Star Trek: The Next Generation Blu-ray Audio Issues

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by TrekToday, Jul 30, 2012.

  1. Maxwell Everett

    Maxwell Everett Commodore Commodore

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    The full extent of the problem can be exposed by connecting your blu-ray player directly to your HDTV and listening to the episodes "Haven" and "11001001" with its built-in speakers. You will hear a very bad echo and/or muffling of the sound.

    And look no further that the press releases from Paramount and CBS to confirm that the problem is real and in the process of being fixed.
    :)
     
  2. Scotty

    Scotty Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Then you have a bad audio receiver. CBS has admitted that these audio issues are present on ALL discs all over the world. You absolutely can't miss the audio issues on EaF.
     
  3. Falcor5

    Falcor5 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    And even on regular TV speakers you can not miss Havens audio problems. Sounds like they are talking into a tin can!
     
  4. Scotty

    Scotty Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I have a confession to make. I watched Haven the other day and apart from the fact that the dialogue is mixed in the front channels, I only heard an echo during one scene about three quarters into the episode. Other than that, fine. I was expecting the sound to be much worse after reading the forum, but IMO the sound of Haven isn't THAT bad. Same goes for 1100101. Dialogue was wrognly mixed, but otherwise the sound was okay.

    I think people are confusing tinny sound with lower quality ADR. The dialogue and sound recording on early episodes of TNG just wasn't as good as it would be in later seasons. I don't think they can improve on the source material.
     
  5. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    Well, NOW you say something! And after CBS has spent tremendous effort and resources to take care of things! Sheessh.

    Oh, how about the fact that on my speakers the 7.1 sound channel on some episodes only seems to be coming from one of the speakers creating a very "mono" effect? Is that something I shouldn't worry about either and just chalk it up to shitty recording at the time the episode was made? Because it certainly sounds okay when I switch to the next audio channel (standard Dolby.)
     
  6. Scotty

    Scotty Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    :lol:

    Short answer: yes.

    Long answer: You shouldn't worry sbout it, you should accept that this is the best the source material can and will sound. Many people around have stated that they haven't watched TNG for a long time for various reasons. I myself haven't watched the first season of TNG for at least 3 years. That isn't even such a long time. I can imagine that some haven't watched these episodes for much longer than that. There are probably others that are watching Trek for the first time on a home theatre system. In the past 5 to 10 years the quality of home theatre equipment has improved with leaps and bounds. Modern day tvshows and movies often have amazing audio/visual presentations and we have become used to it. Now, a 25 year old show has been released on Blu and some people clearly think that it should sound like it was made yesterday. It can't. I think that perhaps due to the inherent clarity as a result of the uncompressed audio of the DTS track, people are noticing how old the show is starting to sound. The dolby track is a mere 192 kbps. It doesn't have the clarity so it would be less noticable.

    All of the above doesn't excuse the echoes or the dialogue being mixed into the front speakers. Like you I want these errors fixed. Other than that I think the show sounds great, better than I remember, but still pretty much as I remember it. And that is not a bad thing.
     
  7. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    But people aren't complaining or getting replacements because the audio sounds bad but because it was incorrectly formatted to the discs! It is an actual problem!

    This isn't a "Harumph! It sounds like this was recorded in the '80s!" problem it's a "Holy shit! The sound is actually coming through the speakers incorrectly!" problem.

    I shouldn't have to switch the audio tracks on my discs so it sounds like the show isn't coming from a tin-can. It should work perfectly as soon as I hit "play."

    Now, I'm just on a simulated 5.1 soundbar but on the default setting certain episode's sound is only coming through the center channel of my speaker. Other episodes are coming through all of the speakers of my soundbar correctly creating a dynamic, normal, sound.

    The episodes listed I DO have problems with and it's VERY obvious and it's NOT a "this was recorded in the 1980s so of course it sounds like shit!" problem it's an actual problem with how the disc was made.

    So I change the audio track to DTS and hey, guess what, it sounds normal! Sound through all three speakers just like it should be. I can't say if it sounds that much different than the 7.1 but, whatever. But it IS a problem and it IS a defect. I shouldn't have to manipulate the audio settings on my sound system in order for the sound to come out normally.
     
  8. BriGuy

    BriGuy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I have, but not from your "suggestion," which I just saw now for the first time. I haven't felt like coming back to this after those rude and juvenile posts were made directed at me.

    I came back because I otherwise find this site a source of useful information, and I was hoping to keep track of the progress on resolving this issue, as well as take part in the conversation about it.

    I talked about the issue. I offered my comments, and I also presented useful information. I hadn't been doing anything different than anyone else bothered by this problem has been doing all along.

