STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 18, 2013.

?

Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    18.7%
  2. A

    20.7%
  3. A-

    13.1%
  4. B+

    11.1%
  5. B

    8.0%
  6. B-

    4.2%
  7. C+

    5.4%
  8. C

    5.1%
  9. C-

    3.5%
  10. D+

    1.5%
  11. D

    1.6%
  12. D-

    1.3%
  13. F

    5.7%
  1. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2013
    Location:
    CommishSleer
    I think it would have been more in the spirit of Star Trek that Khan stayed in alliance with Kirk and that maybe it was Marcus who compelled Khan to do the killings. And that in the end Khan volunteered his blood to save Kirk.
    Then they could just let Khan and his crew go in the crippled Vengeance because like Kirk and co maybe Khan learnt a lesson.
    Well of course they would write it a lot better and less lame than I described.

    And I'd even probably like Marcus to be less villainous and more pressured by having to defend the Federation from Klingons, Romulans, time-travellers etc. And reluctantly sacrificing Kirk and his crew rather than seeming to take some satisfaction from it.
     
  2. Tommunist

    Tommunist Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2012
    Location:
    Otisburg
    I didn't say it was! I fact, I hoped my last paragraph of that post reflected that I occasionally have to remind myself of that fact. I guess I was making "meta" commentary on the whole "you could not clearly see what I saw, what are you blind?!" faction that has graced comment sections on places like Slashfilm, Trekmovie, Deadline and the like. And that applies to some who enjoyed or disliked the last movie.

    I'm happy to say that doesn't seem to happen here, at least not without moderators who keep it civil.

    An example of such civility that comes to mind easily, Therin, are some of the conversations between yourself and Christopher on the Literature board where two people who obviously have a lot of knowledge and Trek can have a discussion debating the finer points without it blowing up! I don't mind "colorful metaphors" themselves in bulletin board discussions, but get a kick about people who can at least back up their claims with how they perceive the evidence before us.

    In fact, that type of conflict is what TNG worked very well in, it's entertaining to watch, and we remind ourselves that there are more than one way to be "right", and maybe we all have it a little "wrong". Though not at the forefront of STiD, the questions raised regarding the legality and/or the morality of the characters' actions in the film (drone strikes, killing without a trial, buildup of military in the name of protection, pro-active and reactive philosophies to those who would harm us) are nonetheless there. Within the torrent of non-stop action, those concepts were addressed, and that can make for a good film, especially a Trek film...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 25, 2013
  3. Tommunist

    Tommunist Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2012
    Location:
    Otisburg
    Well, perhaps the writers could've taken the risk; it's nice to be surprised like that. In any event, Khan may not be able to help it that's he's an over ambitious super-man who is compelled to use his superiority to rule and/or destroy. The "nature/nurture" debate gets a bit muddy when Khan is a genetically modified or created wholly test tube creation that was given his abilities and traits by possibly good intentioned, but flawed 20th century humans. The drama of these concepts can be compelling, but probably more so suited to a Trek TV show rather than the big-budget action movie version of it (not said in a derogatory way, just the nature of a film to has mass market appeal)

    But I, (and my party I attended with) were at least able to feel empathy for his plight about having his crew used against him. My suspicions were that Khan had contempt for all the 23rd century people he came across, just some more than others!
     
  4. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Location:
    Europa
    I'll bit: What plot holes?
     
  5. publiusr

    publiusr Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    The TOS Scotty would have had no problems with new torpedoes.

    In truth, the modified (suspended animation) torpedoes need to be called drones--at least we know the JJprise can deliver a full broadside. I assume the neck torps are TOS ball lightning blobs

    Now I actually identified with Admiral Marcus a bit, the speech about who is going to protect starfleet"...you?"

    I think Kirk took that to heart.

    Having Spock and Kirk swtich roles (Khan's healing blood was telegraphed early so I wasn't really worried--but the scene worked until the "Khaaan" bit).

    I was hoping Khan might actually be a good guy at the end of the movie and serve on the Enterprise, finally giving us closure to Space Seed. Khan would be given a new world and no one dies.

    I loved Enterprise in the ocean. The do anything ship.

    Saw the NIF chamber for the warp core http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility

    The only thing I hated was the Vengence's sound effect as it overtook the Enterprise. What was that? A motorboat?

    Khan and Spock have similar strength, so I liked the fight.

    Saw a Kazon/Trabe ship hover at Earth--modified by Eaves?

    Now the JJprise looks to have a more extensive impulse deck
     
  6. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    May 19, 2013
    Location:
    In a finely-crafted cosmos... of my own making.
    Woah. Just returned from seeing the movie again. I'm glad I did. Plot makes more sense now that I know what I'm looking for. We enjoyed it very much (me and the wife).

