Star Trek VI: A couple of questions

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Dale Sams, Aug 8, 2014.

  1. Ithekro

    Ithekro Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Also remember that his aid didn't get very far, running into the Starfleet crewmen with phaser first. Chang was likely on the bridge of Kronos One. Gorkon was elsewhere on the ship.
     
  2. urbandefault

    urbandefault Commodore Commodore

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    It just occurred to me ... Valeris' scream and the look on her face was not pain. It was horror, when Spock mentally called her "Queen Bitch Whore." :guffaw:
     
  3. Shat Happens

    Shat Happens Captain Captain

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    I dont like it either, but the term stuck problably because it means "forced". The word itself is used in some contexts not-strictly sexual. OTOH, Writer/director Nicholas Meyer said the scene was "erotic" in the dvd commentary.
     
  4. starshipfan

    starshipfan Ensign Red Shirt

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    I'm a bit late into this thread, but I'm glad the traitor wasn't Saavik. I absolutely loved her character in TWOK, but in TSFS and TVH, they seem to have excised her Romulan half, which is one thing that presented so many possibilities.

    In any case, I agree that Valeris was a bit obvious,but it worked for me. I also, like others here, feel that Chang was on the BoP during the initial attack, then beamed back to Kronos One when a slugfest didn't happen. (And yes, it's been established that beaming can occur within a cloak.) I feel that Chang planned to wait until one ship or the other had a definite advantage - if Kronos One, he'd beam over once it wasn't likely to be destroyed and finish off the Enterprise, or if the Enterprise was winning, he'd wait until Kronoe One was destroyed, then finish off the Enterprise with the Bop. He could then salvage any records logs and claim to have been picked up from a life pod as a primary witness of the battle (altering the logs as needed to support his case.

    Lastly, is it just me, or does Spock seem to attract pretty female protoeges?
     
  5. Hober Mallow

    Hober Mallow Commodore Commodore

    There's little about rape that's sexual. It's an act of violence.
     
  6. CoveTom

    CoveTom Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The motivation may not be sexual. But the act is definitely sexual. That's what separates rape from other forms of violence. If I punch you in the face, we don't call that a rape simply because it's an act of violence. Similarly, I don't think the term rightly applies to a forced mind meld either.
     
  7. Timo

    Timo Admiral Admiral

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    ...However, "sexual" is often in the eye of the beholder - and at a minimum, it appears to suffice that the two parties involved are of different genders, quite regardless of what they are actually doing. If a man punches a woman in the face, it's violent but "potentially sexual", and the society on the average loves to cry foul. If a woman does it to a man, it's violent but "potentially sexual", and the society on the average gets a hard-on.

    Really, "rape" today serves much the same semantic role as "honor killing", in glorifying a gruesome act with the aura of something mysterious and desirable. Actual juridic or physical definitions are pretty much secondary to that function.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  8. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Simon van Gelder explained the source of his screaming during his mindmeld with Spock. Kirk's screaming while mindmelded with Spock as Kirock was also explained by Spock. The only mindmeld scream that remains a mystery is Valeris. Her scream is just there. It is implied that Spock has done something to make her scream like that, but Spock doesn't volunteer an explaination - which the shocked crew certainly would've deserved. Kirk certainly didn't order that Valeris be made to scream, if necessary.

    And even when she does scream, Spock's own reaction to it is unclear, because before he and Valeris were in sinc with their saying things at the same time. Is Spock's sort of upset look reflecting some of what Valeris is feeling? Again, it is not clear and mildly confusing because it's completely unnecessary and uncalled for, outside of a "dramatic moment," because the scene, otherwise, isn't very strong or interesting. In fact, why it didn't happen in Sick Bay, where they just were when all of this came out in the first place is another example of Meyer's sloppiness and disinterest in the reveal of this "Who Done It?" Poorly written and directed, however you want to look at it.
     
  9. EnriqueH

    EnriqueH Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    On screen, it was Shatner, Nimoy and Kelley who made the best chemistry.

    Behind the scenes, it was Nimoy, Meyer and Bennett.

    Take out any of the three, and the result is not as strong.
     
  10. CoveTom

    CoveTom Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Amen. Losing Harve Bennett really hurt TUC.