Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies XI+' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 18, 2013.
I really wish they hadn't spoiled that "John Harrison" was an alias prior to release.
That was bad marketing.
I preferred it when he was John Harrison. They could have kept the augment angle: Make him a new generation cooked up by Marcus based on Khan and his people DNA; had him be a follower of Khan--if we had to have Khan in the movie--with Khan being one of the people in the torpedo. Or just cut Khan out beyond: Section 31 restarted the augment program, the research that made Khan was the master template that they "improved on"; Harrison is pissed at being used and is out to kick everyone's ass--maybe driven batty by the whole "superior genes breeds superior ambition" side of the process.
I would've enjoyed seeing this sort of storyline a whole lot more. The whole point of Nu-Trek was to reboot in a different timeline thus opening up the possibility of being similar to the already-made incarnations without having to recycle the storylines.
What better way to show you're really in a DIFFERENT universe than to take the most iconic and pivotal villain in the Prime universe and show he's not so central to this universe? If anything a universe without the Khan saga would truly send the message "THIS IS DIFFERENT... but we can still toss in homages you'll understand "
If I had done it: Harrison is pretty much the same, an augment--but a new generation of augments, the first of several. He escapes, his brothers and sisters are frozen and stuffed in the drone-torps, and he begins to think of himself as the heir to Khan's legacy. His DNA was modeled on Khans and improved beyond Khan's, of course he's superior to Khan, Harrison the turn King where Khan was a mere Prince. How dare Marcus and Starfleet imprison his people; how dare they hold back their rightful leaders. If I had to show Khan, after credits: A shot of a battered and beaten Botany Bay, and inside we see Khan still in cryo sleep. Just leave it there. He's out there, maybe we'll find him, maybe we won't.
Nope. It had to be Khan. This mistake was trying to hide it, especially when we all knew it was Khan a year ago.
That's some serious horseshit, man.
While an awful lot of my criticisms of the Abrams movies (both of which I found to be terrible on most levels) are because of their failings as movies, there are at least as many criticisms I'd level because the reboot films fail in their relation to TOS.
Even my wife, who is by no means anything like a lifelong devotee but likes TOS and has seen them all one to three times by now, spoke up during ID to say to me, 'This ISN'T Star Trek.' She didn't even say that during the 09, which I find a slightly worse movie personally. Cumberbatch was the reason she wanted to go and the reason I took her, but that was a waste of talent given they were trying to cram the Khan aspect in though it was hardly needed, if at all.
Nah, you could pull it off. Have Harrison been a clone of the original, or a Marcus bred augment brainwashed/deluded into thinking he's Khan. It's merely a question of how twisty you want to make the journey.
And that's needlessly convoluted.
The casual fans I went with - different ones in each of my five cinema visits - all said of STiD, "Wow, they really recaptured TOS".
So basically, "casual fans" have opinions that are as varied as more hardcore fans. Newsflash!
P.S. This isn't aimed at either of you as a snark, just that the two extremes make a nice comparison.
My point in posting.
I just finished watching it and I gave it a D+
Biggest reason I didn't care for it was it is barely recognizable (IMO) to Star Trek, every time I saw something new and "improved" I just cringed.
From the military dress uniforms with hats no less..really?
To the communicators and even the new boots, ughh what were they?
I guess my big thing is I never liked the Abrams style Trek, he always seems to try to copy and then one up everything that already happened in the previous series.
The other thing I don't like is the over the top-ness, don't get me wrong, I love a good action movie but you can't throw a huge budget at something and expect it to be good.
I could go on and on but TBH I don't feel like typing that much.
I can't really take you seriously with that avatar. Just saying.
Pot meet kettle..Just saying...
Pike had a similar hat in "The Cage"/"The Minagerie" CLICK! And did the grey uniforms really look any more militaristic than the ones seen in Wrath of Khan and beyond?
I think he has the best avatar on the forum .
That being said, I didn't really mind the costumes in Star Trek Into Darkness, except for Khan's cliched leather trenchcoat look.
I dressed like that when I was 14 and obsessed with The Matrix.
Which means, coming from 1996, Khan was ahead of the fashion of his time
I guess I didn't like them because they looked very Nazi German-esk.
Based upon the hat created for Pike in "The Cage". You can see it sitting on his desk in the first pilot.
According to the Federation Reference Series, the hat went with the dress uniform seen during Pike's Orion fantasy:
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