Spock's line *Major Major Spoilers*

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies XI+' started by Jon1701, May 10, 2013.

  1. Jon1701

    Jon1701 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    For me, that was one step too far.

    Everything up till that point was right on the line of acceptability for a Star Trek movie. I am happy to let everything else go. The gaps in logic, playing loose with trek canon and treknology. Its the big, summer, blockbuster version of Star Trek. As long as it's a great ride I'm not going to be too hard on it.

    Even the scene itself - I don't mind the idea of riffing on the original scene but to copy it word for word? Its hard to feel emotionally involved in a scene while at the same time replaying wrath of khan in your head.

    And then, "the line".

    About 3 months ago I went to a screening of Wrath of Khan and whilst it was a friendly croud, there were plenty of people who I'm not sure were Star Trek fans laughing ironically during Kirk's "Khaaaaaaan!". Laughing. Laughing out loud.

    This may happen again. Only this time, it might be us. :(

    I honestly didn't know whether to laugh or cry. They took a risk, and for me it was too much. I enjoyed the film. I liked a lot of it, but the final third and this scene in particular left me cold.

    Sorry JJ.

    This was a mistake.
     
  2. anotherdemon

    anotherdemon Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I don't really have any feelings positive or negative towards it. On one side, it can be seen as cheesy, on the other it's a good little nod to how things are playing out similarly but different, like with Mudd's shuttle (it wasn't destroyed).

    I think some emotional outburst was needed by Spock -- he's been having a terrible time in the past two films.

    I can see why it'd be disliked, of course.
     
  3. teacake

    teacake Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    As I said in the review thread, when I heard him yell Khaaaaan the thought running through my mind was "I want to slap JJ in the face".
     
  4. Jon1701

    Jon1701 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    Was it meant to be a nod to us? :wtf:

    It felt like they were taking the p*ss (which they surely cannot have intended)

    They must have known it would be a risk. I'm not sure we are at "These are the Voyages" levels but I don't think we are far off.

    Maybe when I watch it a second time it will improve.
     
  5. USS KG5

    USS KG5 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I thought it was a bit too far, but lets not over-state it, the TWOK references stopped there, and they only went a bit OTT.
     
  6. donners22

    donners22 Commodore Commodore

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    The scene had already lost me completely; that moment was just the topper. Really, having gone that far, it had to end that way.
     
  7. Mr_Homn

    Mr_Homn Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    can you all please stop being so ambiguous and explain what you are talking about?

    Spock yells Khan?
     
  8. M

    M Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    Exactly. In the most unintentionally laughable way imaginable! I loathed that moment. First they re-enact more or less the whole last section from TWOK (only a trillion times cheaper, since there's no doubt in the viewer's mind that Kirk will be saved by Khan's blood anyway), and then they top it off with Spock yelling Khaaaaaaaaan!!!

    Boy, what were they thinking? That's even more ridiculous than Picard driving a dune buggy.
     
  9. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    It was unbelievably awful, and took me right out of the film. I couldn't believe they did something so stupid.

    Had Spock gone ice cold and not said a word, walked to the transporter and turned into a ragemonster when he got face-to-face with Khan, it would have been fucking brilliant. Instead they went into bad fanfic/parody mode:(

    Spock could even have yelled "KHAAAAN!" as he fled, as a "come back here and fight me you coward" -type thing. That would have worked too.
     
  10. Oso Blanco

    Oso Blanco Commodore Commodore

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I also didn't like the way it was executed. It was too fast to have an actual impact ... and Quinto is no Shatner ... :vulcan:
     
  11. trekkiebaggio

    trekkiebaggio Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    In and of itself I didn't mind the yell, because it works quite well in the context, but the fact that it came after that scene was just too much.
     
  12. Oso Blanco

    Oso Blanco Commodore Commodore

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    As I have just written in the big spoiler thread, I really hope they are done with the TWOK references once and for all! Another "needs of the many" or "always shall be your friend" speech, and I'm gonna throw my pocorn at the screen!
     
  13. USS KG5

    USS KG5 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I thought the bit that was a shame is that STID (I think you can get a cream for that) is a very good film in its own right, it didn't need to refer so much back to a very good trek film from 30 years ago.

    That said, nostalgia is a big part of a lot of the Hollywood reboot craze, it was all kind of inevitable, like the weird cameos at the end of 21 Jump Street, for example.
     
  14. tippy

    tippy Ensign Red Shirt

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    Why would Spock do that? He didn't yell when Nero killed his moms.
     
  15. MrPointy

    MrPointy Commander Red Shirt

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I'll admit that I laughed.

    This thing is that I was really affected by Kirk's death scene, even though it was obvious he was gonna be revived by Khan's magic blood. It was very well played between Pine and Quinto and Giacchino's score is very affecting. So when KHAAAAAAAAAN! happened it was... cognitive dissonance.

    I still liked the movie a lot though.
     
  16. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    The explanation was given in the dialogue in Mudd's ship.
     
  17. M

    M Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    Just a general observation about the Khaaaaaan!!! line: Both, fans who liked/loved the movie and those who didn't, seem to be united in their dismissal of that line. It's seldom that a thing about a movie – especially a Trek movie – is able to evoke such a universal dislike. Somehow that's really fascinating. :lol:
     
  18. Phily B

    Phily B Commodore Commodore

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I def thought it was the worst part of the movie, especially since the death scene was very good.
     
  19. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I thought Spock had a lot more reason to dislike Khan at that point in STID (when he yelled 'Khan') while Khan really had not begun to hurt Kirk in TWOK (when Kirk yelled it)
     
  20. beamMe

    beamMe Commodore

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    Re: Spocks line *Major Major Spoilers*

    I don't dislike it.
    Perhaps it is there not only as a reference to TWoK but also as a mirror to Nero's "SPOOOOCK!!!1!!1!", showing that loss after loss after loss can drive anyone absolutely bonkers.