Star Trek and Homosexuality

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by jpch, Mar 8, 2012.

  1. DAYoung

    DAYoung Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne, AUS
    Yes, it's a silly conflation: committing to one gender and committing to one person. Not the same thing.

    Having said this - and speculating wildly - it is possible that, given the stigma associated with homosexuality, some strongly extroverted types were more willing to express their same-sex desires. And strong extroversion, from memory, often comes with an increased likelihood of straying.

    This does NOT mean bisexuality equals lack of commitment. It means that in more conservative societies, only the most extroverted are willing to reveal their bisexuality. And they're also more likely to be the ones with roaming eyes.

    But as I said, I'm speculating wildly...
     
  2. Miss Lemon

    Miss Lemon Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2012
    Location:
    Miss Lemon is chasing dwarves in Middle-earth
    Bisexuals who are in longterm committed relationships are usually viewed upon as either gay or heterosexual depending on the gender of their partner.
     
  3. DAYoung

    DAYoung Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne, AUS
    That sounds about right.
     
  4. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Location:
    The glorious Shetland Isles!
    Oh crap! Yes of course it was.

    I was getting myself confused with "The Outcast". Don't know why.
     
  5. USS KG5

    USS KG5 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2004
    Location:
    England's green and pleasant land.
    Got blown into a bit of a media storm, as another poster said it was touched on slightly on the DVD.

    It was actually one of the most open minded episodes trek did on the subject. It was never even mentioned they were both women, so it could be implied that all the characters had no issue with same sex relationships.

    It really does surprise me people actually HATE so much, if two guys want to get together it doesn't do anyone any harm, live and let live. I'd have thought this was fairly fundamental to the Trek universe, at least in the TNG era.
     
  6. Deckerd

    Deckerd Fleet Arse Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2005
    Location:
    the Frozen Wastes
    The TNG era wasn't ready for that sort of thing. I'm surprised it didn't crop up in the later manifestations of the show.
     
  7. Sindatur

    Sindatur The Grey Owl Wizard Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2011
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    The Mirror Universe Homosexuality, was actually more of a slap in the face then anything. The Mirror Universe is evil and twisted, so, it's OK to show same sex attraction (since only evil and twisted people do it :rolleyes:), but, even then, it was only the women, never saw any indication of men hankering for men.

    Rejoined, was handled very well, though, IMHO.
     
  8. DAYoung

    DAYoung Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne, AUS
    Honestly, Garak and Bashir should've had a fling. Everyone can see it.

    And by 'everyone', I mean everyone important. And by 'everyone important', I mean folks who agree with me.
     
  9. Sindatur

    Sindatur The Grey Owl Wizard Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2011
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    Including Adrew Robinson, who played it that way, and was actually told to tone it down by the Powers that Be
     
  10. Temis the Vorta

    Temis the Vorta Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 1999
    Location:
    Tatoinne
    Garak was gay. Bashir didn't really seem to be. Not sure a fling would have made sense but to make it more obvious that Garak was gay (there were plenty of hints) would have been fine.

    I used to wonder if the story about Dukat and Garak's feud might involve some incident when they were younger that Dukat was eager to squelch by having Garak exiled someplace where nobody important in Cardassian society might hear the sordid story. ;)

    Which is just a roundabout way of saying, if you're going to have a gay character, it would be a good idea to make use of it somehow. Just because Fed society is beyond being bigoted about homosexuality does not mean all societies are. It doesn't seem likely that Cardassian society would be enlightened in that regards, since they aren't in so many other ways.
     
  11. The Castellan

    The Castellan Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    May 2, 2004
    Location:
    The Plains of Cydonia
    Naw, the Trek fandom's got a lot of close minded folks, not just about sexuality, but on a whole range of subjects.
     
  12. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2002
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    Just another reason to love Andrew Robinson, IMO.
     
  13. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2007
    Location:
    inside teacake
    Bashir seems generally confused about a lot of things and I think he should have had the opportunity to work out some of that confusion with Garak.
     
  14. Ian Keldon

    Ian Keldon Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2011
    Wrong episode. I'm talking about the first Trill episode. The ambassador had a fling with Dr Crusher as a male then got put in a female host.

    Didn't they? It's implied that they did at least once (off screen).

    Mirror Ezri was also lesbian.
     
  15. Ian Keldon

    Ian Keldon Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2011
    On the contrary, Phase II did it exactly the way I feared they would: big, bold, flag-waving, "look...a GAY scene". Gerrald went out of his way to insert "fluff" scenes to showcase the homosexual relationship and draw attention to it.

    Which is why it came out as preachy and generally cringe worthy.
     
  16. Coloratura

    Coloratura Snuggle Princess Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2002
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    I just found it sexy (and sweet), really.
     
  17. DAYoung

    DAYoung Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne, AUS
    Possibly. Though it didn't strike me as any more 'flag-waving' than Kirk's romantic plots and sub-plots. Slightly more tender than some, if anything.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2012
  18. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Per Ardua
    TNG actually ended up being more conservative than TOS when you look at the hurdles each had to go through to get stories on the air.
     
  19. Joel_Kirk

    Joel_Kirk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2009
    Location:
    In the Joel Zone, identifying as Sexually Fluid.
    I too felt that there was "flag-waving" (and Trek has done that in other cases)....where I felt it could have had the characters and scenes immersed in the story as everyday people and situations...

    (And, this is coming from a bisexual African-American male).
     
  20. Deckerd

    Deckerd Fleet Arse Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2005
    Location:
    the Frozen Wastes
    Is it wrong of me to think that Gark and Damar would have been hawt?