"Stars" of the show

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Sophie74656, Dec 29, 2016.

  1. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Fleet Captain Captain

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    A common thing I've seen is that in the later season people say that Seven and the Doctor became the "stars" of the show. Personally I never agreed with this, I think there was a pretty good balance between the characters, most of them got a fair amount of screen time. Just about everyone had at least one episode devoted to them per season.

    I found a site that did a line count (seasons 4-7) and I thought the results were interesting and I thought it would be interesting to share.

    http://www.chakoteya.net/Voyager/LineCountS4-S7.htm

    I threw the chart into a spreadsheet and added up the lines. Here are the results...
    Janeway....6908
    Seven........4113
    EMH..........3772
    Chakotay...3427
    Paris..........3188
    Torres........2463
    Kim............2602
    Tuvok........2406
    Neelix........1843

    So yes...Seven and the Doctor do havd more than most, but Janeway has even more than that.
     
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  2. JonVP

    JonVP Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Surprised to see Chakotay come in 4th.
     
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  3. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Fleet Captain Captain

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    Honestly I was too.
     
  4. Finn

    Finn Vice Admiral Admiral

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    What represents a "line" and I'd have categorized those lines by relevance.

    I wouldn't count Mayweather's "aye, sir. warp 2" as much as one of Archer's plot-driven lines on Enterprise....
     
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  5. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    I'd be curious to see what the line counts are without the technbabble.
     
  6. Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME

    Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME Commander Red Shirt

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    WOW, INDEED! :)
    Janeway/Mulgrew were always the stars of ST: Voyager, no offense to some people from the cast and the studios (in fact, some executives thought that the only star of the show was... the vessel, which was pretty insulting for the actors, if you ask me, even if USS Voyager played an important part and let's be honest, it's a pretty and classy vessel :techman:) .
    -> I remember to have read that, when Mulgrew had threatened not to renew her contract at the end of S5, it was the panic on board, because with the lead actress out and consequently, Janeway killed-off, the show was over. And though the characters of Seven of Nine, mainly thanks to s4 and half of S5) and the EMH were very popular among fans, they were not enough to make them the new stars of ST: Voyager! And as we say here, "Y a pas photo (finish)!" A fair result.

    Janeway....6908
    Seven........4113
    EMH..........3772

    Even if the character of Chakotay was more passive from S4 and the arrival of Ryan/Seven on board / the boom of Picardo's character, Beltran wasn't doing so bad..., even if he is dogged by McNeil's character, Tom Paris
    Well, let's say that Beltran/Chakotay sit their third place in terms of lines of dialogues! :D

    Chakotay...3427
    Paris..........3188

    Notes:
    1) Please, not that McNeil, Picardo, Dawson and Russ directed several episodes each and consequently, their characters were less present on screen.
    2) Funny to see that though the relationship Paris/Torres was born in s4 and
    has quickly found its stride, there was a so huge gap in terms of line count between these both characters! :shrug:

    Paris..........3188
    Torres........2463

    3) What to say about Tuvok (and he is head of security! -> seen all the attacks on the ship and its crew, it would have been wise to hear him more! :whistle:) and worst, Neelix (that's what it is to spend 70% of his time with kids -> was not much to say or to do! :D). I understand why a frustrated Philipps chose to leave at the begiinning of S7... . As what it was possible to ask leaving the show before the end,
    wasn't it gentlemen?! (aka Beltran & Wang,who said that they were forced to stay to the end). :rolleyes:

    Tuvok........2406
    Neelix........1843
     
  7. Finn

    Finn Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Philips left at the end... like a couple weeks before Endgame....
     
  8. PersonalResponsibility

    PersonalResponsibility Ensign Newbie

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    Yes, Philips left Voyager at the end of season 7 episode 23, the episode is called Homestead. There's 1 episode after that (Renaissance Man) and then the 2 episode series conclusion.
     
  9. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Captain Captain

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    Neelix shoes up once in Endgame talking to Seven over screen though.

    As for lines that count versus technobabble what counts exactly as technobabble versus "lines" a lot of TNG had technobabble.

    I'd be curious to see out of all the minor characters/guest actors who had the most dialogue and screen time.

    Also stars is more than just lines recited in my book, the stars are the heart of the show, it's face to the public and the joy to the fans-In those regards Seven and the Doctor were the stars.
     
  10. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Now compare how many episodes each character had that actually focused on them. :)
     
  11. Emperor Norton

    Emperor Norton Captain Captain

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    "We're in the Delta Quadrant."

    "We're home."
     
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  12. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Fleet Captain Captain

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    In regards to leaving a show and being forced to stay to the end, the actors all have contracts that they signed. So they have to honor the terms of that contract. I think it was Ethan Phillips who said he didn't mind if his character ended up getting killed off because he had a contract for a set number of years and he gets paid either way
     
  13. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Captain Captain

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    That's a little unfair.
     
