Sigourney Weaver talks Alien 5... again...

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Candlelight, Jun 5, 2014.

  1. solariabsg25

    solariabsg25 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    No it was thier secret-agent infiltrator, 00-107...

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  2. Foxhot

    Foxhot Commodore Commodore

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    Gorman's not in much extra footage. I don't think the company chose him for his flaws or attributes especially. But I think James Cameron decided to have him represent an ''arc-ed'' personality, a negative character who went out positively....the reverse of Paul Reiser's Burke, perhaps.
     
  3. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ^I doubt the company chose him at all. He's a Colonial Marine, not a company employee. Remember that it wasn't a company mission, Burke was just there as the Weyland-Yutani rep as they had co-financed the colony, presumably alongside alongside the United Americas government under the ECA.

    I'd say it's more than likely that it was considered to be a routine mission to fix a down transmitter, with only an outside chance that a hostile organism may be involved. Hence the rookie Lt, only one squad and no back-up.

    Despite impressions to the contrary, Weyland-Yutani did not rule the cosmos...they just had a sizeable investment in most of it.
     
  4. mos6507

    mos6507 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    You can analyze this from a world-building perspective, where it all has to make logical sense, or you can analyze it from a storytelling perspective. Most films are story-centric and not slavish to internal logical consistency. Things happen because it helps tell the story the filmmakers want to tell. Good stories do this without the plot feeling too contrived.

    Gorman (at least at first) is the vehicle in which Ripley can ascend to Rambolina status. The scene where Gorman freezes up is one of my all-time favorite scenes in movies. How often have you seen characters do stupid stuff and shouted at the screen like a back-seat driver? Ripley, by virtue of her limited role, is expected to sit there and watch the marines get slaughtered, just as we are, as the audience. Instead, at that pivotal moment, she takes command of the APC and rescues the battered marines. It's a fist-pump moment. Because of her act of bravery, from that moment onward, the marines abanoned rank and started following her instead. I don't know if you'd call it a trope or not, but you can see shades of this concept of "unofficial" leadership taking initiative and winning loyalty via bravery in, let's say, Braveheart. I'm sure there are many other examples.

    Ripley was a survivor in Alien, but she only became a superhero in Aliens. And that's the moment she made that key transition.
     
  5. solariabsg25

    solariabsg25 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Yeah, in the first two movies, Weyland-Yutani were pretty much just another multinational company. Hell, according to Burke even Ash, a major cog in the big plan in Alien, was made by Hyperdyne, a different company.

    Since then especially in the games, they've become this strange all-powerful company. This has even gone so far as to the fact that the Prometheus website in their pre-release publicity did a timeline which effectively stated that Weyland was responsible for the invention of absolutely everything in the Alien movies, including hyperdrive, hypersleep chambers, autodocs and synthetics.
     
  6. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Admiral Admiral

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    Ripley's ascendancy to the de facto leadership role is helped along my Gorman being knocked out and incapacitated.
     
  7. solariabsg25

    solariabsg25 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    And something that endears Gorman to me is even when he was back on his feet, he didn't automatically attempt to re-assert his command. He had screwed up, and he knew it.
     
  8. Foxhot

    Foxhot Commodore Commodore

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    Quite the contrast to ALIEN, in which she refuses Dallas's and Lambert's requests to bring Kane aboard. She was ultimately right, but, at least compared to her ALIENS persona, rather cold. But, like Gorman, she's coming to her personal arc.
     
  9. Admiral James Kirk

    Admiral James Kirk Writer Admiral

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    I think Ripley's decision was cold but it was taking a toll on her. I thought she looked pretty upset that she had to be an asshole in that situation and say no. Turns out she was right. If not for Ash the only member of the Nostromo to die would have been Kane.
     
  10. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Alien 3 is defiantly the point where Weyland-Yutani became this military-industrial shadow government of outer space. For one thing, I think logically they shouldn't have had a direct (and evidently exclusive) downlink from the Sulaco's flight recorder. In Aliens, the ship is meant to be a military transport, not some PMC ship.

    In Aliens Burke tries to implant Newt and Ripley as a way to circumvent ICC quarantine, yet in 3 you have "real" Bishop with his own military ship complete with squad of mercs & science team apparently confident they can just grab a live specimen and do as they please.

    Personally I put it down to the Alien 3 writers not having as firm a grip on the lore as Cameron and just going with the grossly simplistic "company = bad guys" set-up.
    In the process missing the point of "the company" in the previous films where it's just an entity made up of people, some of them greedy and both willing and able to remotely cause death carnage. Not because they're evil or because there's this BS shadowy master plan to take over the universe. No, it's to increase profits and hopefully get themselves a nice fat bonus, maybe even a seat on the board with a cushy retirement package.

    I'm sure whatever bureaucrat wrote "Special Order 937" went to his or her grave having no idea what happened to the Nostromo and not caring. Mostly just glad the insurance people never pinned the asset loss on them.
     
  11. solariabsg25

    solariabsg25 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    You're right, Alien 3 started the rot - the fact that Hadley's Hope was a Weyland-Yutani colony was a coincidence as it was, but I guess explainable as the company had in the past at least spent a bit of time studying LV-426. But then the nearest planet that the Sulaco lifeboat heads to is also a Weyland-Yutani prison planet?

    And then, Weyland-Yutani are presented with having military assets, including a Conestoga-Class starship, and M41 pulse-rifles. Why would they have needed USCM involvement to investigate Hadley's at all?

    Actually, it would have been better for it to have been another rival company in Alien 3 instead of W-Y.
     
  12. Marsden

    Marsden Commodore Commodore

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    It would have been better if Alien 3 didn't suck.

    Sorry if that's overly harsh, but none of the movies really have been any good after Aliens. Saying they shouldn't have made W-Y the master of everything is a minor problem compared to the movie as a whole, but it is a valid point.
     
  13. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I actually have a bit of a soft spot for Alien 3 despite it's many many many MANY flaws, of which, yes, the Company thing is probably the *least* odious.
    Mostly I think my affection for it is down to the visual aesthetic, overall tone and Ripley's internal character development. By comparison, Resurrection felt like a bland retread. I mean at least Alien 3 *tried* to be something unique.

    As previously stated, I don't count the AvP films in this. Those are part of the Predator franchise as far as I'm concerned and those films have problems all of their own.
     
  14. mos6507

    mos6507 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The film needed him as an antagonist early on, but when the aliens took over, it allowed Gorman to redeem himself by him finding his humility and ultimately sacrificing himself.

    A lesser film would have kept him as a nag the whole way through, or at least until he got killed unceremoniously at some point (as a moral "punishment" for the blood on his hands by botching the initial raid.)

    Bill Paxton made a much more entertaining nag with his "Game over, man!" hysterics.
     
  15. Foxhot

    Foxhot Commodore Commodore

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    On an ALIENS cast commentary from 2003, Michael Biehn commented how after Paxton is eliminated, ''the movie just dies!'' Paxton replied ''Really? I thought it got better!'':cool:
     
  16. Dennis

    Dennis The Man Premium Member

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    That the routine procedure for repair and maintenance on comm equipment parsecs away would consist of sending out a team of soldiers on a sleeper ship makes...no sense at all, really.
     
  17. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well the point wouldn't be to repair it for them (presumably they have engineers of their own) it would be to verify the status of the colony since direct contact was lost. Doing so with a trained military unit is just prudent.

    Like I said, if they were *really* expecting trouble and bought into Ripley's story, they'd have sent a larger force and probably a full science team too.