STO: The Needs of the Many by M. A. Martin Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Discussion in 'Trek Literature' started by nx1701g, Mar 25, 2010.

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Grade "The Needs of the Many"

  1. Excellent

    16.7%
  2. Above Average

    23.8%
  3. Average

    28.6%
  4. Below Average

    11.9%
  5. Poor

    19.0%
  1. Rosalind

    Rosalind TrekLit's Dr Rose Mod Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    While I understand you don't agree with the choice the author made about a book, I can't think of any situations where advocating violence towards a person is the correct way to protest about your displeasure, let alone a work of fiction. And when you take into account that authors frequently visit and post this board, this is beyond pale. It might just be "an expression" to you, but not everyone takes it that way, so please don't do it again.
     
  2. Admiral_Young

    Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    I'm curious about the timeline included in the book...is it the Path to 2409 timeline that was being done on the website and which there have been no updates for since the end of November? When I asked on Star Trek Online's facebook page I got a response saying that the timeline updates would continue and the poster who was responsible for them was occupied with other things. I'll be getting the book when it gets in the book store.
     
  3. Man of Steel

    Man of Steel Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Sorry Rosalind. I was just stating an opinion. No harmful statements were intended.
     
  4. Dayton Ward

    Dayton Ward Word Pusher Rear Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    ^ Well, I'll give you this much: You never cease to amaze me.
     
  5. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Well, that name isn't unsettling at all.
     
  6. Nerys Ghemor

    Nerys Ghemor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Yeah, really...Minipax, anyone?
     
  7. Rosalind

    Rosalind TrekLit's Dr Rose Mod Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Marc, you might not had any harmful intention, but "the person who wrote this should be shot execution style" is not "just an opinion". I know we like to pepper our everyday language with exaggerated statements, but you need to think carefully about some of these statements when you are writing them down. A statement like what you wrote here is harmful whether you intended it or not. Just think carefully next time before you write something that sounds like you're advocating violence and harm to someone, ok?
     
  8. Thespeckledkiwi

    Thespeckledkiwi Vice Admiral

    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Abramsverse seems to run into the STO universe.
     
  9. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    As opposed to, what, the Department of War?

    Not every reference to a governmental organization dedicated to peace and diplomacy is necessarily a reference to Orwell, y'know -- nor need we always assume such organizations are named dishonestly, as Oceania's Ministry of Peace was.

    Though, for my money, Martin would have done just as well to depict Jake as working for the Federation Department of the Exterior or Federation Diplomatic Corps.
     
  10. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    No, it doesn't. You must be thinking of the destruction of Romulus in 2387. That's something that happened in the Prime universe. When we say "Abramsverse" we're referring to the new timeline created when Nero travelled back to 2233, the timeline in which Vulcan was destroyed and Kirk became captain of a gigantic Enterprise right out of the Academy. STO does not happen in that timeline.
     
  11. Deranged Nasat

    Deranged Nasat Vice Admiral Admiral

    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    To be fair, the description for the novel does make a point of suggesting that the Federation has changed, its morals have taken a beating or been reconsidered somewhat in the name of pure survival and that Groundsk-*sigh*, Undine have infiltrated all the governments anyway. Maybe that context is making them particularly distrustful of the name. A "Ministry of Peace" in the normal UFP we're familiar with wouldn't be disturbing, it would just be straightforward, but in these circumstances...? A chaotic, bitter Federation under siege and in the midst of fighting a lengthy war? What do they mean by "peace" at this time? Negotiation with the Undine, Klingons etc...or something a little more ominous?
     
  12. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    It's just such a vague name. What's the Department of Peace do? Department of War/Defense is kind of obvious- military matters. Same with Departments of the Treasury, or Health, or Agriculture. But what does the Peace Department do? Diplomacy? Humanitarian aid? Espionage?

    It's like Google's "Don't be evil" rule. Why should you need a rule for that at all?
     
  13. Daddy Todd

    Daddy Todd Captain Premium Member

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    The great thing about a vague name like that is, no matter how the employees of the Department of Peace spend their days, as long as the Federation isn't at war, the Department can claim the credit... ;)
     
  14. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    So's "the Department of State." ;)

    It sounds fairly obvious to me -- the Department of Peace would be dedicated to conducting diplomacy for the Federation in order to avoid war. I would infer that it's a division of the Department of the Exterior charged specifically with conducting those aspects of Federation foreign policy designed to create peaceful conditions.

    Because giant corporations can't be trusted not to turn evil without a rule against it, obviously. What, Enron and AIG didn't prove that to you?
     
  15. nx1701g

    nx1701g Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Considering that the novel directly references the Department of Peace proposed as a Cabinet level position for the United States by Dennis Kucinich, I'm assuming that the author intended for it to serve in a similar manner as that theoretical group.
     
  16. Garm Bel Iblis

    Garm Bel Iblis Commodore

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    ok i started this last night.... i dunno...i'm only a few dozen pages in, it just seems irritating when such a peacenik writes a war story...Stiles is all "Boo yah, I"m a marine!" I've never met a cocky soldier like that, i dunno.

    Maybe you should follow Dennis Kucinich's example and only write about peace, Mr. Martin, you don't do war very well.
     
  17. Nerys Ghemor

    Nerys Ghemor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Kind of like Quartrich in Avatar, is what you're describing?

    Indeed, it's very irritating when people write military types as nothing but caricatures. When you've known the real deal, it rings hollow.
     
  18. Garm Bel Iblis

    Garm Bel Iblis Commodore

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    Its the sterotype that all soldiers are thickheaded grunts. I HATE it. That's probaly why i hated Avatar so much. oh well, I've put down hard cash, I'm going to press on, I'll try and be ready for the "George W. Bush Prison Planet" or the perhaps Risa has been renamed Obama. We shall see.
     
  19. OverlordSpock

    OverlordSpock Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)

    I just finished this book and it was a much more entertaining and engrossing read than I thought it would be. I'm normally more into a "normal" prose-style of writing, but in this case, the interview-transcription-style worked. In fact, for this specific story, there is no way I can see that it would have worked in another style.

    Although it was an enjoyable read, I'm glad this does not take place in the Prime-TrekLit universe. There were a few too many "really?!?" moments.

    There is no way in any way, shape or form that the Klingons would ever agree to resolve a dispute around a baseball game, especially one they weren't directly involved in. Wouldn't happen. Oh...it was fun and entertaining to read, but I still couldn't wrap my head around that idea.

    There were other little things as well:

    Kai Kira... really? The son of Picard and Crusher marrying the daughter of Riker and Troi... really?

    Those are just some examples.

    Plus, the idea of another long, costly war that challenges the Federation's very ideals...it seems to be a bit much. Yes, conflict is essential for a good story, but the Star Trek universe needs to find new sources for its conflict for a while, rather than rehashing the war theme again (and again, yes I'm aware that this is in the context of STO and not the TrekLit-verse).

    But, overall, as I said earlier, it was an engrossing read. I liked the fact that except for a few individual stories, we don't get to read about the Long War overall, or how the war was resolved. I liked the broad range of seriousness vs. not-so-serious in some of the interviews.

    I have not played the game, nor do I ever intend to, so I can't say how this might actually fit in with it, but standing on it's own, it's a fairly fascinating look at "what might have been."
     
  20. Garm Bel Iblis

    Garm Bel Iblis Commodore

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    Re: Star Trek: Online: The Needs of the Many - Discussion (Spoilers)


    sounds like fanboy wank...gonna be real hard to slog through this one.
     

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