STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 18, 2013.

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Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    18.7%
  2. A

    20.7%
  3. A-

    13.1%
  4. B+

    11.1%
  5. B

    8.0%
  6. B-

    4.2%
  7. C+

    5.4%
  8. C

    5.1%
  9. C-

    3.5%
  10. D+

    1.5%
  11. D

    1.6%
  12. D-

    1.3%
  13. F

    5.7%
  1. The Naughty List

    The Naughty List Working the Pole Moderator

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  2. judgeroy

    judgeroy Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Look, I understand that some people are up in arms over the fact that they chose someone without darker skin and in some way I can see why they are. However, take a moment and see this from the other side as well. Considering the fact that the writers are taking enough of a risk tweeking a sitting President about some of his policies (ie using drones to kill enemies both foreign and domestic, including citizens without due process), do you really think that they are going to stoop to "whitewashing" for PC purposes? I don't think so. I really believe they had someone picked out, it didn't work and they liked how Cumberpatch did the role. Nothing more, nothing less and in reality, I don't think it done any less justice to the role in question.
     
  3. thumbtack

    thumbtack Commodore Commodore

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    I wonder who paid her to read that, and I wonder who deemed him too unsightly for video.



    This has never been the reason they're upset about Khan. Read what they were saying when they thought Del Toro had the part.


    .
     
  4. judgeroy

    judgeroy Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Thumbtack, I have read this thread from page one, and that is the conclusion I have come from it. Yes, there are a few who feel otherwise, however, the overall theme has been that the writers "whitewashed" the role. I really don't believe they did. DelToro didn't work out, Cumber did the trick for them, simple as that.
     
  5. Shaka Zulu

    Shaka Zulu Commodore Commodore

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    ^Hey, all I did was show why other people objected to it.:vulcan:
     
  6. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    Deliberately so.

    How would you have coped in Shakespearean days when all parts in a play had to be performed by men?

    When actors start training, they learn accents, they practise pretending to be younger and older than their age, they learn how to apply makeup to emulate all manner of humanity, and they may be required to pretend that they have lost one or more of their senses.

    The lead role in the stage play "Whose Life is it Anyway?" was a paralyzed white male sculptor who spends the whole play in a bed. Essentially a taking head. It wasn't deemed essential to employ a quadroplegic actor, and in fact the acting performance was deemed even cleverer because the actor, Tom Conti, had to remember not to move his limbs for two hours. After a lengthy run, the role was recast as a white female (Mary Tyler Moore!), and the play had another lengthy run. (When husband and wife team, Laurence "Sybok" Luckinbill and Lucie Arnaz starred in a national tour of the play, they actually rotated playing the patient and doctor.)

    Suddenly, some people are saying that ethnicities can only be played by actors of that ethnicity? Why apply this ruling only to skin colour? Where do the rules stop, and who's making them?

    Whatever happened to the actor doing the most impressive audition getting the part?
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2013
  7. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Wait, so Ophelia was played by a dude ?
     
  8. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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  9. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Imagine what people would be saying if Khan 2.0 had dark skin.

    "OMG Abrams reinforces terrorist stereotype!"

    "Abrams re-enacts 9/11 in Star Trek movie!"

    "Star Trek should know better!"


    Call me when they turn Sisko white. You might have something worth ranting about.
     
  10. Shazam!

    Shazam! Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I imagine fuck all would have been said.

    Not that I give any kind of shit about Khan's skin colour mind.
     
  11. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    I don't. When people look for a reason to be outraged, they usually find one.
     
  12. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    Totally agree. We've seen people ranting about JJ and Bad Robot since before the first teaser trailer for the 2009 movies was attached to the front of "Cloverfield".
     
  13. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Of course you do.
     
  14. Ryan8bit

    Ryan8bit Commodore Commodore

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    It's not Shakespearean days. It's not the 1960s. That's the point.

    The strangest part about this comment is that he pretty much did. Khan crashed his spaceship into San Francisco, killing who knows how many people (which was just brushed aside really), yet the movie was dedicated to 9/11 vets? That particular part strikes me as somewhat odd already, and then you say that all it takes is for Khan to be brown to make that actually controversial? Ok...
     
  15. Franklin

    Franklin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    If people wanted to be outraged about terrorist stereotypes, then why would the color of Khan's skin matter? "Khan" itself is a common Muslim surname and title. Folks who wanted to could run with that. They just have to forget the Noonien Singh part of his name or believe he converted to Islam. As Belz said, there are people who can find any reason to be outraged about anything.
     
  16. Crisp Crinkle

    Crisp Crinkle Admiral Admiral

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    This is outrageous.
     
  17. Opus

    Opus Commodore Commodore

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    Wait, back up. I'm confused.

    Who are we saying should be offended and outraged by this movie now?
     
  18. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Everyone should find a reason.
     
  19. Opus

    Opus Commodore Commodore

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    Some already had before the movie was even made...
     
  20. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    So, suddenly, all actors must restrict their skills set? Where do the restrictions end? Is the new rule skin colour and ethnicity only, or is it every other human variation?

    For centuries actors have used a huge range of chameleon-like skills, but now they must remain within their own physical type?

    Marina Sirtis - a British actor of Greek descent, based in USA, and known to us for playing a half-Betazoid alien - recently accepted a role in "NCIS", Orli Elbaz of the Israeli intelligence organization, Mossad. Sirtis uses yet another accent not her own, expands her skill set, and is quite convincing. But she should have stepped away from the part and let it go to a genuine Israeli actress?

    One of the most praised stage roles is "The Elephant Man" by Bernard Pomerance, which won a Tony Award for Best Play in 1979. The production opted not to recreate John Merrick's physical deformities with makeup but to have the leading actor (including both Mark Hamill and David Bowie) play the role barefaced, so that Merrick's humanity, not monstrosity, would be emphasized. (I guess you'll say this isn't 1979, but acting without specialized makeup is a specific acting skill.)

    Acting also comes from within. Physical appearance is just one element, and just because a particular acting performance is going to be on the big screen, why should we suddenly start restricting the actor's craft in one category?

    I'm still not understanding why Benedict Cumberbatch has done a disservice to all swarthy male actors of the world by accepting the part of John Harrison, nor why JJ Abrams has committed a crime by hiring who he felt had given the best audition.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2013