook characters have had their race or sexuality "re-engineered"?
     
  13. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Most characters that were re-done drastically were just replaced by new generations of the same hero. Hal Jordan and Kyle Rainer replacing Alan Scot for example, or the new Firestorm, Atom, and Blue Beetle come to mind.

    Now, I havent read these 99 characters but the producer of the comic books says in the interview that he makes a specific point of not referencing religion specifically in the stories. These characters simply come from a different point of view than the traditional Judeo-Christian creations of North America from his point of view.

    I am, however, genuinely concerned about the blatant ignorance of the Middle East coming from some posters on this board. Islam has as rich a cultural history and a myriad of interpretations and followers as Christianity does. Saying every Muslim is out to attack Western culture is like saying every Christian is a homophobe, a Nazi, or a member of the KKK.
     
  14. CaptainCanada

    CaptainCanada Admiral Admiral

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    Simple capitalism: they want access to each others' markets.
     
  15. darkwing_duck1

    darkwing_duck1 Vice Admiral

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    Adding to a character is different from re-engineering established traits.

    It was never established he was NOT a Catholic, so that is a different matter.

    Likewise with Magneto. It was never established that he WASN'T a Jew, then reversed. It was added on by later writers. And personally, his Mutant Facisim makes a LOT of sense for a Holocaust survivor. It's the ultimate, tragic extension of "Never Again", and took what was a standard-issue ranting villain and made him interesting.

    But it would change who Bruce Wayne is. That's the point.

    So far, the only one that has "taken" is Nick Fury, and that pretty much on the basis of Samuel L Jackson's "Chuck Norris factor". What Galactus and his supporters want to see is MORE arbitrary changes like that, which I do not support.
     
  16. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Potayto Potahto. Religion, sexuality, ethnic background its all the same really.

    Doesn't quite fit with the character as first presented.


    Doesnt make sense to me. "Hitler made me act like Hitler." It made him inro Dr Doom-lite. (IIRC it was because Claremont couldn't use Doom)

    Hmm. I think I already said that.

    Last time I checked Nick Fury in the Marvel U was still white. The Sam Jackson Nick is in the Ulitmate Universe and the movies. Thats no differnent than the E-2 Hawkman being human and the E-1 Hawkman being an alien. Different universe, different characters.

    What else you got?
     
  17. Nardpuncher

    Nardpuncher Rear Admiral

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    Nobody defended Christianity here either. I certainly won't.
    If you're a person that thinks religion is something to be seen with skepticism and that following an ideology that is based on falsehoods about the creation and nature of the universe then you must call it wherever you see it.
     
  18. Galactus

    Galactus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    As has already been pointed out. All of the Silver Age heroes were changed into different people. Except their race was not changed. So you are basically saying that if you like the change then it is not fundamental, but if you dislike it then it is. So again it seems like there just is no room in your comic world for any new characters who are diverse and no changes to the existing ones either. So tough luck to everybody that does not think like you.

    For the record changing a character drastically would not be my first choice but when you are dealing with DC they basically got no choice because almost all their heroes are white males. I am glad that started making the effort to even things out. And then we have to be realistic also in the fact that there are only so projects out there and you have to get folks in them somehow.

    When I see folks that complain about existing diverse heroes, complain about new diverse heroes and complain about changing existing heroes to make diverse heroes, then I don't see anything but someone not wanting any type of diversity.
     
  19. TheMasterOfOrion

    TheMasterOfOrion Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    ALL RELIGION In My Not So Humble Opinion, all religion Judaism, Catholicism, Buddhism, Mohammedism (the two forms of Islam)....its all a bunch of BullShit

    but if you want to go ahead and keep defending Muslim faith then fine.

    Everyone's entitled to their opinion and each to their own
    Mine is agnosticism, a philosophy based more on logic than superstition


    [​IMG]
     
  20. Ensign_Redshirt

    Ensign_Redshirt Commodore Commodore

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    Actually, Darr the Afflicter is an American character.


    http://www.the99.org/art-36-33-Articles-1-9-325,ckl