Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies XI+' started by Admiral Buzzkill, May 23, 2013.
Pretty much, yeah.
Killing Kirk permanently?
That would be one way, yes.
The destruction of Earth would be another good one - but, like killing Kirk for real, I think we can all agree that it just ain't gonna happen.
Gotta have someplace for everyone to run back to at the end of the film, after all.
Yes, and Ricardo Montalban playing Khan was the height of subtlety. Seriously, he and Shatner were in a "lets see who can overact the most" contest all throughout that movie. Cumberbatch was fantastic, as was Montalban. I'll see your facial ticks and raise you an evilgasm.
Evilgasm! Haha that really made me laugh!
I don't think that killing off a major character is an unreasonable plot twist - Spock died once. I wouldn't expect it to be Kirk - but that would be the kick in the pants! This board would EXPLODE as well as the brains of Trekkies all over the world. If there's a chance there may not be a Star Trek (X)IV, producers may go big and deal with it later if necessary.
Please, no Borg. If you take the Destiny books into account, I think some important things were going on with them at this time and it would be interesting to see a big-screen rep of those events - but not the time or place.
Klingons - Logical choice, I love em, but I don't expect Abrams and Co to take the obvious track. I do expect them to be a big part of the next film in some way, regardless of the plot choice. They HAVE to. Klingons ARE Star Trek.
The Gorn and Tholians make more sense to me as potential Starfleet adversaries in a new film. You can do some great stuff with effects these days that would really bring visual life to these species, and they are ambiguously represented enough in canon that writers could have a blast with characters from those races. Inter-species tension is a huge theme in Star Trek, no matter what series, and I would like to see Starfleet take on the galaxy rather than individuals specifically (such as Nero or Khan). People seem to want to see a variety of TOS-era races - a theme of interstellar diplomatic tension would grant this wish and has a lot of potential for a dramatic, action-filled storyline.
I stopped reading up on this thread on the 14th page, so if I'm just restating anyone else's thoughts, I apologize.
I'm hoping the next movie gets away from the "big bad villain with super duper bad ass starship threatens Earth" plot that we've seen now for the past few movies. It's getting repetitive at this point. Instead, I'd like to see a movie that features real exploration and strange new civilizations.
^^^ Indeed - it's been a formula staple throughout Trek movies from the beginning, although sometimes without an actual villain.
The Motion Picture - V'Ger, a massively large vessel, built by living computers and digitizes ships and whole worlds down to the molecular level threatens Earth with enormous planet bombs.
The Voyage Home - Massively large probe disables vessels of all kinds and threatens Earth using climatic disasters.
First Contact - Borg Attack on Earth with a cube bigger than all defending Federation starships combined, led by a newly-created Borg Queen. (note this is the first instance of an actual humanoid villain associated with a large ship attack on Earth)
Insurrection - Not so much an attack on Earth, but here we have a main villain (several actually), flying ships a lot bigger and potentially more powerful than the Enterprise.
Nemesis - Shinzon and his fanboy Scimitar with a copious supply of thalaron radiation that could wipe out a whole planet (Earth) in a matter of seconds and a jillion disruptor and torpedo launchers.
NuTrek1 - Nero and his fanboy Narada with his "mining drill", planet-sucking "red matter" and a jillion-and-one Borg-enhanced weapons. Destroyed Vulcan and planned to do the same to Earth.
NuTrek2 - Khan & Admiral Marcus and their uber-fanboy USS Vengeance. God only knows how many weapons that thing had. Not so much a direct threat to Earth, but the resulting war Marcus and Section 31 were trying to initiate with the Klingons using Kirk as a catspaw would have become a problem for Earth eventually.
Not too bad in the early days, especially when there was no "real villain" to over-do the threat to the protagonists with a super-weapon, but it has lately gotten a bit old.
There is no chance that they would use Khan again in the next film. That would be ridiculous. They just showed him asleep at the end to suggest he could still be a part of Trek in the future but I doubt we'd see him again in the Abrams franchise.
The next film will be an original story but it may involve the Klingons aswell as Abrams has been indicating that Klingons are posing a threat, I think they will feature in the next film. The Enterprise has taken quite a beating in the last two films in the next film would like to see it dishing out some beatings of its own.
How about this for a scene in the next film:
The Enterprise responds to a distress call from a planet. The Klingons are on the surface and attacking the inhabitants. Kirk wants to lead the away team but Spock politely reminds him that its too dangerous for him and his place is on the bridge. For once Kirk agrees to stay and lets Spock take the landing team (showing Kirk has become more mature and listening to rules now).