    And I couldn't spot anything besides the impulse deck and nacelle fins that are different at the end. We didn't get to see the deflector, however, the only other thing that was massively damaged in the movie.
     
  7. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Location:
    Europa
    There is this:

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Ríu ríu chíu

    Ríu ríu chíu Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Location:
    Mr. Laser Beam is in the visitor's bullpen
    I just saw STID and I loved it.

    I do find myself hoping that they don't use Khan again for awhile, though. Let him stay a popsicle. He got what he deserved, in the end.
     
  9. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    May 19, 2013
    Location:
    In a finely-crafted cosmos... of my own making.
    Broken link.

    EDIT: Not sure I see it properly. Is that an added detail on there ? Anyway, very minor.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2013
  10. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    England
  11. GMDreia

    GMDreia Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2007
    Location:
    SF Bay Area
    Who wants to bet that the next time khan is taken out of cold storage, it's because KIRK needs him and needs to make a deal with the devil?
     
  12. Madderz

    Madderz Cadet Newbie

    Joined:
    May 25, 2013
    Location:
    UK Sheffield
    I went to to see this last week as my 'birthday treat', and if i'm totaly honest I was massivly disapointed :(
    It's not so much that it was bad, just the fact that there was soooooo much missing!

    If this is Star Trek for a new generation, where were the back storys?

    I found it as entertaining as i did frustrating lol
     
  13. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    May 19, 2013
    Location:
    In a finely-crafted cosmos... of my own making.
    Where was the back story in TOS ?
     
  14. throwback

    throwback Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 27, 2011
    You want backstory? Read the comics. Read the apps. (I am probably missing something.)

    In this new age of entertainment, the people involved are expecting that people have a familiarity with other products, so as to have a fuller story of what is happening. If you did what they expected, you would have read a comic series and played a video game, and two references in the movie would not have come out of the blue. They are awarding you for your loyalty to the brand with these Easter eggs.

    There are surprises in the comics. According to one issue, this Federation in the alternate universe achieved what the one in the prime hadn't done by 2260. The Federation spans 8,000 light years and has 150 members.
     
  15. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    England
    ^I just take that to mean that Federation-Prime has been stagnant for 100 years. It's something I can very easily imagine, going by Picard's ultra-pretentious monologues during early TNG.
     
  16. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Location:
    New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
    "Wile E. Coyote. Super-Genius."

    Still never caught that roadrunner, though.

    As hard to write it here as it is for the guys writing for TV. :lol:

    I do get weirded out by the odd accusation that my various (I thought innocent) posts reveal my "hidden agenda". So hidden, it's even hidden from myself. Still never worked that one out. :techman:

    And yes, it's also tricky if you've been living with a ST truism for four decades and you finally find out it's not necessarily the only interpretation. Or when an innocent typographical error in the ST Encyclopedia becames a mandated change because novel authors of a particular era were told to use the ST Encyclopedia as the definitive guide for all spellings.

    But that's all part of the fun of being in a fandom.

    I disliked "ST V: The Final Frontier" and a lot of early DS9 and VOY, but I stuck with them through (often) multiple viewings because even really "bad" ST can have little gems to enjoy - and most ST withstands repeat viewings, with new insights waiting to be discovered.

    Always a no-win scenario for the writers.

    Had STiD had few or no easter eggs whatsoever, you can bet this board would be maligning Bad Robot for "lost opportunities".

    * "You could have toyed with the fans more by giving Carol Marcus a hairstyle that immediately reminded us of a previous canon character, such as Elizabeth Dehner!"

    * "That trader vessel could have been confiscated from a known trader, such as... Harry Mudd. Or his daughter. Or some K'Normians from TMP."

    * "Talking about traders, you could have dropped a hint about Cyrano Jones' wherabouts. And he could have brought on board... tribbles!"

    * "You could have been really brave and made John Harrison reveal that he was... Khan!"
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2013
  17. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Location:
    Europa
    Not that minor. The dome structure above the bridge-deck is much more visible from this back view now after the refit.
    Compare it with a shot from '09 where it is nearly flush with the structure behind it:

    http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/xihd/trekxihd1006.jpg

    I not 100 % sure, but I think they changed the height of the bridge-deck for that refit. Or something else.
     
  18. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    May 19, 2013
    Location:
    In a finely-crafted cosmos... of my own making.
    Yeah I saw that after my edit. Maybe another starship simulator on the BluRay so we can check. :)
     
  19. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Location:
    Europa
    I hope there are interviews with the ILM guys soon. I'd love to know what else they changed. :)
     
  20. trevanian

    trevanian Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    FXGUIDE.com has already got article, interview & podcast up. I don't think CINEFEX comes out for another month. No mention of anything interesting FXwise in the icgmagazine.com piece.