RLM - Half in the Bag does STID [SPOILERS]

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by MrPointy, May 25, 2013.

  1. Shazam!

    Shazam! Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yes, but you have to feel that the plot is silly enough for you to warrant breaking it down in such a manner.

    You're right, you could do the same to TWOK or Iron Man 3 or whatever but the point is, they didn't, because presumably they enjoyed those movies : /
     
  2. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    I think if you spend forty-five minutes reviewing a movie, you enjoyed it on some level. Just like I don't believe the folks who constantly post how much they hate Abrams Trek really hate it. :shrug:
     
  3. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    criticizing a film for silly elements of the plot is fine, but doing so in a deliberately exaggerated way for comedic effect and then pretending that you're making a serious criticism of the film is pretty dumb. I liked STID a lot, but I certainly don't think it's above criticism.

    My favorite film of the original series is TVH and my favorite film of the TNG series is STFC, and I certainly would admit that they have silly plot elements, but I wouldn't do some segment of a review where I pretended to be summarizing the plot, but was actually just being goofy and ridiculous to make it seem incoherent, and then use THAT to show that the plot actually WAS incoherent. (I think that was a run-on.;))


    STID had some problems(not too many, though), but an incoherent plot wasn't one of them. It moved quickly, but it wasn't hard to follow.
     
  4. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    well remember that these guys are internet reviewers who have a business model as well. They want to make their reviews a certain length to get traffic. RLM's SW prequel reviews were very long, but I don't think Stoklasa actually liked them that much.


    What I don't get though is how he could have liked STXI better than STID. Too me, STID is a big improvement, and if you already liked the first one, then he should have liked the second.
     
  5. Shazam!

    Shazam! Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    How else should they do it? The interwebs is already choc-full of wordy reviews and analysis.

    At the end of the day they're still going to think the plot was silly regardless of how they present their views.
     
  6. M

    M Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Nonsense. I loved the first one! But this one was a big letdown for me. So what exactly are you saying? :confused:
     
  7. StarMan

    StarMan Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'm in the same boat. We must be defective.

    Confirmation bias? Seriously? :lol: If you're going to play that card, you need to apply it across the board. How many individuals here have invested a couple of years championing the movie - long before they'd even seen a frame?

    Still, great to see those wonderful trailers again. Man, they got me pumped for this movie.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2013
  8. Ryan8bit

    Ryan8bit Commodore Commodore

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    They did say in the review that they did enjoy it on some level. And they also praised JJ Abrams.
     
  9. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well I wrote "to me," indicating that it was just my opinion. You're free to prefer STXI to STID if you like, it's just that STID had a much better story, a much better villain, and much improved characters. But if none of that matters to you...;)
     
  10. Alex1939

    Alex1939 Captain Captain

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    This RLM was a rare miss for me and I love RLM usually. It's always great to get a new Half in the Bag or Best of the Worst episode.

    I did really like their discussion about Khan. How in space seed Kirk beat him up with a metal tube. But now Khan is basically one of the X-men. Had me rolling on that bit.
     
  11. neoworx

    neoworx Lieutenant Red Shirt

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  12. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    It makes about as much sense as a 20th century human being able to run a starship in a few hours, magical terraforming technology, that Khan would search everywhere but the transporter room on Regula One or the fact that Khan could find and locate the Genesis torpedo but didn't beam Kirk up from Regula and kill him.
     
  13. The Baby Stig

    The Baby Stig Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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  14. Vyse

    Vyse Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Very true.

    Kahn's plan depended on Kirk being so rusty that he would not have raised shields to another federation ship not responding to hails. We aren't talking firing on it, just raising your shields to protect yourself. Project Genesis is so important and dangerous, yet there is no security at all there. The oldest, lamest conceit in all of Star Trek, "The ship is the only one in range. They have limited supplies or not prepared, but going anyway". What if two ships showed up to fight Khan? He would have been screwed then. Enterprise's sensors work, when the Reliant's does not. A nebula that screws up sensors being conveniently close to the science base. Khan has gotten older, yet the other Augments haven't? Chekov was not on the ship during Space Seed, yet Kahn remembers him. Didn't the Reliant notice that there was one less planet in the Ceti-Alpha system in the beginning of the film? The Enterprise would have been able to get far enough away from the explosion with impulse power at the end of the film.
     
  15. Tom Servo

    Tom Servo Commodore Commodore

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    Well my favorite goofy thing about TWOK is the fact that while on a minor training cruise, the Enterprise just HAPPENS to be be the closest ship to Regula 1, and the Reliant, and Khan, even though it really had no reason to be. I mean Khan's plan really would have sucked if Kirk had been relegated to some desk at Starfleet command.

    I'm sorry I cannot take someone seriously when they'll overlook the Ceti Alpha 5/6 issue. I mean its a planet that's missing....a whole planet. Not only do they miss it, they mistaken if for another one. It's the action around which the whole story begins to unfold. If you're willing to overlook that, but not some of the plot conveniences and issues with the Abrams films, they you're just a hypocrite.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2013
  16. Vyse

    Vyse Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Also, wouldn't Kirk have let the rest of Starfleet know about Kahn? Something like "Hey there is this really dangerous guy named Kahn on that planet. You may not want to go there, just an FYI".
     
  17. sonak

    sonak Vice Admiral Admiral

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    yeah, these pretty much cover it. TWOK has tons of silly plot elements, but what it has over STID is a thirty-year-old nostalgia filter and the original cast and all their goodwill behind it.(Again, I love TWOK, but I don't let my enjoyment of something interfere with my ability to see flaws in it. TWOK is very well-written from a character and thematic perspective, but it has some pure silliness to it.
     
  18. Phily B

    Phily B Commodore Commodore

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    All these little nitpicks are doing my head it, people are using these 2-3 tiny plot details to shit on the movie. It's pathetic. TWoK relies entirely on the gross incompetence of Kirk when meeting the Reliant.
     
  19. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    Ain't pretty? Well, I've seen fan-viewpoint reviews which got a lot uglier than that, but it does tend a bit to checklist-y and nit-picky.

    One thing: while several here and on other forums may early on have suggested Javier Bardem as a possible Khan, I can't recall reading any serious reports that he'd been in consideration by the filmmakers at any point for any role in what became ST Into Darkness.

    One more: Brighton? Other than the fact that Cumberbatch used to visit his grandmother's house there, I'm afraid I don't see the significance.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2013
  20. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Well, that and Khan suddenly turning ass-stupid when he has Kirk cornered on Regula. He could've beamed him up and beat the shit out of him or sent a photon torpedo down and literally buried Kirk.