STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 18, 2013.

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Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    18.7%
  2. A

    20.7%
  3. A-

    13.1%
  4. B+

    11.1%
  5. B

    8.0%
  6. B-

    4.2%
  7. C+

    5.4%
  8. C

    5.1%
  9. C-

    3.5%
  10. D+

    1.5%
  11. D

    1.6%
  12. D-

    1.3%
  13. F

    5.7%
  1. Pro Populo

    Pro Populo Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I feel like that as well (though my vote was more in the "B" range). I think STID very much succeeds as an incredibly fun spacey-wacey action-Jackson blockbuster, but like ST09, it does not hold up very well under intense scrutiny. That, of course, turns off a certain set of fans. Me, I think Star Trek should be fun, because that is, in fact, how it started: as a space-set adventure show. But as a fan, I also very much believe in the franchise's overriding ethos of telling big, idea-based stories, which is where I felt STID fell a bit short. I definitely didn't find it to be a failure, mind you, but I feel like a bit more polishing to the script could have brought that balance you speak of.

    For me, the Trek film that comes closest to achieving the cerebral vs. action balance is probably TUC. Its political allegory is not so subtle, to be sure, but I feel it's woven in quite well with the story, which has stakes for the characters that make it involving for the audience addition to throwing in some (reasonably) thoughtful commentary on the early uncertainty of post-Cold War international relations. I feel like Trek could do something similar with terrorism today, and had a good chance with STID, which did include aspects such as the militarization of Starfleet, etc., but it didn't all quite come together as well.
     
  2. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Your opinion aside, and although in retrospect it's odd to not have them meet face-to-face, I think it actually works in the movie's favour, and most people don't seem to mind.
     
  3. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    There have been no "big ideas" in Star Trek movies that are any more relevant to the current day or as substantive as the political/moral positions expressed in STID. I'm not sure that Trek has staked out a position on an issue that's strayed further from the safe and generic than this movie since perhaps "A Taste Of Armageddon," and that's a long time.
     
  4. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v169/Odowankenobi/neilrolleyes_zpsba0e8b91.gif

    [Converted to link. Images should be hosted on web space or an image-sharing account belonging to you. - M']

    There a many successful films with less action and more substance.
     
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  5. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I think ST09 had the "dooooooood Im frist!!!" factor going... :lol:
     
  6. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

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    True, this wasn't cerebral. But it came close to character moments juxtaposed by action moments... which is as close as you can come in this box office environment to what you want.

    The cerebral thing with Trek will have to be in a TV show, I'm afraid.
     
  7. Ovation

    Ovation Vice Admiral Admiral

    What was it that Dennis Bailey guy used to say? Oh yeah. Absolutely Right. ;)
     
  8. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah I wonder where Dennis went? ;)
     
  9. Mach5

    Mach5 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    QFT :techman:
     
  10. Borgminister

    Borgminister Admiral Moderator

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    :lol: Neil needs to be in the next ST movie!

    We are talking about Star Trek here, right?
     
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  11. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    And even then, I'm not sure in the current state of things on TV that such a show would be particularily cerebral. It might try to sell itself as such, however.
     
  12. Squiggy

    Squiggy FrozenToad Admiral

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    That seems like a shitty thing to do to people.

    "Don't know what's going on? Send us 19.99 and we'll eventually send you a tape of the backstory long after the movie has left the theaters so then you can buy the tape for THAT, watch them in order in 6-12 months, and then finally understand why everyone is so upset."
     
  13. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    TWOK clearly explains everything you need to know. Enterprise found the Botany Bay, Khan tried to steal the ship and kill Kirk, Kirk exiled them on a green planet, and the green planet turned into a desert.

    Seriously, it's not that hard.
     
  14. throwback

    throwback Captain Captain

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    A substantive moral/political debate that would work best with Khan is over the belief that humans can engineer our bodies to be better than they are. The question becomes then, who would be the engineers and what would be their moral/legal obligations to society? And, how would we engineer ourselves, through natural or artificial means? (Some believe that in time humans may become an amalgamation of both the organic and the synthetic.)
     
  15. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    No, that's skiffy fluff. Important, relevant issues are those that affect the way human beings actually live in the world right now. Ruminating about the ethics of future possibilities in so narrow a sense is entertaining for a debate club but doesn't really touch people's experience.

    One could debate the ethics of eugenics in the original "Space Seed," but that was a pretty safe topic at the time since the writer would ultimately come down on the side of "well, they're not really superior anyway because we can kick their asses" - there'd been rather a bit of a dust-up along these lines called the Second World War which had formed what was acceptable public opinion about this kind of thing.
     
  16. Lonemagpie

    Lonemagpie Writer Admiral

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    I'd love to grade it but...
    Fuck cunt arse bastard motherfucker - I just discovered this fucking minute that our local fleapit had Into Darkness this week, without having advertised in advance, and the last fucking showing finishes in 20 minutes. Cunt fuck motherfucker. And from tomorrow it's back to pish for the blue-rinse crowd with The Great fucking Gatsby. Cunt.
     
  17. Squiggy

    Squiggy FrozenToad Admiral

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    At least you're handling the news like an adult.
     
  18. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Precisely. I always introduce people to Trek with TWOK and that's never been a problem.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2013
  19. throwback

    throwback Captain Captain

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    I was thinking about how Khan might be used as a villain. As I don't understand the word "skiffy", the criticism falls short of convincing me that the issues I raised weren't fit for an action-adventure. Then I looked at the box office results for "Gattaca", and that convinced me.

    About people's experiences, how many people have been directly impacted by a drone strike? And, of those people, how many would have seen this film? I would think the number would be small.

    If you are speaking about people's experiences, how about a film about a society that is increasingly becoming aware of your activities and the loss of anonymity and privacy in that society? There is an active debate about the XBOX 1, because some of the features associated with this machine are raising concerns about privacy. Or is that too intellectual?
     
  20. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Who the hell would be confused by that? Khan and Kirk DO speak to each other on viewscreens. (And besides, there's other films - like The Fifth Element - where the hero and the villain never communicate AT ALL, and I'm not aware of any mass confusion over that issue...)

    And there was a practical reason Kirk and Khan were never together in TWOK - the same set was used for both the Enterprise and Reliant bridges.