    I have no idea how you determined my posts are "angry." That's quite a leap.

    Then, out of nowhere, I get insulted and personally attacked. Yet I get blamed.

    Whatever.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  9. Scotty

    Scotty Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm not denying that. I was one of the first around here complaining about it.

    Listen, when you say "simulated" it means that you are doing something other than listening to the audio tracks as they are intended. The 7.1 mix can be listened to with 6 or 8 speakers (subwoofer included) and the dolby stereo track should only be listened to with the 2 front speakers. If you are using the dolby sound to create a surround mix then the success of the end result will be down to your receiver.

    People here have been complaining in particular about Haven and 1100101 sounding like comng from a tincan. I'm just saying that I did not have that experience. Yes some lines of dialogue and occasional scenes have an echo (which needs to be corrected). But some people say they hear it all the time. That simply is not the case and I still believe that some viewers are mistaking 80s soundrecording for bad remastering or authoring.
     
  10. Maxwell Everett

    Maxwell Everett Commodore Commodore

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    You can only hear those issues on those episodes if you connect your Blu-ray player DIRECTLY to your HDTV (no receiver) and the main DTS-HD audio is downmixed to 2.0. If you are listening in 5.1 or 7.1 with a receiver, it will sound essentially balanced across the front soundstage and the echo and/or muffling CAN NOT be heard.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  11. Scotty

    Scotty Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Thanks for clearing that up. Obviously that should not happening. In that case viewers should be swithing to the 2.0 track.
     
  12. Maxwell Everett

    Maxwell Everett Commodore Commodore

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    Problem is, the 2.0 is lossy Dolby Digital 2.0 (192kbps)... people -- such as myself -- would prefer to listen to the main lossless audio at 5034 kbps! Thankfully, CBS appears to be fixing the issue.
     
  13. tomswift2002

    tomswift2002 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The issue lies with the extended codecs used for DTS-HD, since the core DTS track is fine, if it does exist.

    And my surround system was a top of the line model ten years ago. But I am finding that, since I'm watching the discs on a PS3 hooked upto my Yamaha system by Digital Optical which is only sending the core DTS codec (at a bit rate of 1.536 MB per second), and I usually watch all my stuff this way, with my TV receiving the video via HDMI. But I tried the audio from the HDMI (which, as far as I can tell my PS3 is sending the signal in PCM 2.0) and I did hear some muffling and echo of the audio, but that is usual when I play back other DVD's and Blu-Rays that only have a multi-channel track and get down converted too a 2-channel mix.

    But my TV also outputs that HDMI audio signal over the digital coax (by PCM) and when I try the audio in a surround mix, that is the only time that I pick up any really audio change, or even the "tin can" effect. But that's because the signal's getting digitally mixed from a 7.1 source down to a 2.0 mix with no fine tuning.
     
  14. Maxwell Everett

    Maxwell Everett Commodore Commodore

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    Can you list some other titles... I'd like to try out some other movies or TV shows that have this 5.1/7.1>2.0 problem.
     
  15. tomswift2002

    tomswift2002 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Let's see I've noticed it on

    Batman'89 (both early 2000's double sided DVD and the Special Edition DVD - haven't tested the Blu-ray, but it probably has the same sound)

    Babylon 5/Crusade (any episode)

    Goldeneye

    Dick Tracy (1990 film)

    Home Alone 3

    The Love Bug

    It's because the players don't mix the multi-tracks down correctly, and each single multi-track channel is a mono channel, so the balance's are way off.
     
  16. Pindar

    Pindar Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Hmm, I just got an email from PHE telling me their is a problem with the TNG discs and I should contact them with my purchasing details and they will tell me how to ge replacements. This doesn't fill me with confidence as I already did this, which is how they had my details to contact me. Has anyone else had this email?
     
  17. cbspock

    cbspock Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Anyone know if they have started sending out the replacement discs yet?


    -Chris
     
  18. picard_2305

    picard_2305 Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Called the number up and as I thought it is regarding the ones who bought it in the stores. The man on the phone, Ricky, said that the ones who got it through Amazon and Play have to do nothing. He also said that the stock has left the warehouse and should be with suppliers by next week.
     
  19. NewHorizon

    NewHorizon Captain Captain

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    Spoke to a representative at Amazon today and now they are apparently being instructed to 'not' exchange defective sets. So I have to send back the replacement set they sent to me that wasn't fixed, pay for the shipping, they'll reimburse me...and then they'll decide whether or not to give me a new set. What a muck up.
     
  20. Trekker4747

    Trekker4747 Boldly going... Premium Member

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    Sounds more like a fumble with Amazon. And why pay for shipping? Can't Amazon set-up the printout return label they do for all exchanges/returns?