  14. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Captain Captain

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    Wait Mulgrew threatened to not renew her contract at the end of season 5?
     
  15. Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME

    Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME Commander Red Shirt

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    Of course actors sign contracts of 3 (?) years, which must be honored the time they last but a little before their terms, studios and actors (or more exactly, their agents) begin the negotiations for the renewal of contracts, which often succeed on a wage increase and/or more time to do something else.
    This time offers a "way out" as well for the actors as for the studios to stop amicably the association.
    -> as well Beltran as Wang could have taken advantge of this opportunity to leave, if they really felt frustrated by the lack of interest of their characters. Some others took the plunge before them, But no, instead of acting with responsibility, they chose to spread in the medias to say the biggest evil that they thought of the show and its producers, with the aim of getting fired (and I guess, to touch of the compensations).
    I regret that studios had proof of cowardice and kept the actors. Producers tried to punish them, by relegating them to the background but Beltran & Wang rather went out well there, in getting some good episodes and a satisfactory conclusion of their characters in the end. Terry Farrell aka Jadzia Dax in ST: DS9 wasn't as lucky as them, while she behaved rather correctly.
     
  16. Finn

    Finn Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I think it was just a rumor someone wanted to float around as season five came to close with the Equinox cliffhanger- last thing we saw made it seem one of those aliens hit the Captain, throwing her off her feet backwards....
     
  17. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Captain Captain

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    My thing exactly if they were dissatisfied they had at least 2 oppurtunities to leave but no they had to drag the show through the mud and insult their employers and co-stars.
     
  18. Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME

    Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME Commander Red Shirt

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    Absolutely. Mulgrew wanted to spend more time with her 2nd husband and her children, who didn't stop complaining about her absence.
    -> You should not forget that being the star of the show, she had to be present every day from 5:00 am until late the night, with a rather heavy timetable (shooting - even if actors spend a lot of time to wait until each grip to revise their text, hand on to the make-up, etc.... + interviews and others PR work, etc...) but until then, she has done her job without complaining. Afterward, she asked her timetable to be relieved but in seeing that nobody acted in this sense, she acted, not by threatening directly the studios or Berman but, ironically, ...by using the press by sliding (surreptitiously or not) during an interview with a journalist her will to spend more time with her family even if it involved to leave the series and consequently, to kill-off Kathryn Janeway.
    Naturally, the media hurried to resume the information and that's how CBS/Paramount and Berman learnt that they risked to lose their lead actress - and the non-renewal of her contract wasn't a threat made in the air - and of course, this time, they quickly reacted in accepting her request, knowing that without Mulgrew, Voyager was over, while they wanted to prolong the show 7 seasons, like previously TNG and DS9.
     
  19. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I remember when this line count argument came up during the original run and it still means nothing to me.


    Look at Janeway. She averaged less than a thousand lines a season, while Seven averaged more than a thousand so one would assume Seven was a bigger star than the Captain, but that wasn't true (IMHO). The EMH, looks like he averaged a little more than 500 lines a season, but he was a huge star by the end of the show. His lines count definitely increased as the seasons progressed despite the addition of Seven.

    When looking at B'Elanna's line count, you should also remember that she missed several Eps in season 4 due to Roxann's very real pregnancy. It was one of the reasons season 4 was fairly good to Chakotay despite the introduction of Seven and distraction of the loss of Kes.

    It isn't the line COUNT that matters, it's what the lines say. Did the character move the story along or did they merely stand there and state the obvious.

    At the end of season 7, we get a primer on the importance of various characters to Janeway by who's death / debility move her the most.

    Admiral Janeway gets the Captain's attention with the line "Seven of Nine is going to die! " and kept it with, "She'll die in the arms of her husband, Chakotay." But what made her join the Admiral's scheme was Tuvok's descent into dementia, a character that lost out to Kim and barely beat out Neelix in the line count battle. A character that definitely ranks both of them in star status. (Again, IMHO)
     
  20. Prax

    Prax Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Some of you may find this relevant. Here's a list of each character's number of personal episodes. This doesn't include pure ensembles, but there are some episodes that focus on more than one character, to which both characters get credit.

    Total(all 7 seasons)
    Janeway: 26
    Chakotay: 15
    Paris: 17
    Kim: 9
    B'elanna: 17
    The Doctor: 20
    Tuvok: 14
    Neelix: 11
    Kes: 7
    Seven of Nine: 18

    These numbers come out very similar for the DS9 cast except for Sisko and Kira who have 33 & 30. Each character gets between 2-5 episodes a season depending on their order of importance to the show.