After a few minutes, Spock contacts the ship to tell them they have come under heavy fire from the Klingons and they are pinned down and that two officers are already dead. Kirk tells the bridge crew that he cant stand by any longer and proceeds to beam down. Sulu points out that he should stay behind but Kirk tells him that he cant do nothing while his people are in danger. (This shows his care for the crew). Kirk takes another crewmember down with him. Ensign Evans (Yes this is Charlie Evans) in this universe he's a Starfleet officer and a new addition to the Enterprise, he hasn't got any mental powers yet). He would be played by a young handsome actor and would flirt with Carol Marcus to Kirk's jealousy. Kirk and Charlie would charge their phasers as they prepare to beam down to the surface. Sulu is commanding the bridge while Chekov reports that he's picking up strange readings just as a massive ship decloaks in front of them. Chekov reports that it's a Klingon battle cruiser. "My god!" says Sulu and tells Chekov its time to find out what the new enhanced weapons can really do. It would then cut to a massive space battle between the Enterprise and a powerful Klingon battle cruiser whilst on the surface Kirk, Spock and others take on the Klingons in phaser fire and hand to hand combat.
It would be good to introduce some new alien species and another clever idea would be that a side affect of Kirk being revived through Khans blood would have enhanced his physical strength proving him able to physically compete with Klingons. Not sure if this would be permanent though. Also Kirk is still trying to romance Carol while competing with Charlie but then Kirk also meets a woman belonging to the new species they encounter.
Charlie may or may not become evil in this film but he may encounter aliens in this film which give him new powers which will corrupt him and make him evil for the next film.
What do people think of these ideas??
I just hope that it is a truly original story that doesn't involve the use of ANY prime-universe characters outside the Enterprise crew or recycled plot lines. Otherwise, why not just make a new series that regurgitates all the TOS plots? It would probably be cheaper to produce and accomplish the same goals.
As long as we get to see a decent space battle with the Enterprise and some D-7 battlecruisers, I'll be a happy man. I'm not keen on the idea of Kirk being enhanced with Khans blood though
In the new Abrams film it seems like things happen for a reason and things have a knock on effect for the next film like the destruction of Vulcan making starfleet more militarized and discovering khan quicker. What if Khan's blood transfusion to Kirk did have an unexpected side effect. Im not saying he'd be a superman to the level of Khan but it may lead to slightly increased strength which would then give a plausible reason for why Kirk is able to physically go up against a Klingon. In the original series and movies he was able to fight Klingons way too easily when it was specified that Klingons were x10 the strength of humans.
Im all for seeing a massive space battle in the next film. Pretty sure its going to happen, all these films are blockbusters and going to contain a lot of action scenes. But so far Abrams has just shown the Enterprise having its ass kicked, I would like to see this newly upgraded Enterprise dishing out some hurting bombs of its own!
Klingons are not nor have they ever been 10x stronger than humans. Even Vulcans are only 3x stronger than humans. Klingons probably only have a very slight advantage over humans.
I think the general misunderstanding about Klingon strength came about in TNG, whenever a baddie alien came on board, Worf was sent in, only to have his ass promptly handed to him to the abject horror and surprise of his crewmates who clearly expected him to easily handle the situation. He was nothing more than a visual guage to the audience to show how super-strong some enemy is, and also implying that Worf should be able to easily dish it out to any conventional non-adversary without breaking a sweat.
That, plus the seemingly natural "berzerker" aspect of Klingons in hand-to-hand combat as seen in both TNG and DS9 may give the perception of superior strength.
Except that they didn't slaughter the crew of DS9 in "Way of the Warrior", which is what the outcome should have been, especially in Ops, an obvious primary target of the boarding parties.
Into Darkness was the most financially successful overall and second most profitable movie (after TMP) in Trek. Bringing back Khan for more makes financial sense.
BUT, I suspect Cumby's rumoured role as the big villain in Star Wars VII, VIII and IX will prevent his return to Trek.
I'd love to see Benedict return as Khan in ST3, but as a secondary villain with the potential Klingon storyline. He was one of the best things in STID and one of my favorite Trek baddies of all time already.
No, I don't want Khan to be a villain again. Make him a hero. Or, well, at anti-hero. He killed Admiral Marcus for betraying him and his people are safe; he has no reason to hate the Federation or Kirk in this timeline. I loved Kirk and Khan reluctantly working together in ID. I want more of that.
^I'm fine with that idea too, I'd still like him in there as an unstable element to the story lie you suggested, but he's Khan, he's a badass and he's great to watch, I'm all for it.
Separate names with a comma.