Star Wars live action series: how grownup is too grownup?

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Temis the Vorta, Jun 4, 2012.

  1. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
    The problem with the live-action series.

    It's possible to make Star Wars that is "grown up" but not "adult." McCallum is right that Deadwood is outside the Star Wars brand, but doesn't need to be like Deadwood to have appeal to grown ups. The series doesn't need to be "gritty" (to use an overused term) by having the sex and violence of a cable series, and the overarching sense of doom and the futility of human existence blah blah blah.

    Star Wars
    ' essential character is that it doesn't exist in that kind of "real world." It exists in a stylized cosmos derived from myth, which has a deliberate air of unreality about it. Regardless of whether you think there's some kind of "eternal clash between good and evil" in our universe, there's one in the Star Wars universe, and in fact, that's the single defining element of that universe.

    So the Deadwood approach would be off-brand even if it were as sanitized as Sesame Street. It exists in the wrong universe.

    To have a grown-up Star Wars simply would mean more complexity and depth to personalities and politics. The OT was pretty simple (if effective) in that regard; a TV series would give you more latitude to play with. There could even be more theological/metaphysical complexity, delving more into the actual meaning of the "eternal clash between good and evil."

    The violence never needs to get worse than PG - the good guys fighting and killing actual flesh and blood beings, not just robots, but not necessarily in a graphic way. And sex has always struck me as out of place in Star Wars. Leia's bikini is about as far as they need to take it.

    Basically, take the approach of The Clone Wars and put less emphasis on action, and more on the characters and the complexity of the storyline. You could have a show that a smart eight year old could follow, but wouldn't bore a grown-up.
     
  2. That sounds... kinda awesome.

    Anyways, what you do is what Batman is doing. They release a kids cartoon (Brave and the Bold - my 3 and 5 year old nephews love it). They release a more mature Batman cartoon (The Batman, Direct to DVD movies, Timm-verse Batman, etc etc), and then they also release the adult Batman (Nolan movies) stuff. It's all about effective targeted marketing.

    Also I don't really see why they have to reach "Deadwood" levels of maturity. Hell, just hitting a Farscape/Angel/DS9/LOST level of maturity would be more than enough.
     
  3. ManOnTheWave

    ManOnTheWave Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2005
    Location:
    ManOnTheWave
    No matter what they say they want to do, it is not going to be Deadwood. If it ever happens.
     
  4. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
    Yeah, it would end up as a pathetic and misguided attempt to be Deadwood - the worst possible thing.
     
  5. cylkoth

    cylkoth Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2003
    Thank you. I was going to post something similar-namely, the original Trek was a 10pm show, that didn't stop young-ins like me from watching once it hit rerun syndication.
    The assumation that you can't be adult without tossing in cuss words and naked boobies is really tiresome. :scream: Just tell a good frickin story (that makes sense!), and everybody will line up for it.
    It's Star Wars stupid. :p
     
  6. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
    For all we know, "scruffy nerfherder" is as salacious as anything Al Swearegen ever spewed at the screen. And "sithspawn" definitely sounds nasty.
     
  7. Captaindemotion

    Captaindemotion Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 26, 2001
    Location:
    Ireland
    How do you say ''cocksucker' in Huttese?
     
  8. doubleohfive

    doubleohfive Fleet Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2001
    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
  9. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
  10. JD

    JD Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2004
    Location:
    Arizona, USA
    Yeah, I don't really see the need to take things up to a "Deadwood" level of content. Like Temis said, they just need make the stories a little more complex, and maybe get into some darker themes for it to be more "adult". They really don't need all of the sex/nudity, graphic violence, or languarge for adults to get into it.
     
  11. RandyS

    RandyS Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Location:
    Randyland
    Actually, what they need is to make the stories, period.

    After seven years, I've given up waiting for this show.
     
  12. Captaindemotion

    Captaindemotion Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 26, 2001
    Location:
    Ireland

    This.

    Is.

    Genius.

    That is all.
     
  13. Relayer1

    Relayer1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2011
    Location:
    The Black Country, England
    There was a LOT of interest in this a while ago. If they don't get it moving soon, no-one will care.

    Oh, wait...
     
  14. Admiral James Kirk

    Admiral James Kirk Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2001
    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    I'm the biggest George Lucas fan in the multiverse and even i don't buy McCallum's load. :guffaw:
     
  15. Icemizer

    Icemizer Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    I would definitely watch a Star Wars as dark as Deadwood.
     
  16. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
    I would cheerfully give it a shot. However, my hunch is that it would end up being faux-dark, a la Stargate: Universe. That show is a good demonstration that it's easier to say, "let go real dark and gritty" than to pull it off successfully.
     
  17. { Emilia }

    { Emilia } Feminazgul Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2011
    Location:
    Hippie Europe
    I'm surprised Lucas is even worried about this. "Tone" is something he hasn't gotten right in any of the prequels. He constantly mixes goofy elements with really dark elements. He can't decide what kind of story he wants to tell.
     
  18. Admiral James Kirk

    Admiral James Kirk Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2001
    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    ^ Couldn't agree less. He knew exactly what he wanted and unlike any other filmmaker out there he has the money to custom make the movie that he wants to see. Sorry you didn't like it, but don't chalk it up to indecision or ineptitude on Lucas' part.

    Besides it's a moot point. Though he remains the owner, he no longer works at Lucasfilm. Kathleen Kennedy runs the joint now. He's finally on to those smaller, personal abstract films he's been talking about for 30 years now.
     
  19. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
    Lucas is retiring - there's hope he may just turn the whole shebang over to his employees, such as the ones who are working on The Clone Wars. They've got the right idea, and get the tone just right, keeping it mythic and heroic.

    They've also got interesting ideas for expanding upon the metaphysics of the Force - the Mortis Arc is definitely the right idea, throwing out some cool ideas and awesome visuals, while not destroying the mystery by explaining everything in a straightforward way.

    All they really need to do, is to take what they're currently doing and increase the complexity of the storytelling so that it has more appeal to grownups. But Star Wars always needs to have Jedi or Force users of some sort at the core of the story, at least one character. Just having it be about gangster and bounty hunters, eh, that wouldn't work. Sounds like Firefly.

    Lucas' idea in the prequels seemed to be, to ignore the notion that Star Wars is in some mythical cosmos where there is an actual, literal, conflict between good and evil. He wanted the story to be about complex personalities and "real life" political wrangles. He even gave the Force a boring technobabble reason for existence.

    In other words, if he had succeeded, he would have turned it into Star Trek. Hey, I love Star Trek but I don't want Star Wars to be that. The more important point is, he didn't succeed, he just made a mess.
     
  20. Set Harth

    Set Harth Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2010
    Location:
    Morrowind
    Yep, no conflict between good and evil in the PT. Certainly not one with color coded weapons or anything like that, so we know who's who.