STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Agent Richard07, Apr 18, 2013.

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Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    18.7%
  2. A

    20.7%
  3. A-

    13.1%
  4. B+

    11.1%
  5. B

    8.0%
  6. B-

    4.2%
  7. C+

    5.4%
  8. C

    5.1%
  9. C-

    3.5%
  10. D+

    1.5%
  11. D

    1.6%
  12. D-

    1.3%
  13. F

    5.7%
  1. section9

    section9 Commander Red Shirt

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    Just back from seeing the film. Gave it an A-.

    I think it had a decent story. They didn't give enough of a reason why Khan was a Sahib Brit (they could have put in a bit about Section 31 doing Facial and Voice Reconstruction surgery on him while he was under to give him a completely new identity in the 23rd Century). So Khan's backstory isn't quite laid out, and his need for revenge isn't quite as compelling as the Montalban's Khan was against Kirk Prime.

    It may have been in an objective sense, but that needs to be laid out for the audience in dialogue, and it really wasn't. Weak Sauce.

    Transwarp beaming? Why have Starfleet?

    I was very satisfied with the philosophical case that was being made in the film against the militarization of Starfleet and the argument against preemptive war. The writers did do a good job implying that, with the destruction of Vulcan, the War Party appears on the ascendance in the Federation.
     
  2. mattman8907

    mattman8907 Captain Captain

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    Nightowl posted this on the one year gap thread and i wanted you all to think about it.

    he said
    since we all know that david was born in 2261 according to memory alpha, is there a remote possibilty that this could be true?
     
  3. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    It's a new timeline. All bets are off, methinks.
     
  4. flemm

    flemm Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Agreed wholeheartedly. I do like all the characters, but too many dudes :techman:
     
  5. Unicron

    Unicron Continuity Spackle Moderator

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    Saw it today and enjoyed it. Most of it was actually considerably better than I was expecting.
     
  6. section9

    section9 Commander Red Shirt

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    Part of the problem? Too long between films.

    Like I said in another thread: this should have come out last year.

    Cumberbatch was superb, but there's not enough establishment of his motivation, nor of why he is "Khan From Harrow".
     
  7. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Last year ? If this were a Japanese franchise, we'd be up to 5 films by now. ;)
     
  8. Squiggy

    Squiggy FrozenToad Admiral

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    Commander Sitsoddly chimes in:

     
  9. ScottDS

    ScottDS Captain Captain

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    Just got back from the film and my thoughts aren't quite organized... :)

    On the plus side, man did this movie look beautiful!! I'm a 3-D skeptic but, aside from maybe one or two shots, I thought it was well done. And I liked a lot of the character interactions and humor - not nearly as bad as the worst reviews made it out to be.

    On the down side, the writing.

    What was the point of rebooting the franchise if they were just gonna bring Khan out again? A Khan who acts nothing like Khan, with none of the nuance, or romance, or charisma. (And I say this as a Cumberbatch fan.) Why didn't Kirk and Co. look him up in the library computer? (At least tell us if the records were wiped out by Section 31.)

    And I'm sorry but the filmmakers can't use "It's an alternate universe!" as an excuse every time. Someone else pointed this out: while the timeline is used to set up certain plot elements, it's not like it's driving the characters and informing their decisions. "I wonder what my counterpart would do in this situation."

    If they were gonna steal from a previous film, why not a lesser one? Why not do Star Trek V with Cumberbatch as Sybok and the crew could learn a lesson about worshiping false idols? I have to believe there was at least one superior idea that these guys came up with that, for one reason or another, was stuffed in a drawer.

    There was no reason the villain had to be Khan and no reason for Carol Marcus to be in the film. They could've been anyone. I would've been happier if Cumberbatch had been one of Khan's men and maybe the real Khan would be revealed at the end, setting up the next movie.

    I was entertained but shouldn't Trek aim for something higher than low-hanging fruit? And the theme is undercut by the plot: Khan should get a trial... but he doesn't! And since technically, this is the "second" movie, things like Kirk's death/rebirth and Spock's "KHAN!"... these guys didn't earn it yet.

    Jeff Goldblum in Jurassic Park sums it up best:

    "...it didn't require any discipline to attain it. You read what others had done and you took the next step. You didn't earn the knowledge for yourselves, so you don't take any responsibility for it. You stood on the shoulders of geniuses to accomplish something as fast as you could, and before you even knew what you had, you patented it, and packaged it, and slapped it on a plastic lunchbox..."
     
  10. Squiggy

    Squiggy FrozenToad Admiral

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    Because Star Trek V sucked? Because there was no redeeming feature to save from that movie?
     
  11. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

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    ... if I wanted to see attractive people do interesting...

    You get the point.
     
  12. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It's just the basic problem of reboots that fuck with the originals. THAT "confuses the general audience".
     
  13. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

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    I'd love to see Jonathan Frakes direct another Star Trek movie, eventually. I think he did a bang-up job with First Contact, and the best he could with Insurrection. I still want J.J. to direct the third installment, though.
     
  14. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

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    No.
    If people can keep track of all the reboots/restarts in the comic-book universes, they will have no problem with two versions of Star Trek.
     
  15. ScottDS

    ScottDS Captain Captain

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    I think there were ideas from that movie that could've been salvaged and presented in a different context.

    But some things, like Kirk's "I need my pain!" speech... they couldn't do that because the characters haven't reached that point yet.

    And it was a rhetorical question. :)
     
  16. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

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    Yeah, the two timelines are different enough that they won't be confused. Now, there are folks who aren't too familiar with Star Trek, and they might be a bit confused (understandable, of course), but most folks should get it okay, or at the least, a little exposition will take care of that.
     
  17. Admiral Buzzkill

    Admiral Buzzkill Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The notion that a reboot like this "confuses the general audience" is nonsense of the tail-wagging-the-dog variety. Very few people in the general audience will be confused because - Shocker! - they've never seen The Wrath Of Khan or given whatever they've heard about it more than a passing thought.

    No one's interested in salvaging stuff from a twenty five year-old bomb.
     
  18. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    STV has the quality of a good TOS episode. If you say you hate STV for it's silliness, plot holes, camp and visual effects, then you surely must hate TOS to death.
    All moments between Kirk, Spock and McCoy are pure gold in this.

    The scene in which Sybok shows them their pain, and Kirk's "I need my pain" is one of the greatest scenes in the Trek films.
     
  19. Belz...

    Belz... Commodore Commodore

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    Are you kidding ? It's the most unintentionally funny movie in the franchise. It's also pretty intentionally funny in my view, and the main character interaction works. Otherwise, garbage.
     
  20. ScottDS

    ScottDS Captain Captain

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    I have a soft spot for it, especially that scene.

    But one could ask the same question about any remake: why remake so many good movies when there are plenty of bad ones (or at least seriously flawed ones) that could be remade?

    And again, I was simply thinking out loud. :)